Captain Idaho Posted November 8, 2015 Share Posted November 8, 2015 Hey people. So what is the consensus on effectiveness of such squads in the boxed set? I'm looking at the options and certain weapons stand out in 40K though I'm not sure on the 30K equivalent. Flamers as an example look underwhelming compared to plasma guns (love my plasma anyway). Heavy bolters? Rate of fire I suppose but they won't crack power armour like heavier weapons. The Terminator squad is likely the biggest question - close combat weapons any good or stick to ranged? Powerfists look better in 30K setting. Just to point out that my Ultramarines will likely be running a list of infantry against infantry, with limited (expensive) support models. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/315771-equipping-the-new-boxed-set/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theredknight Posted November 8, 2015 Share Posted November 8, 2015 What legion you running as, ultras? Ah captain Idaho, don't you have a blood angel army, or did at some point? Your terminators want the load out from book 5? Cataphractii have staying power, so in a unit of 5, I like 2 fists and chainfist. 3 combi plas. But that's me. Also you can use the contemptor as honoured telemachras? (Better than crappy old rylanor) And are you talking about tactical support squads? Plas and melta are expensive, I use a volkite caliver backfield 10 man unit, to objective camp and take an augury scanner to intercept. Gives a decent range for cover too. I like 2 units of 15 for my Tac squads, vexilla, sarge with art arm and fist, and a nuncio for my cheesewind. Obviously you will need additional fw purchases for this. The set itself can't really be a standalone army without being very generic, and great meat for specialist units. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/315771-equipping-the-new-boxed-set/#findComment-4219229 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flint13 Posted November 8, 2015 Share Posted November 8, 2015 It would help a bit to know what legion we're hypotheically using the box set for, as that would totally influence the decision making process. For example, 8th legion would have a ton of fun with 30 Terror squad marines since they're more points efficient (and probs more effective, especially against other infantry) than veterans. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/315771-equipping-the-new-boxed-set/#findComment-4219309 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Idaho Posted November 8, 2015 Author Share Posted November 8, 2015 No, never had a Blood Angels army, always been Ultramarines. I will slowly upgrade said boxed set. Yes I was thinking of support squads as well as Veteran Tactical squads. Thinking the Cataphracti Terminators can footslog for now using a reaper Autocannon I'll have to pilfer from somewhere. Powerfists and chainfist seems the way to go. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/315771-equipping-the-new-boxed-set/#findComment-4219326 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theredknight Posted November 8, 2015 Share Posted November 8, 2015 Hmm I remember you commenting on some stuff couple of years ago..who knows. Termies will get targeted pretty hard, if you have a spare raider, stick them in it. Are you magnetising? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/315771-equipping-the-new-boxed-set/#findComment-4219328 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terminus Posted November 8, 2015 Share Posted November 8, 2015 Hey people. So what is the consensus on effectiveness of such squads in the boxed set? I'm looking at the options and certain weapons stand out in 40K though I'm not sure on the 30K equivalent. Flamers as an example look underwhelming compared to plasma guns (love my plasma anyway). Heavy bolters? Rate of fire I suppose but they won't crack power armour like heavier weapons. The Terminator squad is likely the biggest question - close combat weapons any good or stick to ranged? Powerfists look better in 30K setting. Just to point out that my Ultramarines will likely be running a list of infantry against infantry, with limited (expensive) support models. I don't think there are any flamers in there except combi-flamers, which you can save for your future Ravenguard project. You can't field any sort of special or heavy weapons using the models in the set, as you need a full squad of 5 for any of them and you only get three. You could make one squad with 2 meltaguns, 1 combi-melta, and run them as tank hunter veterans. You could also bring 5 man squads with 1 hb as sniper vets. Otherwise, your best bet in using the plain jane marines from this release is just as the generic tacticals (or I guess get two boxes, then you can make a 6-man support unit of each special/heavy weapon). The Terminators need a heavy weapon, and the heavy flamer is not a great option. Thankfully, the boxed set comes with plenty of combi-weapons (I think that will be the most popular chunk of this box once it's split up on ebay by resellers), so you can convert a plasma blaster and give the other four combi-plasmas. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/315771-equipping-the-new-boxed-set/#findComment-4219421 Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandomMarine Posted November 8, 2015 Share Posted November 8, 2015 I'm going to use mine as 2x 15 tacs and use the cataphracti to bulk out a existing squad with 5 power axes so probably chainfists on these 5 Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/315771-equipping-the-new-boxed-set/#findComment-4219668 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Idaho Posted November 8, 2015 Author Share Posted November 8, 2015 Plasma blasters of course! As an Ultramarines player, how could I not! It's looking increasingly likely I need 2 boxed sets though... