Prot's Big Batrep: Ultra + Wolves VS. Tau 4,000 pts w/Pics

[Prot]

+EDIT+ This was a good 5-6 hour game. So I have tried to keep it brief, but a lot happened. And I took a lot of pictures. Sorry for the length, but I hope you enjoy. +

This is going to be a difficult batrep. It was ugly from the start, and it was big. To chew through all the highlights and lowlights (trust me there was plenty of both) would take forever and probably bore you to tears. So please bare with me as I try to make this manageable and entertaining.

As usual, I'm starting with a very pivotal? Perhaps.... disappointing? Moment of the game:

++ Here stands Chaplain Sentina. Where is his command unit? Why doesn't the Stormsurge in front of him have any arms? Is this an act of suicide or perhaps one of stellar bravery? Also, see that little green Quad-Gun in the background that the Wolves are using as a chew toy? Yea, well the Tau would have you believe that little gun has magical powers.... more on that later. Sentina waves his weapon of office in the face of certain death, but will it be in vain? ++

THE GAME:

- 4,000 points per team. 2,000 points per player. One Super Heavy per player. Anything goes...

- Playing size is two tables (4x8) pushed together. Deployment zone is 24" edge. The 6 objectives are placed very evenly - one in each quarter, and two about 2 feet apart in the middle. (In pictures you may see the objective points marked as Black/Red Bolter and Chainsword dice).

- The game type is Maelstrom, steal Objective X is in play: Both teams share the 3 cards, and no one can discard "Secure Objective X" (as they are points that can be stolen.)

- No First Blood

THE ARMIES:

- Tau:

Lots of fish. Fish of all types. Basically, to my surprise, not a lot of formations, but strong units. Stealth cadre (Ghostkeel and friends), Ethereal, lots of Firewarriors, and 2 Stormsurges loaded up with Invulns. Their side also featured a Mont'ka formation with the Broadsides, drones that could Jink(!), and of course the Farsight Enclave including Battle suits and the Riptide.

- Wolves:

My partner's list was something I waited to see before committing to my own list. Basically he took the beef.... he had 2 Thunderwolf Calvary units, and a Paladin Knight. We discussed him getting strong assault elements.... so on top of the TWC he took 2 x 10 Bloodclaw units in pods. And he had another pod with Njal for some psychic assistance (prescience/Divination). There was also a Techpriest in one of the TWC units.

- Ultramarines:

I took a very vanilla full Battle Company Gladius. I had to really keep it low key at 1850 and I decided to squeeze in Librarius Conclave featuring Tigurius and our second Super Heavy: A Knight Paladin. My Gladius Auxiliary was a very vanilla 10th Company.

My forces looked like this:

And a character shot:

DEPLOYMENT AND STRATEGY:

- So here's where everything goes sideways (doesn't it always?). The Tau get first turn, and deploy first. They spread out their 2 Stormsurges in opposite ends of the map in hopes of separating us (didn't work - silly fish). Most of their units are very deep and tucked behind an Aegis with a Quad Cannon. Whatever isn't behind that wall is tucked even deeper in ruins.

- WARNING: When I speak of the strategy we employed I don't want to give the impression I 'bossed' my partner around or dictated how we played. In truth he asked me every step of the way what I thought. I kept telling him I wouldn't object with anything he wanted to do... at all. This was for fun. But he insisted we employ most of the stuff I had mentioned to him previously and wanted to just ask for advice along the way. I just want that to be known and not come across as a jerk here. lol

That being said I told him up front I was going to need him to be the main hand to hand force. And I told him I would do my best to sucker, or coax the majority of their shooting in my direction for as long as possible. I would use my ObSec ability the best I could, but the real threat would have to come from his close combat. The only true threat I had was LibCon. Other than that I would be trying to take all the firepower/heat off of him.

Let me tell you this... I think it worked a little TOO well. (ugh.)

OPENING MOVES and TURN 1 (where all good plans go to die):

- As they deployed and we counter deployed, basically only my Scouts would be truly forward and I put the three squads in the center but did not want the TAU to feel too comfortable moving up to again keep heat off of the Thunderwolves Calvary. I stuck the necks of one Scout Sniper squad out of Bastion to attract their firepower. The rest were mostly hidden.

