Creed versus other IG Commanders

[cracklingvoice]

I'm starting up my IG pretty soon here, and am a little conflicted as to the commanders I am going to use. I'm going to run a CCS, but I keep feeling the urge to use Creed. I like the model and his capabilities, but I'm not yet sold.

So, who wants to sing the glories of Lord General Ursarkar E. Creed, the Lord Castellan of Cadia?

[librisrouge]

His capabilities are great but you pay a premium for them and you're still looking at a five man squad (baring the three advisors.) This makes him expensive and easy to kill. A chimera with camo is almost required to give him some durability. In addition, he needs enough infantry in the list to take full advantage of his order giving abilities and other stuff. He was better last edition, imo, and I still considered him to expensive to be worth it.

[Lukash_]

If you like Creed, I encourage you to look up General Myndoras Odon from IA11. He's much cheaper and nearly as effective, though he comes with a prebuilt squad (which can still take advisors.)

[march10k]

I love the idea of creed.  But...in the end, I'm a tanker.  I have enough infantry to field four 50 man platoons, but I almost exclusively field 2-4 mechanized veteran squads and TONS OF TANKS!  I would wholeheartedly recommend creed to anyone fielding an infantry-based guard list, but my warlord is (looks up) Erwin Rommel Knight Commander Pask...

[Myrkul]

I love the idea of creed. But...in the end, I'm a tanker. I have enough infantry to field four 50 man platoons, but I almost exclusively field 2-4 mechanized veteran squads and TONS OF TANKS! I would wholeheartedly recommend creed to anyone fielding an infantry-based guard list, but my warlord is (looks up) Erwin Rommel Knight Commander Pask...

I only run the tank command squad with pask in a punisher and frankly, he brings a lot more to the table imo. 20 rending shots at BS4 is nothing to sneeze at.

 

He's a big point cost (400 average for the squad) but totally worth it.

 

Creed IMO is only worth it if you're running a stationaty gun line with a lot of blob/HWT to make full use of orders. I think CCS are just to vulnerable; five T3 guys with 4+ sv, guess whats getting blown of the map first turn. Yarrik in a blob is almost a better option IMO(and a lot cheaper considering).

[HenricusTyranicus]

 

I love the idea of creed. But...in the end, I'm a tanker. I have enough infantry to field four 50 man platoons, but I almost exclusively field 2-4 mechanized veteran squads and TONS OF TANKS! I would wholeheartedly recommend creed to anyone fielding an infantry-based guard list, but my warlord is (looks up) Erwin Rommel Knight Commander Pask...

I only run the tank command squad with pask in a punisher and frankly, he brings a lot more to the table imo. 20 rending shots at BS4 is nothing to sneeze at.

 

He's a big point cost (400 average for the squad) but totally worth it.

 

Creed IMO is only worth it if you're running a stationaty gun line with a lot of blob/HWT to make full use of orders. I think CCS are just to vulnerable; five T3 guys with 4+ sv, guess whats getting blown of the map first turn. Yarrik in a blob is almost a better option IMO(and a lot cheaper considering).

 

Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't he technically also have rending on the heavy bolters?

[Myrkul]

No. Only the Punisher cannon and the Exterminator Autocannon get rending; and does not effect secondary weapons (since its a weapon rule and not a unit rule; i wish though).

[HenricusTyranicus]

You're right, my mistake.

[greycat]

Creed is amazing in apocalypse games with tons of infantry but otherwise there are better HQ's to take if you want to play competitively. I would rather take Pask, yarrick, straken or a generic CCS. I do like the model but I would use him as a regular commander instead.

[WarriorFish]

I agree, Creed is cool but was better in the previous codex. Now he feels a bit too expensive for such a small squad so you've got to spend more to try and protect your investment. If you like the model there's nothing stopping you from using him for a normal commander (not like you'll be festooning him with fancy weapons that need representing much). Then you can give Creed's rules a run out to test when you have the points. As you may have guessed he works best in an army that can make good use of orders :)

[CoffeeGrunt]

The Apocalypse Formation for Creed is excellent. All the Advisors plus him and Kell in a Bastion. Gets infinite range on his Orders, the Master of Ordnance gets D3+1 shots, and you can keep him right at the back.

[cracklingvoice]

I'm a big fan of General Odon, having looked him up. He does seem like a better use of points at the 1500-2000 level, and still being able to take the Regimental Advisors is helpful. Plus, I'm wanting to do an air assault IG army, so his ability to use a Valkyrie or Chimera as his dedicated transport is a bonus. I would probably use the Creed model to represent him in my CCS.

One question: I don't see the "Incoming!" order in the codex or IA11 ... any pointers on where to find it?

[morroccomole]

I like the idea of Creed and Kell together for foot lists. Kell using his leadership for orders tests on HWS seems to be a bit of insurance. And even creed's ability to have two warlord traits makes it four times as likely (with battleforged) that you'll get the 12" LD bubble warlord trait. It's definitely a win big/lose big strategy, but we're the Guard. We do or die, for the Emperor!

[Myrkul]

I guess my question is this; are you looking to be tournament quality/competative with IG; or just play IG for fun?

 

If youre just playing for fun; run creed. If your going to do something like ITC; Id look at a different warlord.

[WarriorFish]

Isn't "Incoming" an old order that makes the unit go to ground with a +2 to cover saves? I don't have my old codex to hand to check but I'm pretty sure that's it.

[Lukash_]

Yeah, IA11 came out before the Guard 6th edition 'dex, which dropped the "Incoming!" order. In my games we houserule that he has current Guard orders.