Making the new tank company ROW work

[exsanguis]

Hey everyone,

 

So out of all the new RoW's we've heard about, the tank company and dreadhead lists interest me the most. For those who haven't seen the leaks, the tank company requires that a Predator or Sicaran (Battle Tank only) be taken as a HQ option, opening up Predator Squadrons as Troops (though whether they get ObSec I'm not sure) and Sicaran Battle Tanks (NOT Venators) as a Elites. All infantry units must also be mounted. It is essentially Armoured Spearhead+.

 

Now how to make this work at 2000 points? As Iron Hands it would be daft not to have your HQ tank be a Sicaran with Orth in it, meaning you will need a Praetor or Delegatus to unlock the RoW. At higher points values that won't be an issue as you can use Ferrus (or corresponding Primarch's with other legions). Between a HQ Sicaran with Orth and a Praetor to unlock the ROW, you're already about 470 points down. This assumes the following:

* Sicaran Battle Tank with Orth, Las Sponsons, Autosimulacra & Ceramite (285)

* Praetor - Cataphractii, Paragon Blade, Digital Lasers, Cyber-Familiar (185)

 

You could skimp on the Praetor, but if you're going to mount him up in a Land Raider or Spartan with some Gorgon's or Terminators then you want him to contribute. This leaves you about 1500 points for the rest of your army. I think the best Predator setup for Troops would be Dakka Preds:

* 3x Predators - Autocannons, HB Sponsons (285)

 

12 Autocannon & HB shots for about the same price as a Tactical Squad with attached Apothecary! Not bad at all. You could also use some HCB Preds for pie plates or Executioners to cover your AP2 needs. Let's assume that we go 2 of the above squadrons to fulfill our Troops choices and cover our anti-infantry needs. This is now where I get stuck. I have my beatstick Praetor who needs a ride and some buddies, but I also need to drastically up my anti-tank and AP2. I guess the main options for this are:

1. Vindicators - they now come in squadrons! 3x Laser Destroyers anyone?

2. Sicaran Venators - Maybe take 2 for your Heavy Support and rely on something else for AP2.

3. Contemptors - 2x Lascannons for AA/AT fire, though they're expensive for what you get.

4. Spartan - Can tank for your armoured force (pun intended) and deliver your Praetor and cronies to where they need to be, but it's a big points drain, especially if you want to maximize the transport capacity.

5. Fire Raptors - great air support, but they're better at taking on light-medium armour which our Sicarans and Predators can handle just fine.

6. Heavy Support Squad - load them up with lascannons and blast away! However, you need to pay a 35 point tax to give them a Rhino.

7. Deredeo - excellent AA and anti-tank, but very expensive.

8. Primaris-Lightnings - the tank deleters. Expensive, but they will make your opponents Spartan weep.

 

Whilst there are plenty of options, at 2000 points (my usual groups points level) my choices are limited, especially once you include a bodyguard unit and ride for the Praetor.

 

I'm curious to see how everybody else would run this new armoured RoW.

 

[Brofist]

Remember that OBSEC doesn't exist in 30k. This army will be a strong one, but it will need careful planning around scoring units since its possible to make a list without ANY scoring units at all (pending having the actual book in hand).

 

For the default list I would stick with an Orth Sicaran and either one or two predator squadrons of x2 tanks. Probably some combination of x2 predator exterminators with las, x2 predators with HCBs, and x2 predators with just lascannon sponsons. From there you need to decide on the ride and bodyguard for your HQ and which scoring units you want to bring (probably terminators, veterans, or support squads of some time).

[Terminus]

Instead of Praetor, try a Delegatus. Should save a good 60 points.

[God-Potato of Mankind]

Instead of Praetor, try a Delegatus. Should save a good 60 points.

 

Just what I was going to say.

 

A CC Praetor seems very out of place for this RoW. It's all about the armoured dakka.

 

I'd take two wings of predators. AC/HB and Executioners for the next. Suit rest of list to taste.

[Lord Blackwood]

to be honest i love the idea of this rite of war , though ill still likely take sigismund and a land raider wagon of templars to go cut people to peices , what I see it as  , is a way to  easily free up my heavy support slots since one sicaran will move to HQ one will be able to be moved to elites   and the venator well hes gonna still take up one, still though , seems like a very fun way for someone like me who  normally just runs his tanks to get more tanks while only need a few bodies  and still being able to take stuff like deredos and levithans etc 

[Viridia]

Are the Predators a compulsory troops choice or just troops in general? I can see myself running a list of terror squads in Rhinos alongside a group of Predators if they're compulsory for a 'mechanised company' feel, the only downside is I'd have to drop my Calth termies for not fitting in the FOC.

[Galron]

Wouldn't matter in your case since Terror Squads are elites nor do they get the option of rhinos(unless the newest book changed that option). They are only troops in a Terror Assault list thus preds would be a 0-1 choice for a squadron and take up your lone heavy slot, which honestly isn't bad.

[Viridia]

Wouldn't matter in your case since Terror Squads are elites nor do they get the option of rhinos(unless the newest book changed that option). They are only troops in a Terror Assault list thus preds would be a 0-1 choice for a squadron and take up your lone heavy slot, which honestly isn't bad.