++ Astartes Eastern deployment. (The truth is this is in turn 2 but you get the idea of our deployment). Both our Knights are on the Eastern Flank. You can see my scouts at the top of the picture as we struggle to reinforce the middle. ++

- I see they separated the Stormsurges in hopes of dividing us. I measured 72" from their deep West Deployed Stormsurge and suggest we keep both knights on the EAST Flank to over load, and remove the general effectiveness of their West Stormsurge. The Wolves agreed and I said I would be more forward. I wanted to take the brunt of the other attacks.

++ On our Western Edge I deployed a couple of long range units. They wouldn't need to move much, but I needed some of our own back field deep ObSec in case Objective cards came up. You can see these lizard dudes are stand ins for the "Jar-Jar Binks" of 40K: Kroot. They infiltrated here, and are moving towards me. ++

- Backing up a second I decide I'm going to try to take Invisibility in LibCon using Tigurius because of the force we are looking at. It is literally on Tigurius' 6th dice roll ( 3 powers x 2 re-rolls each) that I get Invis. The other Libs get Divination (not deny cover unfortunately) and Biomancy (bad roll).

- Their Turn 1 is a surprise.... they pull up a point they can get, but they also pull up a point on our end and one in the middle. The middle will be hard for them as they only have the Ghostkeel's Stealth Cadre is the only thing slightly advanced.

They fire upon me in mass... to the degree that is surprising. My Knight takes a VERY unfortunate hit from the East Stormsurge. I expected as much but he got a Pen 6 on a Strength 10 hit.... and did 4 hull points on my failed save! Ouch. My scouts took a HORRIFIC beating, but somehow Guilliman must have watched over as I only lost 1 scout from a ridiculous amount of firepower.

So far the plan is working as my Knight and scouts absorbed probably 95% of the shots fired (no joke) and the Wolves were almost entirely ignored. But our good fortune would soon turn.

I think the Tau had 1 or 2 points.

ASTARTES FIGHT BACK -or- REVENGE of the WET NOODLE:

- The Wolves are chomping at the bit to get in deep. I suggest he hold back his psyker, and I would throw the honey pot out. I wanted to take my LibCon in a pod along with a Devastator squad (w/3 Grav Cannons) in a Pod PLUS throw my Captain and Chaplain in there. I just assessed their Interceptor and I knew it was going to be disgusting and I knew I would not get a psychic phase before the brunt of the damage.

I suggested the Wolves bring in bodies to prepare for a turn 2 that would allow them to engage as many fish as possible and again, keep Njal in reserves (I didn't want them being tempted to shoot him)

++ Do or Die! LibCon+HQ+Devs land (right hand side) right in front of the Stormsurge, the flamer Tacticals drop in front of a Breacher squad and Crisis Suits. The 20 Bloodclaws land perfectly in front of the Riptide/Stormsurge within the Aegis) ++

- In our turn the heart of my forces (the expensive stuff anyway) comes down in force. We figure the best spot for the Wolves is to make sure they can mutli-assault. Our good news is that the pods went in with little devation.

- Above I am sorry I did not post the best picture for this, but LibCon is just slightly off screen. I calculated the best chance of the Captain taking all the wounds first.... he is vanilla to keep points down, but I gave him Articifer Armour and he has his invuln. Also I positioned him so all templates might hit the stormsurge as well, and of course he at least had an invuln.

++ Sorry just found this picture (there's a lot of pics). This better illustrates my positioning and Tigurus' rod is just poking into the picture. It's my fault for not being 101% sure that no part of him could be seen. But it matters not! We fight on.... ++

This is where it hits the fan....

- I declare a Devastator Doctrine.

- I am targeted (as I hoped) with everything they have. I mean every thing that could see with interceptor shot at me. This includes all 4 of this Stormsurge's missiles. I was happy to take that as I was anticipating this is what it would take for us to have a chance... The Ultramarines' Captain took an amazing amount of wounds. The configuration was perfect but short of The Shield Eternal (too expensive for this game) there was nothing else I could do. The Captain dies, so does a few of the marines, but overall the captain took most of the hits... here's where things get goofy...

One of the Tau players states with his far East deployed Stormsurge he can make out the ornamental head piece of Tigurius... I wasn't buying it. So I walked over and look from the point of view of said Stormsurge and sure enough, on his fancy 32mm rocky, base, Tigurius' ornamental head piece poked partially over the ruins. In my defense, I imagine if the Stormsurge in front of me had arms, it might not have been visible.

