The Beast Arises

[JH79]

There haven't even been any notable video games tackling dinosaurs in recent history, probably not since Dino Crisis jumped the shark and went to space. At this point I'd kill for a survival horror experience with FarCry level vegetation set in a Jurassic Park...

I love dinosaurs! As an 8 year old kid i used to pour over a board game called Lost Valley of the Dinosaurs, it was awesome and still resides in my parents loft! As for video games, how's about FarCry Blood Dragon? I'm playing through that at the mo when time allows, it's got bad-ass cyber T-Rex Dinosaurs!

This must be why i like The Damnation of Pythos so much, the indigenous life on the world of Pandorax paint a real world nightmare that only the Iron X'th could crush which such visceral intent! Right, that's my next HH re-listed lined up for the rest of the week! Glad i made time to drop by tonight lol

[DarkChaplain]

Blood Dragon was fun, but done way too quickly (even for 100% completion) and only had that one pony in its stable. I'd like to see multiple species, and a more serious, horrifying take. Getting stalked by raptors in thick foliage and all that. Games like ARK don't scratch that itch due to how wonky everything feels and the gameplay direction for multiplayer survival crafting doesn't work for me at all.

 

But I'm with you there, I really enjoyed Pythos. Pandorax, too, had awesome fauna. I was also thrilled by Flesh of Cretacia's mega dinos that just wouldn't die

[bluntblade]

 

I will never understand how Kyme managed to make Astartes vs dinosaurs so underwhelming.

 

 

Because dinosaurs are an oversaturated and rather cliche monster-type used in far too much media, like zombies, meaning they are, generally, dull.

Heresy!

[HeritorA]

Beheading ending was horrible due to the timejump. It's lost all it's integrity and ruined 2 major character building in the previous novels. Dark Chaplain are totally correct in his review!

[Izlude]

Just finished the Beheading, could not put it down when I got it in the mail yesterday. I agree 100% with DC's review, the time jump thing was little odd (understandable) and the ending not as satisfying but I think that is more on the editor than Haley (He was probably told you must tie up everything in one book!). In any case aside from that I absolutely loved this book and it brought in so many things together and really ties up everything through out the series. Guy Haley is easily becoming a fav with my top four (Abnett, ADB, French, and Wraight). His attention to detail is there and his ability to bring in multiple strands seamlessly is obvious. I think a great example IMO is Pharos (The Polux and Dantioch scene in the end actually almost brought a tear to my eye god damn it) where he brought in multiple stands and was a joy to read. Some of the things I loved with the Beheading:

 

1. The Coup: This is the whole reason I got into the series was to actually read this part. The Terra politics was actually the most enjoyable part of this series with people Bhing at each other and whatnot.  It was believable and I actually felt bad for a couple of them (i.e. they weren't slime balls like Mersing was).

 

2. Kalkator storyline: I was also of the same camp of "what the heck does this have to do with anything." Haley definitely put a satisfying conclusion to this one. In general I do think that Kalkator was portrayed well (which makes me think Haley will hit it out of the park with Perturabo). He is a true IW and he does not come off like a total D and is believable. Also ties up the Bohemond arc with this. The only think I thought was off was the end..seemed like a sudden change in character.

 

3. Inquisition: All the inquisition stuff was awesome with some nice a nod to the HH series...Veritus...wow...didn't see that one coming. It does explain away why he knew what he did and I thought was very nicely done! 

 

These were the things that stood out for me, there were other things which I thought Haley did a nice job with. It is almost they knew all the issues and questions that would arise and Haley managed to do "damage control" with these issues. 

 

I was a late comer to this series (going via it all in a couple of months...Amazon is great) and there were a few duds but overall I enjoyed the ride. Vangorich was one of my favorites and always looked forward to his scenes (come on he is funny as hell) and comes across as complex but also believable which made the time thing DC mentioned the one debbie downer for this book. 

 

Look forward to what else they have in store!

[Dragonlover]

I think the series was a ballsy, if slightly flawed experiment. It certainly has enough 'Holy :cuss what just happened?!' moments. I hadn't even picked up in the planet thing, only that the system name seemed familiar.

 

Hopefully the next run at a similar series will be a bit better planned.

 

Dragonlover

[God-Potato of Mankind]

I think my favourite part was the Veritus bit. 

 

Like.