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/315771-equipping-the-new-boxed-set/#findComment-4219738 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElectricPaladin Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 Do you think it would be best for me to ask about building the box for Salamanders in this thread, or start a new one? In particular, I'm curious about how you recommend I build the terminators? Try to convert them into firedrakes? Equip them as shooty terminators? I'm very stuck. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/315771-equipping-the-new-boxed-set/#findComment-4219883 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slips Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 Do you think it would be best for me to ask about building the box for Salamanders in this thread, or start a new one? In particular, I'm curious about how you recommend I build the terminators? Try to convert them into firedrakes? Equip them as shooty terminators? I'm very stuck. http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/315436-lets-make-the-best-list-out-of-the-new-set/ :> Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/315771-equipping-the-new-boxed-set/#findComment-4219924 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Idaho Posted November 9, 2015 Author Share Posted November 9, 2015 Tactical and strategic based equipment is fine here I guess. I can amend the top post to reflect it's more generic? I don't know the Drakes well though so you'll have to be the judge whether it's a big enough topic for a separate thread. That link looks useful in an indirect manner mind. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/315771-equipping-the-new-boxed-set/#findComment-4220247 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ishagu Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 If you run a 10 strong Veteran Tactical Squad you can equip them with 2 Heavy Bolters that can fire normally after moving the unit (range reduced to 18"), and you can award the whole squad the "Sniper" rule so any rolls of 6 auto wound at ap2. You can imagine these 10 Marines coming out of a Rhino and firing all bolters and the two heavy bolters at infantry or a monstrous creature in rapid fire range - all shots wounding on no worse than a 4, and sometimes bypassing armour saves. Not to mention they all have 3 attacks in cc. If you're getting one HH box however, I would initially assemble two standard tactical squads, 10 strong each. These guys will give you the core troop choice for your army without needing a large point expenditure. You can equip the Sgt with either a combi-weapon or something for cc and a pistol, and if you want you can give another Marine the Legion Vaxilla so you can re-roll morale tests. The latter is entire optional, and not necessary if you're also planning on running the Primarch. With the other 10 Tacs, you could build a Veteran unit or perhaps 2 support squads. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/315771-equipping-the-new-boxed-set/#findComment-4220278 Share on other sites More sharing options...
m0nolith Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 Im curious about the cataphractii as well. Anyone ever run them decked out with double LC in a spartan? Too pricey points wise or just right? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/315771-equipping-the-new-boxed-set/#findComment-4220479 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElectricPaladin Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 If you run a 10 strong Veteran Tactical Squad you can equip them with 2 Heavy Bolters that can fire normally after moving the unit (range reduced to 18"), and you can award the whole squad the "Sniper" rule so any rolls of 6 auto wound at ap2. You can imagine these 10 Marines coming out of a Rhino and firing all bolters and the two heavy bolters at infantry or a monstrous creature in rapid fire range - all shots wounding on no worse than a 4, and sometimes bypassing armour saves. Not to mention they all have 3 attacks in cc. If you're getting one HH box however, I would initially assemble two standard tactical squads, 10 strong each. These guys will give you the core troop choice for your army without needing a large point expenditure. You can equip the Sgt with either a combi-weapon or something for cc and a pistol, and if you want you can give another Marine the Legion Vaxilla so you can re-roll morale tests. The latter is entire optional, and not necessary if you're also planning on running the Primarch. With the other 10 Tacs, you could build a Veteran unit or perhaps 2 support squads. That was my thought as well. If I built two veteran tac squads, I'm locked into playing Pride of the Chapter until I can buy more troops... and that's nowhere near as fun as the possibilities that are available to me if I build them as ordinary tactical squads. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/315771-equipping-the-new-boxed-set/#findComment-4220485 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flint13 Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 Im curious about the cataphractii as well. Anyone ever run them decked out with double LC in a spartan? Too pricey points wise or just right? It tends to have the same results as every flavor of death taxi... If your opponent stocked up on grav, chances are they'll leave your expensive squad stranded deep and far in a field of dangerous terrain graviton templates. Secondly, say everything goes% right. They do make it to combat virtually untouched and massacre the hell out of whatever they hit, as big terminator squads are wont to do. Then they have an issue with being stranded again this time within range of the vast majority of your opponent's surviving firepower until they can make another combat happen. So long story short, will that squad always pay dividends on their points investment? No Will they be fun as hell? Yes Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/315771-equipping-the-new-boxed-set/#findComment-4220575 Share on other sites More sharing options...
