Khornestar Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 Hey, I was just wondering about our beloved friend, the Despoiler. I'm not super into 40k fluff, so I don't know a lot about his background beyond the first few HH books during Loken's tenure in the Luna Wolves/Sons of Horus. Why is he so special to the chaos gods? Why do they all support him? How has he not been corrupted by them physically over 10,000 years? Why isn't he a daemon prince? Why isn't he a spawn? Why, other than his rockin' topknot, of course... http://i.imgur.com/rHdmVFel.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demus Ragnok Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 I think ADB wrote a novel on the subject. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
incinerator950 Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 Plot Armor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atia Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 He has totally fluffy hair?^^ And he can sing ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khornestar Posted February 17, 2016 Author Share Posted February 17, 2016 He has totally fluffy hair?^^ And he can sing I guess that answers my question. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dizzyeye01 Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 Ever since Horus fell, Abbadon has been fighting to gain the Chaos Gods attention. The difference between himself and Horus is that while Horus gave in to Chaos, Abbadon uses it as a tool and doesn't hold onto it like his life depends on it. He's special in that he's done so many tasks for the Gods that they would be foolish to ignore such a piece on the board. And him not becoming a daemon prince ties back into the factor of not wanting to get tied to the Gods directly and becoming a puppet for them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kriegsmacht Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 Hmmm a Queen cover band consisting of Chaos. I can dig it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Excessus Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 I think ADB wrote a novel on the subject. This. ADB wrote a good novel on the subject, it's suggested reading. ...well, there will be more, but it's a start... (comeon ADB, release the next one already!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khornestar Posted February 18, 2016 Author Share Posted February 18, 2016 Would that be Talon of Horus? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Son of Carnelian Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 Yes indeed. This post on A D-B's blog should answer your original question nicely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slayer le Boucher Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 Yes. A delightfull piece of reading. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khornestar Posted February 18, 2016 Author Share Posted February 18, 2016 Yes indeed. This post on A D-B's blog should answer your original question nicely. Thanks for providing me with some real meat! Very cool read, and a buddy has a Talon of Horus audiobook he's gonna let me listen to. Sweet. *edit* I think my favorite thing about ADB (I know he's around, so not trying to swell his ego or anything) is that he actually interacts with fans of the universe because he is clearly one himself, and not only writing to pay the bills, but with some semblance of passion for the grimdark. When the fans and "experts" are being little know-it-alls about the 40k universe he disagrees with them directly, carries on discussions, and so on. I really appreciate that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atia Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 and a buddy has a Talon of Horus audiobook he's gonna let me listen to. Sweet. Do it! Talon was aweeeesoooome! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slayer le Boucher Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 First Heretic, Betrayer and Talon of Horus are my all time favorites books about the HH. I've read a chunk of them, not all of them, but a fair number, and bare maybe for the first 5 of them in the series (and then again), none of them are as astute, thrilling and just spot on as those. Obviously Betrayer is my beloved Legion book in sorts, but i really enjoyed Talon of Horus, would never imagined enjoying a read where the story is narrated through a 1k-Son( being the hardcore World Eater i am). Cannot wait for the second book of the Black Legion series. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khornestar Posted February 18, 2016 Author Share Posted February 18, 2016 First Heretic, Betrayer and Talon of Horus are my all time favorites books about the HH. I've read a chunk of them, not all of them, but a fair number, and bare maybe for the first 5 of them in the series (and then again), none of them are as astute, thrilling and just spot on as those. Obviously Betrayer is my beloved Legion book in sorts, but i really enjoyed Talon of Horus, would never imagined enjoying a read where the story is narrated through a 1k-Son( being the hardcore World Eater i am). Cannot wait for the second book of the Black Legion series. Betrayer is one I've actually read, and is by far the coolest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Son of Carnelian Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 I think Talon of Horus suffers from an overburdened third act, but I'll let you decide what you think of it on your own rather than spoiling it here, Venomlust. Suffice to say it makes a wonderful case for Abaddon's place in the lore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sception Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 