 

My mind asploded. 

 

I want a Life & Times of Veritus mini-series now. 

[Petitioner's City]

I couldn't disagree more! Dinosaurs have been basically extinct in media, especially movies, since Jurassic Park 3. There's been very little done with them until very recently, and even then those cases are the exception, not the rule. Comparing them to media's love for Zombies is preposterous. They're not even on the same planet of saturation, even if you count dinosaur erotica novels (yes, they exist).

 

As someone who has loved dinosaurs since very early childhood, there's a significant lack of them to enjoy. They used to be everywhere in the 90s, and then it seems like another meteor crushed down on them. I've been sick of zombies for 10 years at least, and yet they still keep coming. There haven't even been any notable video games tackling dinosaurs in recent history, probably not since Dino Crisis jumped the shark and went to space. At this point I'd kill for a survival horror experience with FarCry level vegetation set in a Jurassic Park...

 

You're right, this is no longer the 90s when we had dinos everywhere, but I wasn't talking about zombies now versus dinos now - I'm meaning these are two of the default monster types, and have been for ages. Really, dinosaurs are a dull choice when a writer or film maker can do something more interesting with world building in a science fiction IP. Or alternatively, change them so much they are not zombies or dinosaurs - but this is rare! My frustration with dinosaurs in media is that it is an atavistic return to childhood often. And they are still one of the most popular toys for children, they feature in recent shows like Terra Nova, they turn up as big dinosaurs in strange novels like time travel star trek novels or the Damnation of Pythos, they of course are central in Jurassic World - one of the highest grossing films of the past few years - and they feature in Ice Age and PJ's King Kong. 

 

I just would prefer more original world building in a sci-fi or fantasy setting :)

[DarkChaplain]

Funny that you would bring up Terra Nova. My girlfriend pointed that one out to me a few days ago, and lamented it getting canceled after a season.

Though to be honest, with the exception of Jurassic World, none of these are particularly recent examples. King Kong is being remade again from what I saw, and Ice Age is the beating-a-dead-horse IP they can't let go of for some reason. It also doesn't appear like those shows do particularly well, like Primeval which got canceled multiple times and got worse each season (and also ripped off the Genestealer design for their supermonster), or Surface (another series that got canned after 1 shortened season).

 

Honestly, there's a lot to be done with dinosaurs and ancient fauna like that. Certainly more than with the ever-same shambling or running zombie-mutants. Even The Walking Dead deals more with the human aspects than the Zombies - they're merely window dressing. And for some reason every other survival game on the market seems to feature zombies, because they're just very effortless to do, unlike dinosaurs, which offer far more variety in species and behavior.

 

I can appreciate the desire for more original world building, though. I just don't think dinosaurs and that are mutually exclusive. The Iron Ship by K.M.McKinley, for example, features what comes down to raptors as cavalry in a world of steampunk fantasy with more subdued magic and a very strong presentation of industrial revolution-level society. Its a very creative mix.

[drooling blood]

Well there was that time traveling t rex in judge dredds universe. Whats iz name, Satanus. Over a decade before Chrichton thought of it.

Id rather they bring back the nazis these days, but I think id be shot by the local commissar for complaining about my superiors.

[HeritorA]

Funny that you would bring up Terra Nova. My girlfriend pointed that one out to me a few days ago, and lamented it getting canceled after a season.

Though to be honest, with the exception of Jurassic World, none of these are particularly recent examples. King Kong is being remade again from what I saw, and Ice Age is the beating-a-dead-horse IP they can't let go of for some reason. It also doesn't appear like those shows do particularly well, like Primeval which got canceled multiple times and got worse each season (and also ripped off the Genestealer design for their supermonster), or Surface (another series that got canned after 1 shortened season).

 

Honestly, there's a lot to be done with dinosaurs and ancient fauna like that. Certainly more than with the ever-same shambling or running zombie-mutants. Even The Walking Dead deals more with the human aspects than the Zombies - they're merely window dressing. And for some reason every other survival game on the market seems to feature zombies, because they're just very effortless to do, unlike dinosaurs, which offer far more variety in species and behavior.

 

I can appreciate the desire for more original world building, though. I just don't think dinosaurs and that are mutually exclusive. The Iron Ship by K.M.McKinley, for example, features what comes down to raptors as cavalry in a world of steampunk fantasy with more subdued magic and a very strong presentation of industrial revolution-level society. Its a very creative mix.

