30k Word Bearers

[cypher371]

Hq
Hol Beloth 165

Chaplain 105
Artificer Armour, Refractor Field

Elites
Mhara Gal 305

6 Terminators 270
Heavy flamer, 2 chain fist , 3 combi meltas, 2 combi plasmas,
-Spartan 315
Ceramite

Legion Rapier 60
Quad mortar

Legion Rapier 60
Quad mortar

Troops
2 x Tactical 195 (390)
Rhino, combi melta

Fast Attack:
Dreadclaw 100 (Mhara Gal here)

Heavy support
Fire raptor 210
Reaper batteries.

will be using a mixture of my chaos marines and betrayal at calth kit.

Alternatively I was thinking of Rite of War - pride of the legion:
So termis become troops and i replace the tacticals with veteran tacticals
3 units of 7 with artificer armour and either a plasma gun or a melta gun - not sure what veteran skills to give them though

Which looks better?

[Terminus]

Um, the Mhara Gal is 305 points BASE.

 

I'd LOVE for it to be 235, it may actually see use then.

[cypher371]

on the forgeworld website it says to click "here for the rules and it is 235? 

Edit: yes i have just read through tempest... which i have now acquired. nice lorgar can use malefic daemonology... can't wait to get him converted up to be transfigured now!

Good thing i recently discovered how good the quad mortars are! that saved me some points!

See original post for adjusted list :)

[Waizer]

might be wrong, but didn't the faq say that models in a unit do not get slow and purposeful just because a cataphractii terminator joined the unit?

[ChainMachete]

The Slow & Purposefui thing used to be in the FAQ, but was removed in the latest version. The debate is out, if this was by intention or by mistake. So something you'd need to agree with your opponent. And I'm never a fan of basing an army list on rulings you need to clear up before every game. You either need a back-up list or a back-up plan for what to do with your Centurion if your opponent is unhappy with your S&P trick.

 

Any reason you're going 3x13 rather than 2x20 (or 1x20 and 1x19 if you really only have 39 tactical). The points you save would almost buy you an Apothecary for one of those tactical squads. Sticking a vox in there would be a good idea as well - no need to move you Rapiers if you can draw line of sight from the vox, so no need for the S&P Centurion and debatable rules. Then you can put your Centurion up front where he can kill stuff.

[cypher371]

the rapiers also have that s8 shot as far as i'm aware. that requires line of sight as it's not barrage. 

each sergeant is in charge of 12 men to make a unit of 13. the 12 men can be considered the sergeants disciples - 12 disciples - word bearers. 13 man total, - 13 unlucky for some - seems fitting for chaos. 
-in terms of numbers i own over 40 chaos marines and i'll have the 30 marines from betrayal at calth so numbers aren't too much of an issue for me if needed :)

in regards to slow and purposeful , you are right i did not have access to faq at the time - damn you FW lol so any ideas?

[Slips]

Do note however that the FAQ is older than the red book which is why the topic is up for debate in regards to S&P

[cypher371]

solution is simple then. e-mail forgeworld and ask the question. they tend to reply. so far hey have with all of my questions hence why i know i can use Zarakynel in 2k if unbound and that i can use a necron nightshroud as an auxiliary in a decurion detachment and i have relavant e-mails as proof :)

[Caillum]

Emailing them will not answer the question. Do you think we haven't tried that already? :) Truth be told, I don't even know why you want SnP Quad Mortars anyway! Just run him as a Chaplain with the Terminators, leaving Erebus for a Tactical Squad.

 

Your Tacticals being 13 in number sounds good in theory, but the Holy Octed of Chaos suggests 8 is the thematic number. You could go for Pride of the Legion with 8-man Veterans if that floats your boat, but you sound like a competitive player. 13 is the magic number to avoid 25% Morale checks, right?

 

And Unbound is a 40k thing. 30k doesn't have time for that!

[cypher371]

Well actuality background for wordbearers shows that they're preferred squad size is 12.purely as reference to 12 disciples if I know gw right. And I want snp so I can keep them mobile when firing shatter shells. Also 8 is khornes number the word bearers are very clear on not appeasing gods singularly.

 

Tbh the 25% morale thing didn't cross my mind word bearers are great with morale as it is lol.

 

Actually I could better appease word bearers background lore by dropping the units down to 12 and having another terminator thrown in.

 

So if snp isn't Conferrable I will break the mortars down in to two units to maximise the shellshock potential. Then probably make a chaplain or a dude with burning law. Any other suggestions too? I am considering the idea of using Potl. And having some veteran tacticals in rhinos or something. With a plasma gun in each

[ChainMachete]

Why Erebus? If you're not allying in Daemons, he's quite expensive for what he brings to the table. And if you want Daemons, Zardu Layek is cheeper and arguably better since he can summon stuff fairly reliably (though that might cause problems with your Mhara Gal so I'd use him as normal Contemptor if you do want to use daemons).

