Roomsky Posted January 7, 2016 Share Posted January 7, 2016 So I only found out just the other day that originally, the Horus Heresy fluff said that the many years of the heresy encompassed was actually about a year from Istvaan to Terra, and the remaining time was what we now call a part of the scouring (thanks Legatus!). But, of course, now we go by the idea that Istvaan to Terra was several years, with the scouring as an entirely other thing afterwards. This seems to have resulted in some things being moved to pre-Terra events, such as Fulgrim and Angron's ascension to daemonhood, which I believe originally happened post-Terra. So I wonder, with the timeline rearranged like that, do you think it's likely that major events that are currently known to have happened post-Terra, like the destruction of Caliban or Guilliman vs Alpharius, will be moved into the Heresy series? And do you think they should be? If so, what do you think should be moved to pre-Terra, and what should stay in the scouring era? I'd personally like to see the destruction of Caliban happen semi-concurrently with the Siege of Terra. For one, there's been a lot of Dark Angels action in the Heresy series and it would be kind of weird to not see it resolve in the same series. It might also help explain why Sanguinius made it to Terra but The Lion was busy. Guilliman vs Alpharius might also be a good excuse as to why he didn't make it on time. Those aren't the only examples of course. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/317945-rearrangement-of-the-heresy/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Loss Posted January 8, 2016 Share Posted January 8, 2016 I don't think any of the Scouring events will be moved pre-Terra. As for events that keep Guilliman/the Lion from Terra, the Imperium Secundus arc is wrapping up soon so we'll have an explanation in the next year or two. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/317945-rearrangement-of-the-heresy/#findComment-4271110 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Rohr Posted January 8, 2016 Share Posted January 8, 2016 The Scouring was much longer than the 7 years after the siege. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/317945-rearrangement-of-the-heresy/#findComment-4271171 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roomsky Posted January 8, 2016 Author Share Posted January 8, 2016 I know, I just meant that the stuff after The Big E vs Horus used to be called a part of the Heresy, but is now called the Scouring. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/317945-rearrangement-of-the-heresy/#findComment-4271258 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jareddm Posted January 8, 2016 Share Posted January 8, 2016 The Scouring was much longer than the 7 years after the siege. Actually, it wasn't. At least not technically. By the timeline, the Scouring ends with the establishment of the Second Founding. This was 7 years after the Siege of Terra. Were there still acts of vengeance being carried out by the loyalists afterwards? Of course. But they weren't the legions anymore. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/317945-rearrangement-of-the-heresy/#findComment-4271516 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roomsky Posted January 8, 2016 Author Share Posted January 8, 2016 Thanks for clarification, it shall be rectified in the OP. And more edits thanks to Phoebus. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/317945-rearrangement-of-the-heresy/#findComment-4271631 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phoebus Posted January 8, 2016 Share Posted January 8, 2016 Roomsky, Legatus can clarify this better than myself, but the Collected Visions (the book he and I were discussing) never uses the seven year timespan you're talking about. It simply says, more or less, "this is how much time passed between Event A and Event B". It doesn't say anything about the conflicts after the Siege being part of the Heresy. It talks about the Imperium facing many challenges, conflicts, and wars... but those - including the Scouring - are qualified as separate from the Heresy. As far as other events being moved within the Heresy timeline? It depends, really. Fulgrim's apotheosis, for instance, was first mentioned in a description of post-Heresy events, but it's never actually qualified (if I recall correctly) when it happened. Thus, it's not so hard to move something like that around. The destruction of Caliban, on the other hand, is probably not a good example. That event is specifically qualified as happening after the Siege of Terra, and it results in the Lion's disappearance (and assumed death). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/317945-rearrangement-of-the-heresy/#findComment-4271744 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Rohr Posted January 8, 2016 Share Posted January 8, 2016 The Scouring was much longer than the 7 years after the siege. Actually, it wasn't. At least not technically. By the timeline, the Scouring ends with the establishment of the Second Founding. This was 7 years after the Siege of Terra. Were there still acts of vengeance being carried out by the loyalists afterwards? Of course. But they weren't the legions anymore. Man that's so weird the Iron Cage happened during the Scouring but it was ten years after the siege. Mind blown. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/317945-rearrangement-of-the-heresy/#findComment-4271746 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phoebus Posted January 8, 2016 Share Posted January 8, 2016 Can someone remind me where it's said that the Scouring only lasted seven years/until the Second Founding? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/317945-rearrangement-of-the-heresy/#findComment-4271798 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legatus Posted January 8, 2016 Share Posted January 8, 2016 "The seizure of the Eisenstein is regarded as the start of the First Inter-Legionary War. (...) With the death of the Warmaster the rebels paused in their assaults, then fell back to their transports and fled into space. (...) The fighting continued another seven years before the last rebel formations were destroyed or exiled. (...) The Traitor Legions and their dead Warmaster vanished into the Eye of Terror. The First Inter-Legionary War - the Horus Heresy - lasted less than a decade, but it nearly destroyed the Imperium." - 1st Edition 'Realm of Chaos - Slaves to Darkness' (1988), p. 240-243 "As news of the Warmaster's defeat spread out from ancient Terra loyalists attacked rebels with renewed vigour. Hard on the heels of the news came loyalist reinforcements and the tide of battle turned decisively against the rebels. The battles still raged on long and hard for a full seven years before the last strongholds were crushed and the last rebel formations were destroyed or exiled." - 2nd Edition Codex Chaos (1996), p. 11 "The Second Founding of the Space Marines was decreed seven years after the death of Horus." - 2nd Edition Codex Ultramarines (1995), p. 113 (also in 5th Ed. Codex Space Marines, p. 14) I don't think either the Iron Warriors or the Imperial FIsts Index Astartes article gives a specific date for the Iron Cage incident, other than stating that it happened around the time the Legions were being divided. The Iron Warriors article does say in a different context that the Ultramarines and the Imperial Fists were fighting a "decade long" campaign after the Heresy to conquer the worlds held by the Iron Warriors, but perhaps the Iron Cage incident was not the absolutely last engagement in that campaign. After the clash at Sebastus IV, with Perturabo ascending and the Imperial Fists Chapter retreating into rebuilding for twenty years, the Ultramarines might have continued to conquer a few left over outposts. Or perhaps the "decade long campaign" is not meant to be absolutely precise. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/317945-rearrangement-of-the-heresy/#findComment-4271863 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Rohr Posted January 9, 2016 Share Posted January 9, 2016 10 years after Legs. It was the culmination of the 10 year campaign, given the fists had no one left to fight when the Cage was over. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/317945-rearrangement-of-the-heresy/#findComment-4272007 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phoebus Posted January 9, 2016 Share Posted January 9, 2016 Thanks, Legatus! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/317945-rearrangement-of-the-heresy/#findComment-4272108 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noserenda Posted January 13, 2016 Share Posted January 13, 2016 From what i remember all four of the Cult Legion Primarchs were Daemon princes at terra in the old battle for earth fluff at least. (In the Tile based boardgame) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/317945-rearrangement-of-the-heresy/#findComment-4274947 Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeritorA Posted January 19, 2016 Share Posted January 19, 2016 From the new perspective it would seem that the Scouring would be a long multiyear event, like the HH or Beast Arises. I wouldn't be surprised if they change it's timetable to 50 or 100 years. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/317945-rearrangement-of-the-heresy/#findComment-4279148 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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