True. Its a very creative mix.

[Red_Shift]

Hi thought the final book was great. Tied up the loose ends and the veritas reveal was very satisfying. I would have liked to see more janus. I also liked the implication that the beast was ghasgul thraka or at least ghasgul is some kind of psychic manifestation of unified ork dum and what that means in the 41st millennium.

 

As an aside re. Dinosaurs having watched westworld I think a tv series Jurassic park could work really well.

[HeritorA]

Hi thought the final book was great. Tied up the loose ends and the veritas reveal was very satisfying. I would have liked to see more janus. I also liked the implication that the beast was ghasgul thraka or at least ghasgul is some kind of psychic manifestation of unified ork dum and what that means in the 41st millennium.

As an aside re. Dinosaurs having watched westworld I think a tv series Jurassic park could work really well.

Dont think so, it's still a dinosaurs fatigue in the movieworld. And who need additional T-rex then you have murdering insane androids

[Kriegsmacht]

I understand some of the novels aren't as good as others. I have the first book and im planning on gettig the last one. I was wondering if there's an idea now on which other books to get? Any i can skip that i won't get lost in the overall story?

[Master Ciaphas]

The Beast Arises has a number of really good ones - and a minor number of quite weak ones. For one who usually dislikes Gav Thorpe´s writing, I found The Emperor Expects to be the best of the lot! I really, really liked that one! I have not yet read The Beheading, but will get it in February!

[DarkChaplain]

Read them all. The problems come not necessarily from any book individually (though I really don't like I Am Slaughter and Shadow of Ullanor), but from their place and progression in the series. Some contribute less than others, and some suffer from inconsistencies (see: Shadow of Ullanor). But as a whole, I found The Beast Arises to be enjoyable, if quite flawed.

[HeritorA]

I understand some of the novels aren't as good as others. I have the first book and im planning on gettig the last one. I was wondering if there's an idea now on which other books to get? Any i can skip that i won't get lost in the overall story?

Echoes of the Long War, The Last Wall, The Hunt for Vulcan, Watchers in Death, Shadow of Ullanor are truly horrible, unreadable and unnessessary books.

As DC has said - their place and progression in the series differs. Some contribute less than others, and some suffer from inconsistencies and gives nothing to the series.

Guymer 'Echoes of the Long war' is the most horrible.

 

The Beast Arises has a number of really good ones - and a minor number of quite weak ones. For one who usually dislikes Gav Thorpe´s writing, I found The Emperor Expects to be the best of the lot! I really, really liked that one! I have not yet read The Beheading, but will get it in February!

Strangely I'm shocked to like Gav Thorpe's book the most lol.

[DukeLeto69]

I don't agree that any of the books were unreadable or completely unnecessary but without doubt some are weaker than others and definitely suffer from inconsistencies with previous entries.

 

This is purely my opinion of course but having had some time to reflect I think TBA series breaks down as follows:

 

TOP 3 (in no particular order):

The Beheading

The Last Son of Dorn

The Emperor Expects

 

MIDDLE 6 (in no particular order):

The Beast Must Die

I Am Slaughter

Throneworld

Watchers in Death

The Last Wall

Predator Prey

 

BOTTOM 3 (in no particular order):

Echoes of the Long War

Shadow of Ullanor

The Hunt for Vulkan

[HeritorA]

I don't agree that any of the books were unreadable or completely unnecessary but without doubt some are weaker than others and definitely suffer from inconsistencies with previous entries.

 

This is purely my opinion of course but having had some time to reflect I think TBA series breaks down as follows:

 

TOP 3 (in no particular order):

The Beheading

The Last Son of Dorn

The Emperor Expects

 

MIDDLE 6 (in no particular order):

The Beast Must Die

I Am Slaughter

Throneworld

Watchers in Death

The Last Wall

Predator Prey

 

BOTTOM 3 (in no particular order):

Echoes of the Long War

Shadow of Ullanor

The Hunt for Vulkan

That's a very considerate and well done list.

Totally agree on almost everything - except 'Watchers in Death and The Last Wall' are really poor books. I would have moved them to the bottom.

Also 'The Last Son of Dorn' is not better than 'The Beast must die', but it has it's own moments and it's ending went fantastically.

