EesiOh Posted October 21, 2015 Share Posted October 21, 2015 Ok I am going to be running a completely fluffy 4th founding BA Successor (Archangels) and am wondering how I should equip my Vanguards? Considering they can take any mele weapon what is the relative merits of taking Glaive Encarmines on Vanguards? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedemptionNL Posted October 21, 2015 Share Posted October 21, 2015 They can't take glaive encarmines, as those are not on the Melee wargear list. I think a popular loadout is a squad with jump packs, where a few members carry stormshields for survivability and a few other members carry power weapons for some offensive punch. This adds up in costs quickly though, and I think most BA players prefer to take Sanguinary Guard with some ICs (Dante, Priest and/or Libby) instead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paikis Posted October 21, 2015 Share Posted October 21, 2015 There is a discussion here about Van Vets. From what was said in that thread, if you aren't using stormshields, you really should be taking Death Company. Also for consideration is the Archangels' Sanguine Wing formation which gives you 2x 10-man squads of Vanguard Veterans with free power weapons as well as 1x 10-man squad of Sternguard Veterans with free combi-weapons starting in a Stormraven. Pricey to buy the models, but once you've got em, this would be the only way I'd field them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedemptionNL Posted October 21, 2015 Share Posted October 21, 2015 My biggest issue with that Formation is that it all has to start in reserves though. At a minimum buy-in of 860 points, that means the first few turns you have to play missing almost half of your army, and all those free power weapons aren't brought to bear before turn 3 at the earliest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paikis Posted October 21, 2015 Share Posted October 21, 2015 My biggest issue with that Formation is that it all has to start in reserves though. At a minimum buy-in of 860 points, that means the first few turns you have to play missing almost half of your army, and all those free power weapons aren't brought to bear before turn 3 at the earliest. This is true, but you do get to reroll failed reserve rolls, and not deploying them means they can't be alpha'd off the board on turn 1. I see the compulsory reserves thing as more of a safe-guard to protect all those lovely toys. It's kind of rediculous that the vanilla marines can all assault straight out of reserves with their formations, but we can't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlo Posted October 21, 2015 Share Posted October 21, 2015 The amount of Van Vet threads we have is hilarious :') VV are a strange bunch, the DC kill most things easier and have FNP while the SG have power weapons Base, rerolls and a 2+. What the Vanguard have over them though is monster killing prowess. Grav pistols to apply concussion and then thunder hammers and Storm Shields mean your guys will ruin any big nasty's day! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evildrcheese Posted October 21, 2015 Share Posted October 21, 2015 I like to just give them all Melta bombs and point them at vehicles. Cheap loadout and very effective at that role. Not especially fluffy though. D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlo Posted October 21, 2015 Share Posted October 21, 2015 I like to just give them all Melta bombs and point them at vehicles. Cheap loadout and very effective at that role. Not especially fluffy though. D Not a bad shout at all. It's not super great, but I'm at the bits gathering stage of a 5 man squad with all twin hand flamers. Yeah that's right :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DietOfLiquor Posted October 21, 2015 Share Posted October 21, 2015 There are quite a few bug and daemon players in my area. I've actually found two-three storm shields with axes and grav pistols on the others with meltabombs just in case a good load out for them. All with jump packs of course! But they go monster hunting. My DC are for taking out hoards :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkangilos Posted October 21, 2015 Share Posted October 21, 2015 The amount of Van Vet threads we have is hilarious :') VV are a strange bunch, the DC kill most things easier and have FNP while the SG have power weapons Base, rerolls and a 2+. But the fluff! Think about the fluff! On a side note, I wish they came with enough power swords to give them all power swords and storm shields. I'm not a fan of war hammers in general. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EesiOh Posted October 22, 2015 Author Share Posted October 22, 2015 The amount of Van Vet threads we have is hilarious :') VV are a strange bunch, the DC kill most things easier and have FNP while the SG have power weapons Base, rerolls and a 2+. What the Vanguard have over them though is monster killing prowess. Grav pistols to apply concussion and then thunder hammers and Storm Shields mean your guys will ruin any big nasty's day! you may want to kill me for this but in my fluff my chapter kills all of those to turn to the black rage meaning there are no DC, which also means I refuse to field DC... Kinda painful, but ANYTHING FOR FLUFFF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainHelion Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 Also, there's several super neat formations with Vanguard as a requirement Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlo Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 Also, there's several super neat formations with Vanguard as a requirementIncluding the new space marine one. No Furious Charge but hey for the cost of some scouts you get to charge from deep strike. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paikis Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 Also, there's several super neat formations with Vanguard as a requirementIncluding the new space marine one. No Furious Charge but hey for the cost of some scouts you get to charge from deep strike. It's looking more and more like Raven Guard are just better Blood Angels. Kinda sad really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainHelion Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 Nah, you play BA for the SAUCE and Raven Guard have a completely different sauce. The meat might taste better but the sauce is all wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riot Earp Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 This said Formation is sweet https://greysplinter.wordpress.com/2015/10/19/shadowstrike-kill-team-new-rg-formation/ will defenetly field it with my red marines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlo Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 My Marines are already black and red so I'm set ;) Vanilla vanguard don't get hand flamers though :( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riot Earp Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 I don´t bother with hand guns anyway. SS PW and/or TH/PF will be my weapons of choice. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlo Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 I don´t bother with hand guns anyway. SS PW and/or TH/PF will be my weapons of choice. :) They should be mine but hand flamers are unique to us and Damnit I'm going to use them! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainHelion Posted October 23, 2015 Share Posted October 23, 2015 Unique to us, you say... http://www.games-workshop.com/resources/catalog/product/600x620/99060108043_SeraphimHandFlamersNEW01.jpg ...This year's recruits are a LOT slimmer than last years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xenith Posted October 23, 2015 Share Posted October 23, 2015 The advantage Vanguard have over DC and SG is the ability to take storm shields and lots of melta bombs, I'd factor these into any uses. 5 men, 2 shields, 2 bombs fist/sword could be quite a nice distraction / speedbump, with some bite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlo Posted October 23, 2015 Share Posted October 23, 2015 Oh Sisters don't count. When did you last see a Seraphim squad outside of Dawn of War :P? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother_Mike Posted October 23, 2015 Share Posted October 23, 2015 I don´t bother with hand guns anyway. SS PW and/or TH/PF will be my weapons of choice. They should be mine but hand flamers are unique to us and Damnit I'm going to use them! Truly though, I think pistol combinations/loadouts for VV squads would be an interesting discussion to have (and I believe it wasn't in the last VV discussion which someone linked). Being able to shoot 2 ranged weapons (albeit at short range) on an infantry model I feel is something most people underestimate (myself included). We get access to 5 (wow really) different kinds of pistols (bolt, plasma, grav, inferno, hand flamer). Given that amount of variation, it seems to me that VV could have the ranged utility that sternguard are normally utilized for, but have the mobility and CC prowess that sternguard lack (because they usually shoot their rapid fire weapons and the VV benefit from gunslinger). Consider a few sample loadouts I thought of: hand flamer + inferno pistol: can threaten every type of unit in the game and both weapons synergize further by having the same range (if you can fire one, you can fire both) hand flamer + plasma pistol: a loadout that has more versatility than the above one, but trades its heavy vehicle threatening capability for range while still threatening light vehicles and heavy infantry. inferno pistol + inferno pistol: We already see this on the army list sub-forum for meltacide assault squad sergeants, but I still think it's worth mentioning here. 2 melta shots on one model? Nice. Bolt Pistol + Plasma Pistol: The "long ranged" loadout that threatens all types of infantry while keeping the bearer a relatively safe distance from his enemies. Grav Pistol + Plasma Pistol: The TEQ killer loadout right here. Also of note is its strength in dealing with monstrous creatures, having the high strength to wound them with no armor saves and concuss them on top of it. Those are just a few thoughts about dual pistol loadouts. Do you guys have any special loadouts you think would be cool? Or any thoughts on the general effectiveness of paying for 2 special pistols on X veterans? Oh Sisters don't count. When did you last see a Seraphim squad outside of Dawn of War ? Last Sunday actually. I was allied with them ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlo Posted October 23, 2015 Share Posted October 23, 2015 I think most are prohibitely expensive in a way (although not much more than PW/SS) that's why I like hand flamers. Plus the template rules really help as you fire them ALL at the same time, so ten to twenty templates. Even against 5 Marines ten templates causes about 6 unsaved wounds, then you can charge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spagunk Posted October 23, 2015 Share Posted October 23, 2015 I've contemplated starting a pistol equipped Vanguard vet squad. Specifically I was thinking of mostly inferus and grav pistols with maybe a hand flamer for a little overwatch support. Haven't though about the ratio of pistols to men though. Dual pistols seems really expensive on a per model point cost but would be totally cool. I bet it would be fun to use too! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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