Kriegriss Posted October 31, 2015 Share Posted October 31, 2015 I had a question to pose to some of the more rule minded fraters and I am away from my books so I apologize in advance if I make any blatant mistakes. When I got into the HH the VII legion rules where not out yet so I did not buy any breachers to run Stone Gauntlet I have a bunch of Tacs and terminators and 5 man hvy support squads (one hvy bolter one rockets) So I was going to run Pride O' da Legion until I finally painted all I have and then buy some breachers but I was wondering just outa curiosity if Angels Wrath could work if you really commit to it. I mean no overpriced assault squads and I even question sky hunter jetbikes ( hear me out I know they are really good rules wise) Fire raptors and Storm eagles really turn my crank and air cav makes me a lil moist but I know many have wrote Angels Wrath off as too restrictive and I understand that but I could care less about tanks in fact I prefer the look of Storm eagles and they make more sense to me thematically. I am really just a fluffy modeler and game only rarely and even these games are theme and story driven but I wondered if a fella where to really saturate the table with a bunch of storm eagles and maybe 2 fire raptors if this would allow some denied flank tactics and some serious out maneuvering options I like the idea( my wallet detests it) I have also heard they are a nightmare to build. so does any one have any opinions on whether this is viable I mean to get as many storm eagles and fire raptors on the board as I can, will I be able to overcome the Doritos and such if I just spam them I have no idea... the last flying unit I fielded was a high elf dragon. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/315520-viability-of-angels-wrath/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lunar Centurion Posted October 31, 2015 Share Posted October 31, 2015 Iirc, only Tactical squads can take Storm Eagles Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/315520-viability-of-angels-wrath/#findComment-4212454 Share on other sites More sharing options...
norngahl Posted October 31, 2015 Share Posted October 31, 2015 Depends on the point level I think. 3 fire raptors with reaper cannons have enough low ap shots to kill marines and 8 S7 ds4 shots each to shoot the crap out of rhinos or pods. Guess you got to team up with lightnings with kraken penetrators and a phospex bomb to eat through 2+ saves. Load up stormmeagles with 20 tacticals with ccw and eat the leftovers in bloody melee. Thing is, you are at 1000 points for tacticals in eagles, 630 for the raptors, 460 for 2 geared up lightnings and say at least 150 for the praetor. So it gets playable at 2250, but 5 similar looking flyers, 2 similar looking flyers and 2 blobs are rather boring looking imo. You can hardly counter that as an enemy.. but the list looks gooddam boring. Moneywise it's something very expensive for a thing you will get bored of pretty fast. Assault marines on the other hand are one of the worst choices in the dex and personally I don't like fielding them. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/315520-viability-of-angels-wrath/#findComment-4212458 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slips Posted October 31, 2015 Share Posted October 31, 2015 Iirc, only Tactical squads can take Storm EaglesStorm eagles are only dedicated transports in Angels Wrath and at that point any unit that can take a rhino can take one instead. Edit: OT The main problem with Angels Wrath is that, every vehicle having to be a flyer means they cost more than their ground counterparts for sometimes less efficiency. That means that Angels Wrath only starts to catch up in effectiveness at higher points levels where you start reaching critical mass. So you could have, for example: Preator: jump pack, jetbike or on foot tactd onto a squad riding in a transport flyer. If youre using a jetbike, use a jetbike command squad if your FA slots are full. Angels wrath row. Optional Centurions. Troops: Either: storm eagle'd tacs. Luckily due to transport capacity you can run 20 man blobs or 19 with apothecary. Assault Squads geared up to taste. Elites: Either more storm eagle'd units such as termies or tac vets or, iirc, you can take drop pod dreads. If you sacrifice a HS slot for a Kharybdis you could also take a rapier battery...but yeah. Fast Attack: This slot is now your most important one. The best choices, imo, for this slot is the Lightning and Xiphon. Heavy support: Only real choices are the Caestus or Fire Raptor LoW: Primarch, Thunderhawk or Stormbird. Dont forget the orbital strike wing that lets you take up to 3 more flyers for a single slot. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/315520-viability-of-angels-wrath/#findComment-4212459 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kriegriss Posted October 31, 2015 Author Share Posted October 31, 2015 yeah I know it's not overly efficient I just love the idea of a wAves of aircraft screaming towards the enemy letting 9 kinds of hell lose from rocket pods and heavy calibre guns while blaring there "Wagners greatest hits" album on the loud speaker and disgoring a horde of armored astartes death in attack of the clones style Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/315520-viability-of-angels-wrath/#findComment-4212477 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noserenda Posted October 31, 2015 Share Posted October 31, 2015 Ive been considering taking 3 D-99 Valkyries as an Orbital Strike wing, then para dropping in vets from them (With characters! Huzzah!) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/315520-viability-of-angels-wrath/#findComment-4212544 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kriegriss Posted October 31, 2015 Author Share Posted October 31, 2015 yeah that sounds cool to Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/315520-viability-of-angels-wrath/#findComment-4212564 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaolin_Monkey Posted October 31, 2015 Share Posted October 31, 2015 I've looked at similar but sadly unless it differs in Age Of Darkness rules all flyers must start the game in reserve. So all flyers is out. The only way to stop this is one fortification choice allowing one flyer start on. But with Wrath of Angel you can't take Fortifications.... So you have to take something non flyer. Although this could just be a slimmer or two. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/315520-viability-of-angels-wrath/#findComment-4212613 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slips Posted October 31, 2015 Share Posted October 31, 2015 You take assault marines to start on the board. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/315520-viability-of-angels-wrath/#findComment-4212625 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaolin_Monkey Posted October 31, 2015 Share Posted October 31, 2015 You take assault marines to start on the board.I'm aware that you can do that. But I got the impression the question was more to the viability of running an all flyer list. Even going flyer heavy means that you have very little presence on the board early (and assault marines aren't cheap) giving a potential to get wiped before reserves arrive. The other two possibilities for a flyer heavy or all flyer army that I can see are using Anvillus Pods and Kharybydis (which count as flyers but still get to use Drop Pod Assault) and playing Iron Warriors with Perty for first turn reserve rolls. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/315520-viability-of-angels-wrath/#findComment-4212629 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Asvaldir Posted October 31, 2015 Share Posted October 31, 2015 Problem is, assault marines seem really lackluster to me. Your initial cost for an assault marine squad comes in at 25pts/m-wickedly expensive for a unit just armed with ccw and bolt pistols, especially when you compare them to some of the better legion specific assault squads out there. Assault marines are just not as effective, and the cost of a big squad adds up fast. Two squads for your troop requirement gets rather expensive and leaves you less options for your better troops. So what I'd use for your start on the board option is bikes/jetbikes. With jink enough of them will live, and they can take some much needed firepower. Plus because 1-3 fliers can make up one LoW choice, you can still take interceptors/strike-fighters. Plus what I see as a bigger problem is Angel's Wrath has very few ways to deal with reserve manipulation, since you cannot take any command tanks. If you're taking 5 fliers with big units on board, having 1-2 not come on is going to ruin your day. I think to play a good Angels Wrath are you're more restricted to legions who can have reserve manipulation for fliers-Sons of Horus, Raven guard special character, or any primarch that can pick a warlord trait. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/315520-viability-of-angels-wrath/#findComment-4212630 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Rohr Posted October 31, 2015 Share Posted October 31, 2015 It's pricey but 20 assault marines with meltabombs is kind of a super-heavy eraser. I've not been looking at rules in a while, so forgive me if I'm wrong, but that's 20 Str 8 Ap 1, 2D6 armor pens if they attack a vehicle isn't it? For half the cost of a falchion. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/315520-viability-of-angels-wrath/#findComment-4212667 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Asvaldir Posted October 31, 2015 Share Posted October 31, 2015 If they can reach the super heavy intact, yes that's a lot of melta bomb attacks, but if you're not dealing with super heavies that just's an overkill amount of melta bombs for normal vehicles. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/315520-viability-of-angels-wrath/#findComment-4212695 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Rohr Posted October 31, 2015 Share Posted October 31, 2015 I was thinking deep strike, cover, and jump packs would negate the dangers. Especially if offset with juicer targets. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/315520-viability-of-angels-wrath/#findComment-4212721 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noserenda Posted November 1, 2015 Share Posted November 1, 2015 A couple of tough choices with drop pod assault seem useful, the Dreadnought drop pod and Kharbyris leap to mind, both can land relatively far away from the enemy without losing out too much and get some shrouding or native toughness to protect them. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/315520-viability-of-angels-wrath/#findComment-4212799 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dantay VI Posted November 1, 2015 Share Posted November 1, 2015 Cant the assault squad multi assault though? So if there is a squad of tanks, they could conga line and take out all 3 for example? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/315520-viability-of-angels-wrath/#findComment-4212921 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hesh Kadesh Posted November 1, 2015 Share Posted November 1, 2015 Half the cost of a Falchion? Falchion is 600pts. 20 Assault Marines with Meltabombs comes in nude at 500pts, and is still only an MEQ. Kind of think some combination of a Zardu Layak based list (with Cursed Earth Gal Vorbak in a Kharybdis) using a pair of Boarding Shield Jump Pack Chaplain lead Ashen Circle. They gain Hit and Run and Defensive Grenades. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/315520-viability-of-angels-wrath/#findComment-4212999 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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