Best of the codex

[DarkAngeal]

Hey there, angry red battle brothers!

I'm hopping over here for a bit from the Dark Angels thread. I have been looking into potential allies for my dark angels force, and blood angels seem to have a lot to offer! I was hoping to gain some opinions on the units I am looking at before I go all in though.

First- Librarian Dreadnoughts? Are these nearly as awesome as they look and sound? How often do you run this HQ, and how does it perform for you?

2- Sanguinary guard. I love this unit aesthetically, and they seem very killy. Do you take swords or axes? What sort of ranged weapon is best? Do you wear deathmasks? I was considering sticking a Sanguinary Priest in there with a jump pack and the Crown Angelic. Yay, nay?

3-Tactical squads with heavy flamers and flamers, I love the idea of sticking them into a drop pod and melting some tyrannids or guardsmen (renegade guardsmen I am sure).

Assault squads- I was thinking ten men with 2 meltaguns. Very punchy and killy.

 

If there are any other units you think I should look at, please let me know, and I would love some feedback on the units above. Thank you.

-DarkAngeal

[Charlo]

1) Awesome monster hunters with quickening and force plus they can challenge out characters. Nasty when employed properly and supported, like all other dreads.

2) SG are great, but really come into thier own when you add in a Sanguinary priest for WS5 and FNP5+. Even better if you get a Librarian in there and mange to roll up the unleash rage (get rage) or shield of Sanguinius (enjoy you better, jump troop terminators) powers. A nice mid of axes, swords and a fist with some inferno pistols to open transports is good. Priest does well with our relic, Valours edge for ap2 at high initiative and S5 on the charge.

3) For about the millionth time on this board I'm going to plug my tactical squad: Heavy Flamer, Flamer & two hand flamers in a drop pod with a deathwind launcher. So. Much. Fun.

4) Can go either way with assault squads, ten men with Melta and a tooled up sarge is good, but a bullet magnet. Many here prefer to employ them as a scalpel, rather than a hammer. Put five of them in a drop pod with two Melta guns and two inferno pistols on the sarge. Enjoy your precision 4 Melta shots into side/ rear armour for just a bit over 100 points.

 

As for others, Death Company. Nothing will make your opponent swear more than guys who get 5 attacks on the charge at S/I5 - rerolling misses and failed wounds when Astorath is attached to them.

[SM1981]

The Death Company, because they're the Death Company. One power fist, one power sword, per five guys. Deploy via drop pod or jump pack to get into the fight ASAP. They will do everything your assault squad would better. There is very little these guys cant take on, especially if you are charging. 5 are useful, 10 are great. The higher you go the more fun you will have (elite slots and squad sizes allowing).

 

Meltacide (suicide melta assault squad). Not a thing formally, but very definitely a thing. Pack a five man assault squad with as much melta as you can (our guys get 2 slots per 5 models, plus the sergeant can take a third as his ranged weapon). Put them in a drop pod and dump them behind your enemies tanks / heavy support. They will die very early on, but they will also take out more than their points value in armour before they do.

 

Mephiston. Just read his stat line / page in the codex, and try not wreck your pants.

[DarkAngeal]

I love this "2 melta pistols" idea. Beautiful! One thing I am looking at doing is attaching cypher to one of these units and infiltrating them to provide a huge threat to my opponent early on while the rest of my army comes raining down in drop pods. Does anything mesh particularly well with his benefits of infiltrate and shrouded?

[Omega-soul]

it depends for what kind of competetive game you are playing.

 

From  competetive point of view:

1) This thing will die pretty quickly. On drop-pod   it's like instant   death.  On Stormraven it can eleminate 1 or 2 targets if lucky.

Main problem as all walkers  and vehicles - it  can  blow up from 1 strike. Front  armour is almost never  the case when you approaching to enemy  - so it's 12  or  even rear 10 wich can be shot with humble  bolters or krak grenades.

His cost with 2lvl  is rarley pays off (175pts)

Most of the monster creatures will simply runaway from him - and there  is not so  many MC on the table these days.

 

2) They are not  so killy as Death company, and not as durable  and  expendable. They require pretty solid retinue of independent characters to become really killy.