 

You've got the Word Bearer special rules covered with the Centurion (definately give him Burning Lore). So also worth thinking about is Hol Beloth, particularly since you've got so much WS4 stuff (i.e. no Gal Vorbak or Ashen Circle). I think he has much more synergy for your list than Erebus. Converting him up is easy. The Forge World power armoured Praetor, the Legion Champion or the Calth boxset Chaplain would work really well with a power sword for the tainted weapon, a power fist and a plasma pistol. Personally I'm using that event-only Alpha Legion special character to convert up my Hol Beloth.

 

TBH I use still Erebus all the time. But that's because he's painted and Zardu isn't. And he's a fantastic model, even though he's a bit of knob in the fluff. Be warned though, he has loads of really intercrate detail and it takes ages to give him a paint job that's worthy of the model. And you're also stuck with a Kor Phaeron model who's really useless in the game and an even bigger knob in the fluff. The only thing Kor Phaeron has going for him is that he's the cheapest way of allying daemons if you don't care for the Word Bearers rite of war.

[cypher371]

To be honest who wants to use the word bearers right of war? Lol I'm not too keen on zardu layak and for some reason I didn't like hol... Probably because of the tainted weapon... Not too keen on them. I like erebus because he's like a chaplain and a praetor in one. though tbh in about a month or so erebus will be replaced by lorgar when i get the model then I'll be using a cheap chaplain for first Hq instead.

 

Not a big fan of ashen circle rules..

But then I've found with a lot of heresy era legion units they don't appear to look that impressive.

. But this could just be me still being at the transition between 40k and 30k.

 

I do like the look of gal vorbak though and have considered using a few but I'm finding with these lists that points get eaten up very quickly. So this is where I'm struggling most, fitting everything in 2k?

[ChainMachete]

To be honest who wants to use the word bearers right of war? Lol I'm not too keen on zardu layak and for some reason I didn't like hol... Probably because of the tainted weapon... Not too keen on them. I like erebus because he's like a chaplain and a praetor in one. though tbh in about a month or so erebus will be replaced by lorgar when i get the model then I'll be using a cheap chaplain for first Hq instead.

 

Not a big fan of ashen circle rules..

But then I've found with a lot of heresy era legion units they don't appear to look that impressive.

. But this could just be me still being at the transition between 40k and 30k.

 

I do like the look of gal vorbak though and have considered using a few but I'm finding with these lists that points get eaten up very quickly. So this is where I'm struggling most, fitting everything in 2k?

 

Agreed that the tainted weapon isn't particularly useful. S user AP - instant death will only work well on average toughness, poor armour (or armour save = invulnerable save), multiple wound targets and there's not many of them in the 30k universe. But if you ever play 40k oppoenents, then it's a lot more useful. However Hol Beloth also has a master crafted power fist, so you'll be using that 95% of the time. And because a tainted weapon is a specialist weapon, your getting +1 attack on your power fist so Hol Beloth effectively has 5 attacks base.  With a 4+ invul and Hexaglyphic Ward, he'll be winning most fights against a similarly costed Praetor with a Paragon Blade. In the same fight, Erebus will be getting a pasting. The WS5 on everything for one turn is probably equivalent to the Zealot rule in overall damage potential. So the only thing you're really missing out on is allied daemons and Burning Lore, plus you save 30 points.

 

I think Zardu's big advantages over a Chaplain is his psyker abilities, that he's a daemon with access to daemonology and that he can choose (Cursed Earth has excellent synergy with Gal Vorbak) rather than roll for powers. His Warlord trait is fairly crap unless you've got a load of Ashen Circle, so I'd make one of your other HQs the warlord instead.

 

Gal Vorbak are fantastic value for their points. Probably one of the best assault units in the game. What really ramps up the cost is the delivery mechanism (Spartan, etc). But there's not much that can standup to 10 Gal Vorbak in a Spartan with Zardu Layak or a Chaplain. Throw in Lorgar for the ultimate death star nastiness (if you have a spare 1000 points). But as a cheaper option, have you considered a bunker with an escape hatch?

 

However Gal Vorbak don't work very well with the Mhara Gal, which is itself hugely overcosted for anything other than Zone Mortalis games. Lovely looking model, but bloody expensive points wise. I'd be tempted to magnetise the arms, get a second dreadnought CCW or chainfist, green-stuff it to make it look more possessed, stick it in a drop pod & run it as a standard contemptor.

[cypher371]

Forgeworld replied to me and they said that the part in the faq still stands in the way that cataphractii slow and purposeful doesn't affect the rest of the unit :-) so now time to adjust my list

 

I think I may use hol beloth reading through his rules he seems pretty nice and I'll take a chaplain as second Hq. I shall make adjustments to the original post let me know what you think.

 

Also I am converting the Mhara Gal from the plastic contemptor, so it won't matter too much. I was thinking using a hell brute power fist and plasma cannon then using any other chaos, daemon and green stuff parts to flesh it out a bit :-)