So I agreed to the Interceptor shot... it was a bullseye on the template which even though it could only see Tiggy's head, it wounded 5 members. Meaning... I guess Tiggy has to take all 5 wounds.... at Strength 10 AP2.... Tiggy might be good, but not that good. He would die, and with him went Invisibility, re-rolls on the psychic phase, and half the squad was dead.

My plan worked! Yay, I'm getting smoked by the fish! (I thought it went the other way around?) But it is what it is. I sucked it up, and continued to execute the plan....

- My other Pod was heavily targeted as well removing all but 2 guys as they disembarked.

- The Blood Claws and their Pods (both have the template missiles) do a great job of fileting the Tau. Many of them are in a state of disarray and their numbers are hit hard in this one (and only one) area.

- I fire what little I have left, including 2 Grav Cannons at the Stormsurge.... 3 wounds stick after FnP saves. ugh. Those things are sick. I do get "Force" off and decide I will try to make it there with remnants and get off a few Force Wounds if possible in close combat. (yea right!)

++ Our stuff advances. The Space Wolves Tech priest repairs a Hull Point on the my Knight Divinus Veridia. The TWC advance with me.++

- I chose a path to move more towards the centre. I asked my Space Wolves partner to stay on my right (East) Flank so I could block LoS and take the brunt of the hits if they moved their West Stormsurge upwards so it could get shots on me. (I wanted to keep taking the wounds so one of us would have a chance of making it).

++ Everything I have advances. We are contesting for the objective above. The TWC advance behind me. ++

- We steal one of their points, but give up Slay The Warlord in the Interceptor fire (Tigurius). They are up 3-1 at the end of our turn.

TURN 2: The Tau have sore trigger fingers?

++ In Turn 2 the Tau draw Objective 1: The Ultramarines mow down squad Jar Jar Binks as they go to ground. But out of nowhere comes the Riptide, Crisis suits and Farsight squad (far right). These salmon look pretty red... I'm guessing they swam upstream a long time to get here, and they don't look happy about it. The Ultra's are hit hard here, and as usual I'm not really getting much for armour saves. ++

- This is in my Western zone. The Tau draw Objective 1: they deep strike here perfectly and all hell breaks lose. The Ultra's need to survive one turn of shooting but it's just way too much, and too accurate. They also draw Objective 6 (also in our zone but it's behind the Thunderwolves Calvary).

- The Mont'ka disco party hits Objective 6 with some crisis suits. They deep strike some more deep in their zone to help with taking on our Pods.

- I got the rest of the disco party above.

- My HQ+LibCon+Dev squad is annihilated except Chaplain Sentina. My Flamer Squad is down to 1 man. Several of the Bloodclaws are shot down, but many still live as he never got intercepted.

- Tau have a stellar turn.... I think this is the turn they scored 4 points to our 1.

ASTARTES TURN 2: No Risk, No Reward.

- We draw an Objective but I can't remember the number (I think it was one they could steal). We also draw destroy a Gun Emplacement. Since this is plausible, and can't be stolen, I decide we should keep it. I mean why not? It's only a box with a gun on it right? Not according to Tau....

- Both of my Ultramarine Pods come in. I put one deep in the heart of the Tau zone, and the other I try to back up Scouts which have died. One squad disembarks in front of the Ethereal and is shot down to 3 models (but I still had 2 melta's).

- The Space Wolves Pod with Njal comes in! He gets off some Divination powers, and I suggest force just in case that silly Riptide decides to charge him... he gets off force as well.

- My second squad drops on top of the mid field objective and is destroyed.

I think I lost well over half my models just coming out of reserves!!

++ At this point I really felt like it was over. The feeling of dieing SO much in your own turns gets really disheartening after a while. I think the Tau guys were rolling more dice during OUR turns than we were. Here I have been devastated by the Mont'ka Farsight Enclave formation. I have a sole surviving marine moving to Objective 6 to swap spots with the Thunderwolves Calvary.... ++

++ Here the rest of the Crisis Suits landed to grab Objective 6. The Thunderwolves Calvary turn back. The cowardly fish have shot the Techpriest dead (the one that repaired my hullpoint). The TWC are enraged, and turn back to deny the salmon a victory dance in our endzone. ++

- Above I would advance the Knight, and stay directly in line of my partner's Knight as the West Stormsurge had not used it's missiles yet. (My Knight would pop off a double Battle Cannon round into the Farsight Enclave, scoring double hits! They go to ground but all die except the Farsight. This is shown 2 pictures up).