[DukeLeto69]

 

I don't agree that any of the books were unreadable or completely unnecessary but without doubt some are weaker than others and definitely suffer from inconsistencies with previous entries.

 

This is purely my opinion of course but having had some time to reflect I think TBA series breaks down as follows:

 

TOP 3 (in no particular order):

The Beheading

The Last Son of Dorn

The Emperor Expects

 

MIDDLE 6 (in no particular order):

The Beast Must Die

I Am Slaughter

Throneworld

Watchers in Death

The Last Wall

Predator Prey

 

BOTTOM 3 (in no particular order):

Echoes of the Long War

Shadow of Ullanor

The Hunt for Vulkan

That's a very considerate and well done list.

Totally agree on almost everything - except 'Watchers in Death and The Last Wall' are really poor books. I would have moved them to the bottom.

Also 'The Last Son of Dorn' is not better than 'The Beast must die', but it has it's own moments and it's ending went fantastically.

 

 

Different folks different strokes

 

I debated with myself over the position of The Beast Must Die but hamstrung myself by having a top 3 rather than top 4 and for me LSoD just (literally just) topped it.

 

Watchers in Death for me was not as bad as others seem to think. Personally I had no problem with the Deathwatch set up and introduction of SoS. I liked the simultaneous capture of Ork psykers and the description of the SoS fortress/world etc.

 

I did have a problem with how quickly the SoS were pursuaded and the length of the book.

 

The trouble is, for me, that Annandale is very hit and miss.

 

If I was to order the middle six then probably something like this (but would need to read again to be sure)

 

The Beast Must Die

I Am Slaughter

Throneworld

Predator Prey

The Last Wall

Watchers in Death

[HeritorA]

The trouble is, for me, that Annandale is very hit and miss. - oh yes.

Death of Antagonis - horrible.

Verritas Ferrum - awesome.

Damnation of Pythos - good horror story, bad HH book.

Story from Meduson - good.

Advent shorts - good

Warden of the Blade - amazing.

 

So yeah. You can't predict with him. What I know for sure - Fury of the God-Machine would never  be better than Titanicus.

 

The Beast Must Die
I Am Slaughter
Throneworld

Predator Prey

The Last Wall
Watchers in Death

- probably yes. Glad you saw that Echoes of the Long war was horrible

[DukeLeto69]

The trouble is, for me, that Annandale is very hit and miss. - oh yes.

Death of Antagonis - horrible.

Verritas Ferrum - awesome.

Damnation of Pythos - good horror story, bad HH book.

Story from Meduson - good.

Advent shorts - good

Warden of the Blade - amazing.

 

So yeah. You can't predict with him. What I know for sure - Fury of the God-Machine would never  be better than Titanicus.

 

The Beast Must Die

I Am Slaughter

Throneworld

Predator Prey

The Last Wall

Watchers in Death

- probably yes. Glad you saw that Echoes of the Long war was horrible

 

I think it would be hard for any author at BL to write a better Adeptus Titanicus novel than Titanicus. It is awesome (and has a good ending rather than the Abnett rushed endings we have talked about).

 

David Guymer is interesting. I don't read BL fantasy so my first encounter with him was EotLW which was really not good at all. I found it very dull. Boring in fact.

 

Then he delivered LSoD which was awesome!

 

So for me at the moment as an author he is confusing.

[DarkChaplain]

The trouble is, for me, that Annandale is very hit and miss. - oh yes.

Death of Antagonis - horrible.

Verritas Ferrum - awesome.

Damnation of Pythos - good horror story, bad HH book.

Story from Meduson - good.

Advent shorts - good

Warden of the Blade - amazing.

 

So yeah. You can't predict with him. What I know for sure - Fury of the God-Machine would never  be better than Titanicus.

 

For me, David Annandale works pretty well as I enjoy his religious/spiritual themes plenty.

 

The Death of Antagonis explored the spiritual rift nicely while having chaotic shenanigans going on. Enjoyed it a lot.

Veritas Ferrum was great and I enjoyed The Damnation of Pythos both for being a good horror piece, featuring mutant dinosaurs and setting up events for later during the Horus Heresy and after. Sermon of Exodus was a perfectly creepy cult story to lead into it.