1ncarnadine Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 There's the added bonus of Cataphractii lightning claws looking awesome. For those of you getting two BaC boxes (or even 1, whatever) and you need a delivery system for all those terminators, and you think Spartan spam is boring or if you're worried about Graviton, FW makes this really cool thing called the Caestus Ram... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/315771-equipping-the-new-boxed-set/#findComment-4220597 Share on other sites More sharing options...
m0nolith Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 Im curious about the cataphractii as well. Anyone ever run them decked out with double LC in a spartan? Too pricey points wise or just right? It tends to have the same results as every flavor of death taxi... If your opponent stocked up on grav, chances are they'll leave your expensive squad stranded deep and far in a field of dangerous terrain graviton templates. Secondly, say everything goes% right. They do make it to combat virtually untouched and massacre the hell out of whatever they hit, as big terminator squads are wont to do. Then they have an issue with being stranded again this time within range of the vast majority of your opponent's surviving firepower until they can make another combat happen. So long story short, will that squad always pay dividends on their points investment? No Will they be fun as hell? Yes Well, considering they are running with a 200+ point Praetor in a Spartan with armoured ceramite and flare shields, whats another +60 points of LC. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/315771-equipping-the-new-boxed-set/#findComment-4220608 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flint13 Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 ^Thats definitely true from a point cost perspective but not so much from a utility perspective. LC terminators are amazing at dicing marines, but now they bounce off other terminators and vehicles and now they cant shoot. I'm not saying that they don't have a place, but I find that it's rare a list requires more ways to kill tactical marines. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/315771-equipping-the-new-boxed-set/#findComment-4220612 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElectricPaladin Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 I've started making a list of how I'm going to assemble the minis in the box (well, two boxes). So far, I've only figured out the terminators. Here's my thought at present: Terminators (10) Goal: primarily, attempting to build one 5 to 7 man squad with a variety of options, to act as as mobile troubleshooters (firedrake terminators will take over as close firefight/combat terminators when I get them). Sergeant w/dragonscale storm shield (will be converted from one of the many lizardman shields I've got lying around), power weapon 3 w/combi-bolter, power weapon 1 w/claws 1 w/thunder hammer 2 w/chainfists 1 w/heavy flamer 1 w/reaper autocannon (bought from ebay!) HQs (2 power/artificer armor, 2 terminator armor) One power armor model will be built as a chaplain (pretty much unchanged from the model as it is). One power armor armor will be converted into a librarian (added libby bling, replace crozius with a force sword). One terminator armor will be done up as a praetor, built for durability and to win challenges, with a power sword (or maybe lightening claw?) and a storm shield. One terminator will be kept as a spare (I haven't decided what to do with it yet). Troops I plan to do four tactical squads, two veteran and two standard, one ten-man and one twenty-man of each. The large veteran squad will be a backfield team with a pair of missile launchers; the small one will be a forward team with a meltagun. I really like the Fury of the Legion special rule, so I'll probably be leaving my sergeants with bolters for the extra shots. That means a total of: 1 w/meltagun 2 w/missile launcher 57 (!!!) w/boltgun As a fun side effect, the ones with boltguns can also be fielded as, say, recon squads. Also, FWIW, I've already got a legion glaive and a storm eagle (originally purchased for and now robbed from my Blood Angels) and I've got a rhino on order from Forgeworld. Next up on the buying block: a second rhino, a land raider of some description (not sure if I want phobos or proteus) and/or a spartan, some pyroclasts, and some firedrake terminators. Thoughts? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/315771-equipping-the-new-boxed-set/#findComment-4220786 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Cohort Posted November 10, 2015 Share Posted November 10, 2015 Tactical vets cap at 10 marines and can take 1 heavy/ special per 5. From my limited knowledge your gear for terminators looks fine. Have you considered a prius medicae for your second terminator? He could attach to your firedrake squad to give them all feel no pain Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/315771-equipping-the-new-boxed-set/#findComment-4220944 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElectricPaladin Posted November 10, 2015 Share Posted November 10, 2015 Tactical vets cap at 10 marines and can take 1 heavy/ special per 5. From my limited knowledge your gear for terminators looks fine. Have you considered a prius medicae for your second terminator? He could attach to your firedrake squad to give them all feel no pain I just noticed the thing about 10 marines and updated the Google doc I've got with my build/conversion plans. That makes them 5 combi meltas for the sergeants, 2 meltaguns, 2 missile launchers, and 53 ordinary battle brothers. That's actually a really good idea... and I've got the terminator apothecary bits lying around from a Grey Knights kit I bought... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/315771-equipping-the-new-boxed-set/#findComment-4220976 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Armond Posted November 10, 2015 Share Posted November 10, 2015 The Caestus just screams to me, but man I just don't know if I should snag one! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/315771-equipping-the-new-boxed-set/#findComment-4221057 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terminus Posted November 10, 2015 Share Posted November 10, 2015 Troops I plan to do four tactical squads, two veteran and two standard, one ten-man and one twenty-man of each. The large veteran squad will be a backfield team with a pair of missile launchers; the small one will be a forward team with a meltagun. I really like the Fury of the Legion special rule, so I'll probably be leaving my sergeants with bolters for the extra shots. That means a total of: 1 w/meltagun 2 w/missile launcher 57 (!!!) w/boltgun As a fun side effect, the ones with boltguns can also be fielded as, say, recon squads. With two boxes, I'd be tempted to do: 4 meltaguns + 1 sgt with combi-melta 4 plasmaguns + 1 sgt with combi-plasma 2 heavy bolters 40 bolter marines 8 ??? marines Realistically you will never need more than 40 tactical marines. Even in the largest games, more than two full tactical squads is probably a liability and you'd be better off investing in something else. This set-up also allows you to run support squads, or 5 full veteran squads. You can also easily field two battle companies for a 40K gladius. The 8 left-over marines are a flex spot, like Vexilla dudes that you may or may not want to use. If you play Death Guard or Iron Warriors, you may want to make a heavy support squad with missile launchers. Or you could give them a bunch of combi-weapons and use them as seekers/sternguard (although I'd rather buy one of the FW sets for an "elite" unit like this). Personally I bought two boxes at 25% off and promptly sold off both contemptors, 2 tactical squads, and the second set of characters for $20 a pop, so I got 40 MkIV marines, a full squad of Kataphractii, the two characters, and two sets of tiles for the board game for $125. My dudes will be 4x meltaguns, 4x plasmaguns, 2 heavy bolters, 30 bolters. I'm not fond of giant tactical squads, so this is more than plenty. The neat-looking retro plasma can be grav in 40K. I am a few dudes short for Sgts, but those guys tend to be in artificer armour, so I'm going to pick up a FW Legion pack to make them stand out more. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/315771-equipping-the-new-boxed-set/#findComment-4221528 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElectricPaladin Posted November 10, 2015 Share Posted November 10, 2015 All good points... I'll think about how to rearrange this... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/315771-equipping-the-new-boxed-set/#findComment-4221545 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElectricPaladin Posted November 10, 2015 Share Posted November 10, 2015 I think what I'll probably do is this: 5 w/combi-meltas 2 w/meltaguns 2 w/plasma guns 2 w/missile launchers 2 w/heavy bolters 40 w/bolters And I'll just keep the remaining seven in reserve and see what seems appealing later. Probably not a support squad, since Salamanders have pyroclasts with amazing versatile weapons, but maybe a heavy weapons squad of some description? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/315771-equipping-the-new-boxed-set/#findComment-4221552 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.