Frater Cornelius Posted December 2, 2015 Share Posted December 2, 2015 First up, let me tell you what I regularly face. Both the drop pod and scouting Grav Rhino variety of Battle Companies, Eldar Jetbikes with Wraith Knights and D platforms, Cohort Cybernetica, MC and GMC focused Battlesuit Tau, Bike Marines and KDK. A lot of armour saves... Anyway, something has compelled me to cram out some of my old-ish BA. So, with encouragement of most holy Mehman, I am trying to build a list that satisfy my eyes and the fluff, but can also keep up with what my bloody meta throws at me on a regular basis. The question is whether it is worth allying the most hardcore Grav choice in the game, the Grav-Cents? In a Pod with Tiggy, mind you, rolling for either Invis or Ignore Cover. Or both. It would deal with Wraithknights, D platforms, Tau and will perform pretty solid against Battle Companies due to split fire. On the other hand, I really dislike allies. I also do not consider cumbersome Centurions to really fit into a BA force. I was planning to run an aggressive mix between jumpers and Pods. Probably a CAD to get two re-rollable picks on the strategic table for improved cover and infiltrate. Including Cents would up my chances against most match-ups but potentially compromise the list concept due to it sucking away too many points. Mind you, I am not nearly as experienced with BA as most of you and I have little experience to call back, so all of that is mostly pessimistic theory where every D shot is a 6. Maybe BA can take it up with those customers without Cents. Thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlo Posted December 2, 2015 Share Posted December 2, 2015 Sure, if it's what your meta demands then you don't get much killier than Grab cents with tiggy. Just make sure you create a cool Librarian BA style model to rep him. Probably not the most fluffy but hey, your meta doesn't sound to fluff centric :P Morticon, our resident Lord and master had some lists using them, Mephiston and Corteaz in tournaments back up by fast razors etc, did him well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ushtarador Posted December 2, 2015 Share Posted December 2, 2015 Yeah, tigurius+grav cents is definitely the way to go against wraith knights and stuff like that. Then try to grab invisibility and ignores cover to down those big baddies! Against battle companies they can also work as long as you have other units to pop the transports and stay out of line of sight. But if your Meta is as competitive as you make it sound, Blood Angels will always have a hard time due to being overcosted nowadays :/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Unseen Posted December 2, 2015 Share Posted December 2, 2015 First up, let me tell you what I regularly face. Both the drop pod and scouting Grav Rhino variety of Battle Companies, Eldar Jetbikes with Wraith Knights and D platforms, Cohort Cybernetica, MC and GMC focused Battlesuit Tau, Bike Marines and KDK. I second the advice by Charlo, but in all seriousness, why bother? That sounds not fun at all, especially if this is even in casual games, non-tournament games. Lets see, an army with 500 free points on you, check, seriously over-powered space pansies, check, robot deathstars, check, codex: the only reason I'm not bitched about is previously mentioned space pansies, check, White Scars, and the poor Khorne player. BA alone don't have the tools to take these kinds of lists head-on like we want to. Either you ally in, or you just sit on the objectives and remove models all game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frater Cornelius Posted December 2, 2015 Author Share Posted December 2, 2015 I like playing competitively, but what sets me apart from the majority of my meta is that fluff plays a more important role to me than pure efficiency I am not going to sacrifice my soul for a win :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evildrcheese Posted December 2, 2015 Share Posted December 2, 2015 Go for it. Cents are undeniably useful and with Tiggy, (bs4)Sniper scouts to a camp an objective you have a potent and useful allied detachment. EDC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frater Cornelius Posted December 2, 2015 Author Share Posted December 2, 2015 Well, I might go back on that. I curb stomped a Grav spam Battle Company into the ground today with a pretty average list. Lost 10 Tacs and 10 DC and that was it. Not sure how it would look against Eldar and Tau though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Remtek Posted December 2, 2015 Share Posted December 2, 2015 I have played BA with some allied grav-cents in a few tournaments and pick up games, they really have patched up what i feel BA is lacking, something to kill gargantuans. They usually do some decent work on knights as well. There are some decent alternatives to Tiggy, persoanlly i don't like it when i have to roll and hope for spells even if he gets the rerolls. Iron Hand cents + sanguinary priest with auspex. Auspex is reliable and gives the cents 4+ FNP, the usefulness kinda goes away with ranged D and wolfstars, but great vs other stuff. Whitescar character with the new relic hunters eye. Cost 4 meltabombs and gives the whole unit ignore cover. Hit and Run is also nice as your BA