Believe it or not, I am sure that was our first actual squad killed in the game! Between cover, FnP and Stealth it was so incredibly hard to kill anything.

- The Thunderwolves calvary did follow up with an assault that killed the 3 crisis suits above. (I think, or might have been next turn).

++ A lot is actually going on here. The Bloodclaws are still okay. The Blue/Red Ultra pod is actually a Wolves Pod with Njal disembarking. His 2+ save takes a lot of heat and scratches but he lives through it. You can see the cowardly wounded Stormsurge has hoped away from my chaplain along with his Riptide buddy. And see the 'magical' Quad Cannon above.... ++

- The Blood claws and pods do a fantastic job of clean up. A squad of Tau are killed, and I believe another one breaks.

- Above, my Chaplain Sentina took a wound but lives on to attack these Tau in close combat. He would crush several and then run down the survivors.

- Above in the Aegis line is an Ethereal with a squad. The Bloodclaws tried, but couldn't kill him as he made far too many Look Out Sirs. So I am forced to dedicate a meltagun shot from my tacticals above. The shot hits home finally killing him giving us a bonus victory point (slay the warlord plus a victory point for being an Ethereal.)

- Remember the point for the Gun Emplacement? Well I think it took a turn or two of close combat, didn't die, and our Tau buddies tell us we have to roll to hit it, and that we can't walk away from it. I argue this, but let it go. In the next turn I say I'm pretty sure we can walk away from that Quad Gun unless they have a Kroot hiding under the box holding us there... they argue but at this point we look it up. Sure enough... It turns out it's A BOX WITH A GUN ON IT. lol However, it would be remiss of me not to add we failed to kill it... again!

- We pick up a few points but are still losing by a few points. The mid field is in big debate. They have a Stealth Cadre picking off whatver I put there. It's hitting rear armour and getting a 2+ save, erasing most of my scouts/marines/drop units. I am trying to hold on long enough for the TWC to arrive....

TURN 3 AND 4:

++The Tau need Objective 5 above. They had a red Crisis team behind that tower which was tank shocked, and then shot to death by an attack bike of mine. I shoot at the stealth teams in front of the Rhino, but no deal. The good news is after my Tacticals took over for dead scouts, we did steal Objective 5. ++

- We draw Objective 6 which forces the Wolves to stay on top of it. This means the Wolves can't leave to attack the Riptide/Farsight on our West flank. But it's worth a point!

++ The Tau finally advance their Western Stormsurge. I know this means the end of my Knight. I ask the Wolves' partner to just keep going straight ahead as I turn into the Stormsurge path. Sure enough... I take 4 D-missiles. I fail all shield saves and the Knight explodes.... Hopefully the other Knight makes it. ++

- The Wolves are restless and unsure. They see the Stormsurge advance as well. I advise that the Stealth Cadre is recklessly close to his position... I see a wonderful opportunity here and the Wolves partner agrees.... if he can stay alive long enough in the ruins, get into close combat with the Stealth Cadre in those ruins, then it is possible for him to daisy chain the next attack into the Stormsurge.

- Above you can see sticking our neck out paid off. The Thunderwolves pound them into fish paste. Through the ruins you can barely see the grey legs of the Stormsurge which is next....

- At this point my Knight goes down. The TWC take a lot of damage but those 3+ shields would make Russ proud.

++ And back to the beginning... Chaplain Sentina does not rest. His Crozius coated in the mucus and blood of many slayed Tau now confronts the Stormsurge. There is no looking back. He will give his life to spare the Wolves their final surge to clean out the Tau deployment zone. Njal looks on with with his own challenge to face (Riptide). ++

- With zealot fueling his rage, Sentina slams all of his hits into the Stormsurge, but cannot damage the creature. But he can smell the Stormsurge, and it wreaks of fear.... it makes zero hits, and then a single stomp attempts to collapse the Astartes armour, but the ceramite plate holds true! We are at a stand still and Sentina's sacrifice does pay off as the Stormsurge will be unable to shoot at Njal or his Bloodclaws next turn.