 

Bugger, I did forget that. I get too used to 40k squads getting rhinos and drop-pods that I forget not everything has the same array of options in 30k, especially when it comes to specialist units like them. Pity though, I had visions of comp-troops Predator squadrons and rhino-riding terror squads.

[noigrim]

Can you take allies or LoW with this?

[1ncarnadine]

Can you take allies or LoW with this?

 

yes to both

[Prodigal Son of Magnus]

I'm waiting for someone to suggest AC+Double Assault Cannon Predator spam for Blood Angels. 16 S6+'shots on a 110 pt model is gonna be nasty.

[redmapa]

I'm waiting for someone to suggest AC+Double Assault Cannon Predator spam for Blood Angels. 16 S6+'shots on a 110 pt model is gonna be nasty.

 

Using this RoW for BA is kind of pointless as you need more infantry than tanks at which point you'd be better off just spamming predators in the heavy support slot.

 

imo a good HQ for this would be a Delegatus+command squad in a Damocles.

[Nova_chron]

BA just need equal LA:Blood Angels units to units with tank type some one tac squad nets your three tanks

[PastelAvenger]

 

 

I'm waiting for someone to suggest AC+Double Assault Cannon Predator spam for Blood Angels. 16 S6+'shots on a 110 pt model is gonna be nasty.

Using this RoW for BA is kind of pointless as you need more infantry than tanks at which point you'd be better off just spamming predators in the heavy support slot.

 

imo a good HQ for this would be a Delegatus+command squad in a Damocles.

I read it wrong it as well it actually says Tank units so this RoW actually has some worth to Blood Angels

 

I was looking at it the other day

 

HQ

1 X Delegatus

1 X Sicaran

 

Elites

3 x 1 Techamrine with Servitors in a Rhino per elite (give all the Rhinos ACs)

 

Troops

3 x 10 man Tactical Squads in a Rhino Per Troops (give all the Rhinos ACs)

2 X 3 Predator units with 3 Assault Cannons and 1 Twin Linked Assault Cannon each. Add in POTMS and maybe Armoured Ceramite AND lets not forget these will all gain Fast! moving 6" shooting 3 Assault Cannons snap firing 1

 

Heavy

2 x 1 Venerators to shut down those pesky super heavies

[noigrim]

 

Can you take allies or LoW with this?

 

yes to both

 

Ok then here goes my list:

 

HQ

Orth 80

 

Elite

Sicaran 135

Sicaran 135

 

Troops

Predator executioner 110

Predator executioner 110

Predator executioner 110

Predator executioner 110

Support squad+rhino 135

Predator flamestorm 90

 

HS

Whirlwind hiperios air defence missiles 75

 

LoW 

Ferrus (allowed by combined arms detachment) 410

 

Option A (shooty oponent)

swap Ferrus and a predator flamestorm for typhon, predator and delegatus

 

Option B 

swap Ferrus, predator flamestorm and whirlwind for Fellblade with ceramite and one executioner for a delegatus with terminator armour

[1ncarnadine]

 

 

Can you take allies or LoW with this?

 

yes to both

 

Ok then here goes my list:

 

HQ

Orth 80

 

Elite

Sicaran 135

Sicaran 135

 

Troops

Predator executioner 110

Predator executioner 110

Predator executioner 110

Predator executioner 110

Support squad+rhino 135

Predator flamestorm 90

 

HS

Whirlwind hiperios air defence missiles 75

 

LoW 

Ferrus (allowed by combined arms detachment) 410

 

Option A (shooty oponent)

swap Ferrus and a predator flamestorm for typhon, predator and delegatus

 

Option B 

swap Ferrus, predator flamestorm and whirlwind for Fellblade with ceramite and one executioner for a delegatus with terminator armour

 

 

You can only use Predators with the Predator cannon as troops with this rite. "Armed with Predator cannon turret and sponson weapons only," to be more specific.

[noigrim]

Time to rethink the list then:

 

How's this:

 

HQ

Orth 80

 

T

Pred, heavy flamers 95

Pred, heavy flamers 95

Pred, heavy flamers 95

Pred, heavy flamers 95

Support sqd, rhino 135

 

E

Sicaran 135

Sicaran 135

 

HS

Pred executioner 110

Pred executioner 110

 

LoW (combined arms)

Ferrus 410

 

Option A (vs tyranids)

-Ferrus, all heavy flamers, 1 executioner

+Fellblade, delegatus

 

Option B (vs eldar)

-Ferrus, 2 heavy flamers

+Typhon with ceramite, Delegatus

[Exark]

I'm a fan of the list as well (new to 30k too, doing loyalist Iron Warriors with said RoW), however I'd like to point out a few corrections for this, one the wording of the RoW says that a command tank may be taken, also the troop predators (at least by my reading) can only have the autocannon turrets

[Brofist]

A few things I've been thinking about- is the predator cannon restriction just for the compulsory troops predators or for all troops predators? Also I'm starting to believe that FW intended for masters of armour to work outside the normal ROW rules. Why? Well, the wording says his command vehicle counts as your HQ choice and is also your army warlord. If that's the case, then it's impossible to run this ROW since only a Preator/Delegatus has the master of the legion rule, and it only 'unlocks' access to ROW if they are your warlord. Bit of a catch 22. That's why I'm getting the feeling the commander replaces your warlord with automatic access to the ROW. The drawback is that you give up rolling for any warlord traits.
 