So Librarius Conclave looking for invisibility/4+invuln plus Sanguinary priest for FNP to all  and WS to angels, taking additional pistol and Valour edge plus Dante for H&R plus Librarian with sanguinary discipline (looking for rage and primaris power) . Squad of 6-7 guys - one company standart one-two fist.

And just then this pack can make a real threat to anyone.

Meanwhile - SG will die hillariously fast just because of how much ap2 firepower is common. So it's either strong  ap2 firepower like grav, or whole buckets of dice like scatter-bikes.

And even then - yeah they great for killing MEQ troops but otherwise deathcompany will do this much better and cheaper

 

3) Tacticals are good only when you play with CAD. And playing BA for CAD is not a major discipline. But when you do - yeah heavy flamers and double hand flamers is the right choice. But keep in mind that  you have to support that choice with at least 1 assault squad with 3 meltas on drop-pods (unless Dante so  you can jump-packs) for every tactical  squad with heavy flamer. It's also viable strategy with heavy flamer/flamer in rhino for fast objective wipe.

But overall - in comparesent with  the assault  squad -  tacticals overcosted - for 5 men with HF in a rhino you pay 125pts where assault squad with double flamers get 90 pts doin galmost the same job  (unless CAD)

[Boudan]

If your local meta does not already have meltacide as a thing... You are going to blow some minds.

 

Skip Sang. Guard, in my opinion.

 

Librarian Dreads are definitely good for scaring some poop into some pants. It might get shot at *a lot* when your opponents see what you're packin'.

[Charlo]

I don't think Cypher confers infiltrate to the squad he joins sadly. If he has shrouded he will though.

[Jolemai]

I don't think Cypher confers infiltrate to the squad he joins sadly. If he has shrouded he will though.

Correct. The squad has already Deployed and seeing how he can only join them when they Deploy on the table, Infiltrate is not conferred.

[DarkAngeal]

You are entirely correct, I was thinking of the formation you can take with him.

[Brother Raul]

I think if I was to run C:BA as an ally for C:DA i'd have to go DC. Cheaper than SG as the main reason and the HQ chappy is better (rerolls on those 5 attacks) than the fnp is for the SG.

[Blindhamster]

I still prefer sanguinary guard to DC, but to be effective they typically need both a priest and a libby to get the Fnp, +1 WS and ideally an invulnerable from the libby. And then a banner to buff their attacks. And to be run in a BSF.

 

Whereas DC need less support, that being said without being in BSF and without buying packs and some power weapons they simply aren't as good.vs MEQ.

[Ceril]

Sanguinary guard are good in a vacuum, in current meta they are not worth their points. Too expensive, no invulnerable save. Grav, melta and other shooty stuff jsut tears them to parts.

 

Lib dread is a bit too vurneable.

 

Melta as previously mentioned. Tac squads with all flamers is awesome.

 

What you want is probably Sanguinary Priest, maybe on a bike. Flesh Teares Strike force for drop pods is often used. A good route is also psykers/characters to a death star as we don't have chapter tactics, our librarians don't interfere with yours. Dante is strong too.

 

Good relics are the ap2 sword, Valor's Edge. Veritaes is strong if your warlord is from BA. The Jump pack could be a meta chocie if you face a lot of interceptors.

[DarkAngeal]

Taking much of this advice, I created an early attempt at a list. As always, feedback is greatly appreciated.

http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/319974-bloodwing/?do=findComment&comment=4325346

[Indefragable]

Though I have never actually driven Dark Angels on the battliefield, I am pretty familiar considering my best friend plays them and I have considered starting my own DA force as well.

Here is a general BA-as-Allies Allied Detachment that gets as much mileage out of the unique attributes of the BA for as cheap as you can get.

++++++++

356pts

HQ:

Sanguinary Priest

--Valour's Edge (S-User AP2 @ Initiative, cost of 4x meltabombs)

--Bolt Pistol

TROOPS:

Tactical Marines x 5 (OBSEC, so make them pay for that Objective!)

--Heavy Flamer

--Sgt w/ 2x Hand Flamers

Drop Pod

ELITES:

Death Company x 5

--Jump Packs

--Power Fist x 1

--Bolter x 5

Adjust squad size and/or # of squads for DC/Tacticals to preference.