- In turn 3 the Astartes reach 8 points but the Tau in turn 4 get to 9 points!

- At this point one of the Tau players says he cannot stay past turn 4.... it has been hours we've been playing this massive game. (trust me, I've condensed this report!)

BOTTOM of TURN 4:

- The Astartes needed to to kill multiple units in mulitple ways to get D3 points... which all turned out to be '1's.

++ Here the Thunderwolves Calvary have wiped out the Stealth Cadre and are zeroing in on the untouched Stormsurge. I kill a couple of the drones. ++

- Chaplain Sentina has done all he can.... he is annihilated by the attacks of the Stormsurge. The precious time bought by that action did allow the Blood claws to destroy the remaining fire warriors, and the Ultramarines were able to kill the Ethereal.

++ After witnessing the death of Chaplain Sentina, Njal contends with the Riptide. The Bloodclaws and Ultramrines look on as he is finally killed by the Riptide. ++

- We were able to hit 9 points to tie the dirty Xenos, but the tie breaker all depended on that mystical Tau Quad Gun. I STILL kept that card for "destroy Gun Emplacement". We also had a card for destroying an enemy unit in the enemy zone....

- So I cut to the chase and said I'm going to try to melta that magic xenos cannon and end the game right here.... I got it (used Tactical Doctrines. lol) and with that the Astartes won the day with a score of 11-9. It was the only time in the game I believe we had the lead. And this is after we (by 'we' I mean me) took such heavy casualties by simply 'arriving' on turn 1-2.

It was a stellar game. A lot of trash talk took place which is to be expected. I thoroughly enjoyed all the non-xenos particpants and I'm sure we'll have a rematch.

I also would like to thank my Space Wolves' partner who was phenomenal in his role of gutting and routing the Xenos in hand to hand. He was absolutely beast mode in the game and it was an integral part of our success.

As a side note I told him I felt like all I tried to do all game was survive... and he said, "Yea that's pretty much like all the 40K novels. The Imperium is always defending, and dieing and in the end they may win the battle, but pretty much they all die... The Ultra's were quite true to the background".

That made me laugh, but damn if it isn't pretty truthful.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

It took a long time to record this, and to go through all the pictures. I did skip a lot, but tried to make this readable. Yet it still turned out to be a long report... I thank you for reading it, and hopefully you found it entertaining.

Later I hope to add a bit of post game thoughts as so much of the game went sideways for us.

[tomsev]

Very well done...

[Flint13]

I keep poking the Like button, but it won't let me give you more than one :(

[markham82]

Thanks a lot Prot, your batreps are always nice to read. They are not too long at all. Keep them coming.

[Isiah]

Agreed. Great batrep. Congrats on the hard-won victory. Great photography too to back it all up.

 

Do you reckon the GK option would have faired better/worse? Or was the brute force of the Ultras the ideal balance to the Wolves? Hard to answer I know.

 

Cheers

I

[Prot]

First off I genuinely appreciate that you guys read these. I definitely wouldn't sift through all the pictures (and annoy my opponents!), write all this out unless I felt someone got some entertainment value out of it. :)

 

 

Agreed. Great batrep. Congrats on the hard-won victory. Great photography too to back it all up.

Do you reckon the GK option would have faired better/worse? Or was the brute force of the Ultras the ideal balance to the Wolves? Hard to answer I know.

Cheers
I

 

 

That is the million dollar question. I've been pondering it ever since the game. 

 

I feel comfortable to play as either army. And you're right, considering the Wolves as my partners was partially why I took the Ultra battle Co.

 

I could have definitely done more damage with the Grey Knights if I would have focused down one area of the map. As you know it was a big playing surface so covering Maelstrom points is hard if we both had small, elite armies.

 

The crazy thing I can't get past is how much bloody damage Tau throw at you just coming in off reserves. That 2nd turn was utterly demoralizing. 

 

So much of the damage is: no saves, no cover. It feels like you'd be best off with scouts. Not getting a cover/armour save is the same for a termie or a scout. (realistically I count making a 5++ as lucky.)

 

But the damage output of Grav is pretty low against Tau. They're not using vehicles really. Close combat and psychic is it....

 

- I would have had to take Grey Knights: Deploy a pack of Termies with Draigo and Gate to him so he can't intercept. Somehow "Cleansing Flame" MUST get engaged. Assuming my 20 some odd Grey Knights at 2K (including the Knight) would have to survive the Overwatch and supporting overwatch.