The Black Legion supplement is also good reading on the subject. Abaddon, and by extension his Black Legion, are special for a number of reasons. The central core of that is focus. Abaddon keeps everyone pointing more or less in the same direction - towards the end goal of tearing down the Imperium. While there are certainly petty rivalries and ambitions within the Black, Abaddon's focus keeps his soldiers from losing sight of that goal, the way other chaos legions get caught up in the games between the gods, or give in to the vanities of the old primarchs or their own indiscriminately violent natures. This makes the Black Legion the most persistent chaos threat, and it also is the key to their large numbers, as disaffected chaos marines of other legions who eventually grow tired of a life of meaningless self indulgence, start pining for the days when they fought for a cause bigger than themselves. Some find that cause in the gods, but they are fickle and inscrutable, where as the cause offered by Abaddon is concrete and achievable. As for why Abaddon hasn't been physically corrupted - he has. He's larger than he was, stronger, faster, his flesh an unnatural color, a palpable aura of the power of chaos radiates from him constantly, those with the second sight cannot bring themselves to look directly at him. As for how he hasn't become a spawn or daemon prince, that's partly his own iron will, and that's partly the second thing special about him. The gods know they need a singular commander to lead their forces against threats in the mortal realm, else their own conflicting natures will cause their forces to collapse, and the Emperor taught them that the mortal world can actually threaten them, so that's unacceptable. Their nature, however, also prevents them from sticking with one champion, as they each attempt to claim these figures for themselves, eventually gaining a powerful toy but costing their coalition the leaders they needed. Abaddon, more than any other mortal champion of the forces of chaos, has been able to play the gods against each other in order to stay in that position of power over all of the gods' forces, an exceedingly dangerous game that has had him balancing on the head of a needle in the eye of a hurricane for ten thousand years, and in that time he has become too powerful for any god to accept him falling into the hands of another. Whenever one tries to tempt him to their personal service, the others step in to intervene, offering their own blessings in return. This is a game that Be'lakor played and lost, but where Be'lakor was made a prince of all four powers (and thus able to maintain an illusory sort of independence by choosing which power he would be most influenced by at any time), the chaos gods don't do that anymore - none will make Abaddon a daemon prince until he pledges to them alone. They think that offer is the greatest control they have over him - the last temptation that ensures he will eventually choose one patron, but it's actually the other way around. By always holding forward the possibility that he might finally 'settle down' with one god or another, Abaddon gets them all to hold back their 'greatest reward' - a reward he very much doesn't want. The possibility that he might turn to any of them also keeps each of the gods from just straight up killing him to prevent him from falling into any of the others' hands. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teetengee Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 Basically, unlike everyone else, Abaddon has not failed. He just isn't done yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A D-B Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 The Black Legion supplement is also good reading on the subject. Abaddon, and by extension his Black Legion, are special for a number of reasons. The central core of that is focus. Abaddon keeps everyone pointing more or less in the same direction - towards the end goal of tearing down the Imperium. While there are certainly petty rivalries and ambitions within the Black, Abaddon's focus keeps his soldiers from losing sight of that goal, the way other chaos legions get caught up in the games between the gods, or give in to the vanities of the old primarchs or their own indiscriminately violent natures. This makes the Black Legion the most persistent chaos threat, and it also is the key to their large numbers, as disaffected chaos marines of other legions who eventually grow tired of a life of meaningless self indulgence, start pining for the days when they fought for a cause bigger than themselves. Some find that cause in the gods, but they are fickle and inscrutable, where as the cause offered by Abaddon is concrete and achievable. As for why Abaddon hasn't been physically corrupted - he has. He's larger than he was, stronger, faster, his flesh an unnatural color, a palpable aura of the power of chaos radiates from him constantly, those with the second sight cannot bring themselves to look directly at him. As for how he hasn't become a spawn or daemon prince, that's partly his own iron will, and that's partly the second thing special about him. The gods know they need a singular commander to lead their forces against threats in the mortal realm, else their own conflicting natures will cause their forces to collapse, and the Emperor taught them that the mortal world can actually threaten them, so that's unacceptable. Their nature, however, also prevents them from sticking with one champion, as they each attempt to claim these figures for themselves, eventually gaining a powerful toy but costing their coalition the