characters can join up later on. With split fire it makes shooting and assaulting something else very efficient. I have ran White Scar cents with hit and run + Mephiston in a pod. It's not amazing, but can lead to some fun scenarios. If you wanna burn points go a Chapter Master with hunters eye and split fire the orbital, thats ignore cover on 15 grav shots and a str10 large blast. I have also been switching between bunker with escape hatch and pod, plus side with bunker is it's immune to grav alpha and you don't have to worry about interceptor. Bunker also fits more characters. I have played against 3 cents and Tiggys in a pod, and often it's not that hard to just tie them up in combat with a random unit/attack bike since they have no overwatch. As for going pure BA i think it's fine vs most of the above matchups except Eldar lists. If you go pods they just reserve bikes and tank with WK all other BA list get kited by the bikes and all that dakka means cover won't help much. The only viable tactics vs Eldar is putting most of the army in Stormravens, but then again that is so bad vs the other matchup and list tailoring isnt really interesting in most situations. There are some more fluffy alternatives, like the new ravenguard auxilary formation that comes in automatically turn 2 and can charge out of deep strike, i think it requires 2 scout units and one vanguard. They will have shrouded when they come in, so interceptor is managable. Or the skyhammer formation, but personally i'm not a huge fan of that as the only really good thing is the pinning, and many lists are immune to it. a Dev squad with grav-cannons is so expensive for a suicide squad. Still fits better with the BA playstyle and can have some nice synergies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frater Cornelius Posted December 2, 2015 Author Share Posted December 2, 2015 Well, wouldn't two fast TriLas Predators and a Stormraven with Typhoon and Assault Cannon be enough dakka to threaten GC? The Stormsurge should feel the pain due to his T6 and even the WK should drop after 1-2 rounds of focused fire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Remtek Posted December 2, 2015 Share Posted December 2, 2015 If the wraith knight is in ruins it should be able to tank around 40 las cannon shots, in area terrain 30. Storm Surge might work, but it can take a 4++ upgrade and should be able to drop anything that threatens it fairly quick. The wraithkight is not that great at ranged shooting and if it runs up the board it can actually be tarpited fairly efficiently. but the stomps are really random. It can often go several turns before a 6 is rolled. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frater Cornelius Posted December 3, 2015 Author Share Posted December 3, 2015 Should I decide to use those buggers, I will need solid conversions. If the character is Tiggy or Loth, then a solid BA Librarian (possibly even Mephiston putting down his sword and taking his stick out for a ride). A tanky CM will also be fairly easy to make. What I am worried about is the Cents. Those bulky and unwiedly guys next to the graceful and quick jumping units? No, sir. I need a conversion that goes in like with BA. Any Ideas? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jolemai Posted December 3, 2015 Share Posted December 3, 2015 What I am worried about is the Cents. Those bulky and unwiedly guys next to the graceful and quick jumping units? No, sir. I need a conversion that goes in like with BA. Any Ideas? Good enough? Even if it's not what you're after, that thread is gold. I think it's Madscuzzy or one of the BT Mods that improved on the Centurion design too. Can't find the link right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frater Cornelius Posted December 3, 2015 Author Share Posted December 3, 2015 Almost looks like the Powerlifter from Aliens ;) If I was going for more of a mech force, then maybe. As it stands, I am aiming for something that would qualify as Angel's Wrath rite of war in 30k. Floaty business :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ushtarador Posted December 4, 2015 Share Posted December 4, 2015 You could try kitbashing some terminators with grav cannons :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frater Cornelius Posted December 4, 2015 Author Share Posted December 4, 2015 I am this close to using Vargheists :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Remtek Posted December 6, 2015 Share Posted December 6, 2015 Slightly off topic, but in relation to having counter measures for gargantuans, the new CSM rumors have some heavy bolters with fleshbane. Poison only wounds on 6's vs Gargs, but fleshbane is 2+. If it's true it feels like GW are developing grav alternatives for other books. A new BA relic with fleshbane or something else similar would be a really cool alternative to grav-cannon allies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlo Posted December 6, 2015 Share Posted December 6, 2015 That particular rumour was debunked as false sadly, a big old ruse! But yes, I've heard Slipstreams suggest the Sternguard ammo should be Fleshbane instead of poison 2+, that would be an elegant solution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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