 

Assuming that failed? It would have been a massacre because the only thing Grey Knights have to soak up firepower with is Nemesis Dreadknights. Sure they are beasts, but again I was rolling handfulls of dice. (I always make a habit of counting 1's - I always keep track to see 'would this have killed 5 Termies; in this case most times the answer is yes.)

 

The only difference would have been: IF I made it into close combat with those Surges/Riptides they are gone (If not instantly, then I have to survive the bizarreness that is Stomp.)

 

- Ultrawise I actually could have went more elite though. I thought of this as a halfway measure. Pull out of the Battle Company, get my typical uber Terminator Captain with Eternal Shield, surround him with Termies, or even Assault Centurions, and those things are gone. (I would have still had plenty of Grav.)

 

That leaves us with: Who covers home base? 

 

Ironically our weakest unit was our Knights. The table was a little too big. I think the config was correct (they MUST have the D sword imho). The problem was it would have been... turn 6 to reach the cowering Xenos.

 

So... doing it over, I would have had our Knights cover home base! Seriously. They could have let us go elite, full throttle forward with everything else. The Knights had Battle cannons, and could mop up just about anything Mont'ka could throw down, and they certainly couldn't have threatened with the 2-3 man crisis suits they did in this game.

 

I would love to try it again with Grey Knights. It could have gone far worse though.

 

I will say playing Ultra battle Co is tough. It's always a grind. So much dies... inevitably you're trying to out think your opponent to simply throw ObSec around. At 1850 you can do damage with Battle Co, but I can (and have batrepped here) far more destructive CAD's or even Demi-Co's.

 

But this is what I signed up for. The plan DID work.... I realize it sounds like we lost when I talk, but that's because I took the brunt of it which happens a lot. 

 

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

 

As a side note, I've felt this in my previous games but this kind of confirms it.... I really feel the Knight is outclassed. The Stormsurge is just so good for its points. It does so many things well, and is so survivable I would suggest Grav is not a great idea unless you overload it so much you're suffering else where.

 

The Knight felt inferior points wise to the Wraithknights I played against... but this is similar. Keep in mind after they deployed I pre-measured and figured out where they could not shoot both our Knights and they didn't catch on for a few turns before they realized we were ignoring one flank. So we really only faced one Surge until turn... 3?(It killed my Knight with D missiles).

 

Anyway, not exactly sure where to go from here in 2016, but that was a VERY fun match. The Tau are incredibly potent against PA armies. :)

[SickSix]

Great report. Interesting insights into how a 7th Ed. game can play. Yeah your friend was pretty spot on with his summation of the battle.

[MagicMan]

Great battle report Prot! Seems similar to my games against Tau.

 

 

You do well against the army, make all the right choices, but the giant robots are just too much.

[Yoyo ninja]

Great write up and thanks for the link in the wolves page, wouldn't have found it otherwise.

 

The tactics you used worked really well, was good to see the Vlka getting stuck in an wrecking fishy faces. It would have been a different matter with GK as there would have been less on the board to soak up Tau fire. As disheartening as it would have been, sacrificing the Ultras won the game.

 

I love my Knights, but I agree they feel under powered and over priced in comparison to walkers other forces can bring. That is until you field a force of them. 4 or 5 of the stomping around the board is a sight to behold.

[Brother Captain Ed]

As disheartening as it would have been, sacrificing the Ultras won the game.

 

Not having seen it in person, I have to concur.  I hate games where all it feels like I'm doing is repacking the models I just unpacked, but it did ensure that Wolves got stuck in and grabbed objectives. 

 

Casualties were a little high, but 3.5 of 5 Codex Astartes': would Planetfall again.  ;)

[Akrim]

Oh no, did you count the Ethereal for warlord and kings slayer? Farsight was my warlord.

Knuckle dragging Gue'la propaganda.

[Prot]

We counted one warlord kill only. Don't get your gills rustled. I did remember the pink salmon had a different warlord.

 

Don't forget we called it once we won I could have finished my turn to take some canned tuna for the long trip back to Macragge.

[Akrim]

We should have expected such under handed treachery from such an unwashed savage race... Next time we will not Show so much pity lol.