Not fishing for anything. Just some thoughts I've had as I'm considering eventually running this list.

[Caillum]

As of p2 of the latest FAQ, you can have a Master of the Legion to gain access to a Rite of War, and still choose another character to be the Warlord.

 

It doesn't say anywhere, at any point, that the Master of the Legion who unlocks the RoW must be the Warlord. :)

 

I do think that all Troop Predators must take Predator cannons though, regardless of whether they are the compulsory choices or not. Awesome Rite of War nonetheless!

[Robzilla]

I can't remember all the details off hand, but I did have a go at blood angels with this row. The only major issue I had was lack of scoring (assuming the troop tank units don't get it, by merit of being troops),

It was something like....

 

3000 points:

 

Praetor -bike

Primus medicae - bike

Primus medicae - bike

 

2* predator squadron with predator cannon and assault cannons, with pintle mounted assault cannon (if predators can get them)

2* of the above

2* of the above

 

10 man outrider unit, power weapons and melts bombs

10 man outrider unit

6 man attack bike unit. Assault cannons.

 

10 man assault cannon heavy support squad in rhino, with pintle ac.

10 man ac heavy support squad with rhino and pintle mount ac

 

Extra points went on more predators.

 

Obviously just a fun list, but man... All the dakka.

[Terminus]

A few things I've been thinking about- is the predator cannon restriction just for the compulsory troops predators or for all troops predators? Also I'm starting to believe that FW intended for masters of armour to work outside the normal ROW rules. Why? Well, the wording says his command vehicle counts as your HQ choice and is also your army warlord. If that's the case, then it's impossible to run this ROW since only a Preator/Delegatus has the master of the legion rule, and it only 'unlocks' access to ROW if they are your warlord. Bit of a catch 22. That's why I'm getting the feeling the commander replaces your warlord with automatic access to the ROW. The drawback is that you give up rolling for any warlord traits.

 

Not fishing for anything. Just some thoughts I've had as I'm considering eventually running this list.

Lots of inaccuracies here. Heralds also open Rites of War and the Master of the Legion model doesn't have to be the Warlord too.

 

As for the Rite, scoring predator troops are definitely a thing! And yes, they are scoring. The latest AoD rules only bar dedicated troop transports from being scoring units.

[Lord Blackwood]

After playing a few  tourney games ( and a bunch of tourney prep games)  with this  RoW I can certainly speak to the amount of punch it can have.  Though I definitely think you shouldn't bank  on predators  having staying power , once yer opponent knows they are yer scoring units they might actually bypass your bigger threats to cripple your scoring. 

the Typhon works insanely well as the LoW here  

I  would argue that maybe taking a hit squad in a spartan is an alright investment 

Vindicators ..... meh , they are just as fragile as the predators have to be closer  and  the enemy is more afraid of the large blast. 

Heavy conversion beamer Cortus dreadnoughts are a sleeper choice for this list , they can actually do a fair bit of work

A lot of my games  with this list  revolved around me isolating and destroying the enemy anti tank as priority one , one game I decided to try and cripple a transport ,  and that didint work out too well 

All my experience has been with running this RoW through Imperial Fists , Im sure Iron hands would probably be more potent. 

[Brofist]

Yeah, I feel you. I think you need to bring some infantry with staying power otherwise you risk not having much scoring on the table. Dreadclaws come to mind, but I could see the points saved on tacticals going into an allied detachment instead.

As of p2 of the latest FAQ, you can have a Master of the Legion to gain access to a Rite of War, and still choose another character to be the Warlord.

It doesn't say anywhere, at any point, that the Master of the Legion who unlocks the RoW must be the Warlord.

I do think that all Troop Predators must take Predator cannons though, regardless of whether they are the compulsory choices or not. Awesome Rite of War nonetheless!

Lots of inaccuracies here. Heralds also open Rites of War and the Master of the Legion model doesn't have to be the Warlord too.

As for the Rite, scoring predator troops are definitely a thing! And yes, they are scoring. The latest AoD rules only bar dedicated troop transports from being scoring units.

Hummmmm. I'm not sure that's how it works:

http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/308683-master-of-legion-warlord-rite-of-war/?p=4069847

The FAQ doesn't say anything that changes how the master of legion rule works from LACAL, which requires your model to be a warlord in order for it to be activated. So either a Master of Armour is an invalid choice, or his rules make him an exception to the way ROW normally work.

[Terminus]

You're operating under a misconception. Master of the Legion at no point mandates the model to be the Warlord, otherwise allied Rites of War would be impossible. Master of the Legion has two effects:

1 - pick Rite of War

2 - if also warlord, reroll trait.

 

Now other folks read it how you do, and in fact did poopoo allied Rites of War. The FAQ clarified that this not the case, and allied Masters of the Legion can indeed pick a Rite of War.