Jazzhands Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 Though I personally wouldn't take a support squad without other rw I have to disagree. With a 4+ cover save in the open its not hard to get that alpha strike. Hitting on 2+ with a huge amount of shots (16 assault cannon and 9 heavy bolters usually for me ) you can do an awesome amount of damage. I have grabbed first blood and slay the warlord many times like this. Terminators with named characters, hive tyrants, the lot. My favourite was crippling an eldar's psychic buffing by wiping out the seer council with the first shots of the game Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnakeChisler Posted October 19, 2015 Share Posted October 19, 2015 Aura is referring to the Hammer of Caliban but given the amount of Grav & Haywire nocking around + melta I'm not sure what his point is Trundling flamethrower Raiders didn't work before vehicle squads & the new anti vehicle toys, as support with long range guns vehicles still have a role and the speeder formation gets away with assault cannons because of its cover save The 3 land raider formation in the SM codex is interesting (though way too many points to ever consider) with immune to damage effects but to be honest it's more suited to Apocalypse Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master Avoghai Posted October 19, 2015 Share Posted October 19, 2015 ... Or a DWSF ;) I also don't understand the hype around the hammer of Caliban... It's useless with WW It's meh with predators destructors (and already cost 635pts) It's full potential with predators annihilator but cost over 700 pts Moreover it should shoot at the same target... (lots of over kill) and using your LR to protect your pred is limitative. You risk to block your LoS, you need to have the place to manoeuvre to do so and your always sensible to an alpha strike unit that manage to place in order to have the predators as the closest unit (with its lateral A of 11). so comparing a 600+ rigid formation with a 375 flexible one is unfair to me... And actually I think that the 375pts one is far superior ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cypher 102 Posted October 19, 2015 Share Posted October 19, 2015 Considering that the Land Raider is in the same squadron as the predators (or whatever) it doesn't block line of sight to the rest of the squadron. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnakeChisler Posted October 19, 2015 Share Posted October 19, 2015 We play with a decent amount of cover and your going to have to move a lot to get everything in firing arc, your then snap firing all but 1 of the guns + if it immobilizes itself your sort of stuck, it has a huge footprint as well even with 4" coherency you'll struggle to get the guns trained on the target. The 3 speeder + DS takes up enough space for me I've not really been tempted to up it to 4 just because of its footprint & I only have 3 typhoons. Anyways Irun mine as anti-infantry with some bonus anti tank rockets if I need them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilB Posted October 20, 2015 Share Posted October 20, 2015 Yeah, I find the Hammer of Caliban quite clumsy to use too. Such a large foot print and all them shots going into one target feels like a waste, but I've only the tried out the predator annihilator and destructor versions. The whirlwind one doesn't interest me and I've not tried the vindicators yet. I liked both formations at the start but now I prefer the Armoured Task Force from C:SM if I want some armour in my Lion's Blade. Much easier to fit in a couple of a predators and a whirlwind and you get to micro manage them instead all that firepower only pointing at 1 target per turn. Plus if you deploy smartly ignoring them crew stunned and shaken results is pretty cool. If you want manoeuvrability, great hitting power & awesome rules though, it's hard to look past the support squadron. Hard for me anyway, love this formation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Dark Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 Im considering using this formation, only have 2 typhoons at the moment though. Whats recommended then, another typhoon and a shroud? Tactics wise i can only see this as a "sit at the back 6 krak missile support team" only if absolutely nessecary pop the 2++ cover save Cant really see much else it can do. Would an assault cannon speeder plus the 2x typhoons and a vengance be a better option? Scout move 12" turn 1 , 12" cruise move, unload everything on priority target... im thinking 4x hb= 12 s5 2x ac= 6 s6 4x tml= 4 s8 Hitting on 2+ (its gonna hurt) Then u have 4++ cover save on as u high tail it out of there with a 12"+18" flat out (do u get the upwash special rule also? +6" if 3 or more speeders) Thx for thoughts, Brother Dark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnakeChisler Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 If your using the Assault Cannon option then your pushing it forward with the Command Squad using the Dark Shroud in a more Aggressive way I do that with the Typhoons anyways, the advantage of Typhoons is there range and ability to take out Reserves using interceptor the Assault cannons have a narrower field of view and shorter range but are brutal at support overwatch. The way the Typhoon Missile is modeled you can get a greater spread of fire from either point and its a single system so no need for both sides to see The DS needs to be within 6" for the Block on Overwatch to take effect as well as the Fear Check, it combo's well with the Ravenwing Command and a Librarian & twin linking it with Prescience is a safe option and adds to the Overwatch pain as well as providing a decent anti air unit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Dark Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 So you reckon DS over vengance then? For both offence and defence? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnakeChisler Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 The Typhoons get a 3+ in the open without Jinking with the Shroud due to it having Shrouded and passing on Stealth to the unit, if the lead vehicle is obscured in any way by terrain that becomes a 2+ without Jinking With Jinking its a 2+ Re-Rollable save Vengeance is Range 36 Gets Hot with standard cover Doesn't Grant Fear or Stealth or Block Overwatch If I was using a Vengeance I'd probably have it on its own so it could come on from the table edge from reserve and blow stuff up but its not going to last AV10 and all Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jazzhands Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 4+ in the open without jinking Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Dark Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 Ok thanks for info. Pretty sure im going to go with shroud for typhoons. 6+ cover from stealth and +2 to cover save from shrouded, 4+ cover save without jink, 2++ jink save Mental! With 12× s5 hitting on 2+ and 6× s8 hitting on 2+ all at a 36" range, its still pretty ouch! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jazzhands Posted October 23, 2015 Share Posted October 23, 2015 Don't forget ravenshield too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnakeChisler Posted October 23, 2015 Share Posted October 23, 2015 Ok thanks for info. Pretty sure im going to go with shroud for typhoons. 6+ cover from stealth and +2 to cover save from shrouded, 4+ cover save without jink, 2++ jink save Mental! With 12× s5 hitting on 2+ and 6× s8 hitting on 2+ all at a 36" range, its still pretty ouch! The missiles do splash as well, with cover if you can't see part of the unit they still have to take models off the table for failed saves due to the blast rule, also let's you straddle 2 units and get hits on Soft targets that are hiding behind buildings by strategic targeting Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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