 

The new Tau rules are pretty good though. I'm still not overly impressed by the Ghostkeel it's ok for its points, but the Stormsurge is all the wow. Vulnerable to assault by the right units, but holy crap do you pay the price reaching the bloody thing. I'm curious how they fare vs Wraithknights or Stompas in a standard game.

 

Their formations and force detachments are okay but completely lack ObSec. CAD might still be the way to go Maelstrom wise.

 

Marine-wise podding Grav Cents could still get the job done if they spread out after disembarking, provided they survive the main S10 cannon. An argument could be made for Land Speeder Storms with Blind, but that won't help much turn 1.

[Bomber]

 I'm curious how they fare vs Wraithknights or Stompas in a standard game.

 

 

 

MWG did a review batrep of the Stormsurge vs various units.  It did great on anything short of a Wraithknight.  It struggled on a Knight but squeaked a win.  It's best role is light armor and infantry.  Against other GC it's gonna get squished.

[Helias_Tancred]

Solid batrep ... well done, and well done on the victory. I utterly despise Tau and that is a great paint job by your opponents (sarcasm). Good job showing them the Emperor's wrath!

[Prot]

 

 

I'm curious how they fare vs Wraithknights or Stompas in a standard game.

 

 

MWG did a review batrep of the Stormsurge vs various units. It did great on anything short of a Wraithknight. It struggled on a Knight but squeaked a win. It's best role is light armor and infantry. Against other GC it's gonna get squished.

I like MWG but with all due respect that was a really unrealistic match up. Tau execute best in the same way they always have; as a castled up chunk of fish.

 

The stormsurge in particular is a completely different beast with units running interference and with marker lights that would have been toast

 

I think Knights are far outclassed now for their points. The wraithknight is too cheap and the Stormsurges are the best bang for your buck.

 

Any knight I take now has to have the cc d sword or forget it. Even stealth cadre will smoke it as you can't flip fields to cover your butt. It's still early but I really can't see dodging 4D missiles that hit on 2's every game. Right now I can't see backing my Ultramarines with a knight aside from being a very expensive D sponge

[Akrim]

I agree IKs rank below Wraithknights and Stormsurges. Don't think I would call them unusable though.

 

In the Stormsurges case, it's all about the markerlight coverage and the D table (in the case you mentioned the Tau need 6 marker hits in order to hit on 2s with 4Ds). This depends on how well your opponent has their marker fire configured. If done right they can mark within 36" + 6" move if it's drones. Obviously that's pretty much full table. If you don't have first turn I would say starting in reserves would be best chance unless it's long-ways or diagonal deployment. Without Markerlight hits the missiles are less than threatening, S8 vs AV13 and you have a 50% save ratio. Long story short, if you step into markerlight range you better be able to neutralize them.

 

In the WKs case, meh SMs have pod Grav, that might as well be instant death to a WK.

 

It's pretty much a gunslinger mentality with super heavies/gargantuan creatures, whoever hits first probably wins. If anyone hits a 6 on that D table it's lights out.

 

The IKs might not have D shooting (unless there's a FW variant I'm unaware of) but the Avenger Gatling cannon looks pretty good for taking on GCs, as does the Stormspear pod. Either a Warden or Crusader variant.

 

The Stealth Cadre might synergize well with a Stormsurge but on its own, not very dangerous to an IK. its as simple as putting the ion shields on the rear armour (as hits are assumed to hit rear armour). The Ghostkeels Ion Raker is a six shot S7 gun, hits on 3s (+1 formation BS) so say 4 hits vs AV12 on 5s is probably A hull point after Ion saves. Trying to use Fusion guns to melta 9" would be suicidal unless they can really boost away from the counter assault. The S5 burst cannon Stealth suits can't even scratch the paint.

 

The reason I say synergize well is they force you into a choice Stormsurge from the front or Stealth Cadre from the back. Prison style. :D

[Prot]

It's been statistically shown the Grav answer isn't great for the GC's on the table.  There's just nothing better for Marines right now.  Personally I think the Tau army has to be met in CC if you're a marine player, and further to that I'd rather club the stupid thing to death with Assault Centurions, or something similar. The problem is you have to assault the second you get there because they jump 12" and you're toast.

 

I thought of using my other knight which has the Gatling and it's really a fun weapon but "toe in cover" is a stupid rule and you're wounding on 4's and they're probably getting a 4+ cover, +FnP. And you've got a Knight that isn't going to be that great in other situations. (I've actually tried it and was really disappointed in that config as a Crusader Knight).