The Unburdened was great and massively superior to The Honoured, once again a highly spiritual piece. The Last Wall, too, was about spiritual themes and mob mentality.

Sons of Titan too dealt with more esoteric themes concerning the Grey Knights and was good for it.

 

His Yarrick stories have been ace from the start, since Evil Eye, and I loved every single one of them for exploring the Commissar's job as a symbol as much as a political officer. They're great stories that expand the horizon of 40k.

And I also see where he was going with Roboute Guilliman: Lord of Ultramar, and can appreciate the direction. It added a bunch to Guilliman and his Legion that it didn't have from Abnett's treatment.

 

So for me, I can predict his themes to hinge more towards the spiritual. For me that works nicely and covers an aspect of the setting that few authors really care touching upon but I feel is vital to the franchise. I expect symbolism and flavors of faith, and that's what he usually delivers, including with The Beast Arises.

[HeritorA]

 

The trouble is, for me, that Annandale is very hit and miss. - oh yes.

Death of Antagonis - horrible.

Verritas Ferrum - awesome.

Damnation of Pythos - good horror story, bad HH book.

Story from Meduson - good.

Advent shorts - good

Warden of the Blade - amazing.

 

So yeah. You can't predict with him. What I know for sure - Fury of the God-Machine would never  be better than Titanicus.

 

The Beast Must Die

I Am Slaughter

Throneworld

Predator Prey

The Last Wall

Watchers in Death

- probably yes. Glad you saw that Echoes of the Long war was horrible

 

I think it would be hard for any author at BL to write a better Adeptus Titanicus novel than Titanicus. It is awesome (and has a good ending rather than the Abnett rushed endings we have talked about).

 

David Guymer is interesting. I don't read BL fantasy so my first encounter with him was EotLW which was really not good at all. I found it very dull. Boring in fact.

 

Then he delivered LSoD which was awesome!

 

So for me at the moment as an author he is confusing.

 

Titanicus still suffered from the rushed Abnett endings tradition.

 

 

The trouble is, for me, that Annandale is very hit and miss. - oh yes.

Death of Antagonis - horrible.

Verritas Ferrum - awesome.

Damnation of Pythos - good horror story, bad HH book.

Story from Meduson - good.

Advent shorts - good

Warden of the Blade - amazing.

 

So yeah. You can't predict with him. What I know for sure - Fury of the God-Machine would never  be better than Titanicus.

 

For me, David Annandale works pretty well as I enjoy his religious/spiritual themes plenty.

 

The Death of Antagonis explored the spiritual rift nicely while having chaotic shenanigans going on. Enjoyed it a lot.

Veritas Ferrum was great and I enjoyed The Damnation of Pythos both for being a good horror piece, featuring mutant dinosaurs and setting up events for later during the Horus Heresy and after. Sermon of Exodus was a perfectly creepy cult story to lead into it.

The Unburdened was great and massively superior to The Honoured, once again a highly spiritual piece. The Last Wall, too, was about spiritual themes and mob mentality.

Sons of Titan too dealt with more esoteric themes concerning the Grey Knights and was good for it.

 

His Yarrick stories have been ace from the start, since Evil Eye, and I loved every single one of them for exploring the Commissar's job as a symbol as much as a political officer. They're great stories that expand the horizon of 40k.

And I also see where he was going with Roboute Guilliman: Lord of Ultramar, and can appreciate the direction. It added a bunch to Guilliman and his Legion that it didn't have from Abnett's treatment.

 

So for me, I can predict his themes to hinge more towards the spiritual. For me that works nicely and covers an aspect of the setting that few authors really care touching upon but I feel is vital to the franchise. I expect symbolism and flavors of faith, and that's what he usually delivers, including with The Beast Arises.

 

Ah forgot 'The Unburdened' - definitely good stuff.

'Sons of Titan' through was horrible.

Quite forgot absolutely abominable young Yarrick stuff. His Chains of Colgotha was awesome - but young Yarrick, tis soooo bad.

And Roboute Guilliman: Lord of Ultramar was absolutely unnessessary and uninteresting. One of 'that' kind of books you fell asleep instead of reading through the night.

 

 

Where was so much spiritual stuff in HH so far - especially with all the tries with Garro, that I prefer a good 'big bolter porn' with good prose novel instead of spiritual and symbolic one.

[Kriegsmacht]

Thanks all for the suggestions