leaders they needed. Abaddon, more than any other mortal champion of the forces of chaos, has been able to play the gods against each other in order to stay in that position of power over all of the gods' forces, an exceedingly dangerous game that has had him balancing on the head of a needle in the eye of a hurricane for ten thousand years, and in that time he has become too powerful for any god to accept him falling into the hands of another. Whenever one tries to tempt him to their personal service, the others step in to intervene, offering their own blessings in return. This is a game that Be'lakor played and lost, but where Be'lakor was made a prince of all four powers (and thus able to maintain an illusory sort of independence by choosing which power he would be most influenced by at any time), the chaos gods don't do that anymore - none will make Abaddon a daemon prince until he pledges to them alone. They think that offer is the greatest control they have over him - the last temptation that ensures he will eventually choose one patron, but it's actually the other way around. By always holding forward the possibility that he might finally 'settle down' with one god or another, Abaddon gets them all to hold back their 'greatest reward' - a reward he very much doesn't want. The possibility that he might turn to any of them also keeps each of the gods from just straight up killing him to prevent him from falling into any of the others' hands. All true, but almost none of that is in the Black Legion supplement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Targetlock Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 no he hasn't especially with the fact they ret-conned the eye of terror 13th crusade out of 40k lore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kol Saresk Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 no he hasn't especially with the fact they ret-conned the eye of terror 13th crusade out of 40k lore.No they haven't. It is still very much present. It was even briefly mentioned in our 6th edition Codex. What has happened is the focus of the 13th Expedition has changed. In 3rd Edition, we thought it was just all about breaking out of the Cadian Gate. Now we know that Abaddon has far larger ambitions. After all, he's broken out of the Eye of Terror twelve times before and he has repeatedly trounced across the breadth and width of the Imperium. An Imperium which has only grown weaker in the last ten thousand years. And you know what that ambition is? To destroy the Imperium and build his own empire in its ashes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khornestar Posted February 18, 2016 Author Share Posted February 18, 2016 Been listening to Talon of Horus all morning. Pretty cool, but haven't gotten to the Despoiler yet! Enjoying it very much. Took a second to get used to the voice actor's alien/daemon voices ;). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vesper Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 no he hasn't especially with the fact they ret-conned the eye of terror 13th crusade out of 40k lore.No they haven't. It is still very much present. It was even briefly mentioned in our 6th edition Codex. What has happened is the focus of the 13th Expedition has changed. In 3rd Edition, we thought it was just all about breaking out of the Cadian Gate. Now we know that Abaddon has far larger ambitions. After all, he's broken out of the Eye of Terror twelve times before and he has repeatedly trounced across the breadth and width of the Imperium. An Imperium which has only grown weaker in the last ten thousand years. And you know what that ambition is? To destroy the Imperium and build his own empire in its ashes. It is still present, but not in the shape and form that was advertised some 13 years back. We were told the global campaign was canon and that it would have consequences in the Galaxy. That used to be canon, but not anymore. So there was a clear retcon. Which is no biggie. I've come to praise that retcon. The scale is bigger, the Chaos threat is way more important and the Imperials aren't totally incompetent and unable to organize themselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kol Saresk Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 Not really sure how much of a retcon it is since the Cadian Gate is still broken open. Maybe the background has been changed to better portray the cluster-bumble of the Imperial players to make it look like they put up a better fight, but they still lost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vesper Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 Sure. But the writing of the campaign's ending has been terrible. Many people felt that when the Imperium doesn't outright win the best their opponents can get is a stalemate. And there is a part of truth in that. Now, with the addition of the Crimson Path, we know it's the extinction event of the Imperium, no less. And many people felt betrayed, because GW showed nothing of what was promised. But I don't blame Chambers, I'm sure he was honest and he felt he could use the campaign to craft us whatever he planed. It just didn't happen because higher ups said no, and some time after that Chambers left GW. And I don't blame the said higher-ups because the transcription of the campaign's results into the lore wasn't as satisfying as I (and apparently quite a few people) expected. Now we just need to know much more about the Crimson Path, much more about Abaddon, and much more about what's really coming out of the Eye. In due time, it may come. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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