 

If I ever get around to a 3rd Knight, that would be my final config though: Gatling, D Sword, shoulder harness options with magnets.

 

 

 

In the WKs case, meh SMs have pod Grav, that might as well be instant death to a WK.

 

I know you have this mystical belief in Grav, but this hasn't happened for me. Maybe it should. Maybe I"m unlucky but you basically get one shot at it, and rarely is someone stupid enough to not Toe in Cover the thing, and you're wounding on a 3+ with Grav. So you better have cannons so you can re-roll that, then you have to hope after that math is done, the opponent can't make 4+/FnP. Because if it's not dead, you are in the next assault phase.

 

I -could- overload my entire army with Grav. That should work, and it does work in the fish tank scenarios at ITC because their meta is D-stars. I know from playing our group that over doing it leads to really bad situations against Orks/Astra/Nids, etc. 

 

The "easiest" time I ever had of the Wraithknight is quite easily Draigo w/Force in hth. 

 

I'm just not interesting in tailoring my lists. I think you know that. For now I like to have balance, and honestly I see Grav as mandatory for marines. The rest of the armourey is Jervis-like-outdated.  Xenos have had great weapon/armoury updates: marines got: Dreads with 4 base attacks, Grav, and updated Auspexes.

 

BTW I'm not calling the Knight 'unusable' but for right now I believe I can make a more efficient Ultra list without a Knight than with a Knight. After playing it both ways I just think that one game where you face the Surge with 4 D shots that's going to be a game you're starting ~400ish points in the hole. 

 

I would like to play it more though. Right now the close combat knight seems best but he's gotta make it there. The Imperial Knight gets expensive really fast and isn't as survivable as the GC variants. So I'm not sold on it right now. Admittedly I need more experience with it too.

[Honda]

Is there a reason why, with a game at 4000 pts, you didn't go full Apoc?

[Prot]

Apoc is just so wild. We never do. We used to, but it brings some stuff to the table that just get out of control. I realize there is some fun in that, but this kind of keeps a lid on it that everyone can contend with.

 

It's not for everyone but we seem to have fun with it the 3-4 times a year we do it. Some people host local bigger games (much bigger) that this and those are for people wanting to go 'full Apoc'. ;)

[Honda]

Apoc is just so wild. We never do. We used to, but it brings some stuff to the table that just get out of control.

 

 

Oh, I understand that Apoc isn't for everyone, but I also appreciate the fact that you can design your game. Admittedly, you have to put a little more effort to get a game going if you don't want the game spoiled, but getting agreement on what is in the game vs. what isn't upfront helps manage not only expectations but game flow.

 

I think your game was a blast to read and I don't have any criticisms, as at a more strategic level of play, you out thought the opponent's and by taking some risks, pulled out the win.

 

Unfortunately for some (not saying you) the impression of Apoc is that you just line all your stuff up and start rolling dice. That is what I could call a poorly designed Apoc game. A well designed Apoc game has a reason for existing. What transpires through game play is the story.

 

Anyway, thank you for sharing the battle report, I always enjoy reading yours.

 

Cheers,

[Reclusiarch Darius]

Wow Prot. Amazing game, the photos are fantastic as well. 

 

I think this just confirms Tau are insane at any point level, and are fundamentally unbalancing the game. I mean you brought arguably the best Pod and shock assault list you could, backed up with 2 Knight-Titans...and they still mopped the floor with half your force on Interceptor. That's just flat out broken. 

 

Still got the win on objectives, but it was close-run all the same. 

 

I don't think GK would've survived past Turn 2 or 3 to be honest. We field a fraction of the infantry of a Marine force, and once you focus down the Dreadknights, we just fall apart on the field. 

[Miyu]

Thank you for taking your time to produce and write these really great batlereports :). I enjoy them alot, especially with the Pictures and your thoughts (beforehand and afterwards).

You're thoughts and way of gaming is inspiring to me, playing with a standard Space marine force using the ultra chapter tactics :)

 

YAY! Good Work Prot!

[derLumpi]

Awesome batrep Prot as always. And all hail to the heros of the Imperium! :)

Congrats to the win.

[phoenix01]

Very enjoyable battle report.