++++++++++

-Sanguinary Priests tend to be a preferred HQ for BA-as-allies, since who doesn't want some 5+ FNP? The relic sword is pretty cheap for what it gets you (AP2 at initiative!) but flavor the equipment to your taste.

-LIbrarians are another safe choice for HQ, especially if you want more WC, but generally, SM and DA Librarian formations are more reliable these days. Sanguinary discipline is a fun choice, but not earth-shattering IMO.

-Swap out the Drop Pod for a Fast Razorback w/ Las-Plas if you want a more mech route. Since it's Fast, you can fire both the Lascannon and TL Plasma gun at full BS.

-Pound-for-Pound Death Company are one of the best units in the game considering what you get for their cost. Jump Packs with Bolters makes them incredibly annoying and self-sufficient (Relentless, Jump 12", Rapid-Fire, Charge for 20x S5 and 4x S9 AP2). If you have enough shooting--which would not surprising given you're running Dark Angels--drop the bolters for pistols to get 4x more S5 attacks....but ALWAYS pair a Bolter with the PF since there is 0 downside to doing so. This 5-man setup is great as a MSU, bring as many as you want.

-Alternatively if you don't care about points, 15x DC w/ Astorath the Grim as HQ, and 3x Power Fists is one of the most choppy CC units you can possibly get. Just MAKE SURE you are the one charging, not getting charged. Point at enemy, stand back.

Other signature items on the BA menu to consider, depending on how you want to complement your robed warrior-monks:

-Furioso Dreadnought with Frag Cannon and Heavy Flamer in a Drop Pod

-Vindicator with Overcharged Engines. Threat Level Midnight

-Sanguinary Guard with a Chapter Banner and 5x swords. IMHO, these guys are best kept cheap to bully MEQ unless you really want to spend points to get them able to compete with the big boys

The Librarian Dreadnought, IMHO, is an awesome idea but tends to draw SO much fire that it's almost not worth it. All it takes is a single lucky Lascannon shot and 200+ pt HQ goes bye bye.

And last but not least, if you're talking Angels of Death, DA-BA tag team:

-Mephiston with DeathWing Knights in base-to-base contact

[Charlo]

The Mephiston idea is pretty sweet actually!

[Jolemai]

Sorry chaps, Mephiston would need a storm shield to benefit from Fortress of Shields.

[Charlo]

Sorry chaps, Mephiston would need a storm shield to benefit from Fortress of Shields.

My thoughts exactly as well Jolemai, then I remembered...

 

HES ALREADY T5. So you have a unit that actually makes use of his natural toughness!

[Indefragable]

 

Sorry chaps, Mephiston would need a storm shield to benefit from Fortress of Shields.

My thoughts exactly as well Jolemai, then I remembered...

 

HES ALREADY T5. So you have a unit that actually makes use of his natural toughness!

 

 

Exactly!

 

 

https://youtu.be/4atH_Km4KaQ

[Charlo]

Oh my god that link. Perfect. So Perfect!

[SlangWhanger]

10 CC Scouts with Sang Priest and/or Libby in a Landraider. One of the most underestimated (and cheapest) 'Deathstars' in 40k. Even better with WS4 Scouts (grumble grumble...). The looks you get for fielding it are totally worth it too!

 

As for synergy with DA there a few options that spring to mind:

A) Alpha strike BA: Flaming tacticals, meltacide squads, fragioso dreadnoughts. DA can then either beta strike with bikes or just mop up stragglers over course of the game. This'll work well as it'll disrupt the enemy army and significantly weaken their main threats if used correctly. Downsides are this detachment will shrink the size of your DA army and could present a split army for your enemy to deal with piecemeal. Good at disrupting gunlines etc.

 

B.) shoot the :cuss out of the enemy, absorb charges like a boss (read Dark Angels) then counter attack with Death Company, Assault squads, scouts, sang guard etc. or whatever takes your fancy. This can work well as you hang back and shoot away at assaulty armies before they get too close, especially with Sang priests helping to tank wounds, hopefully weakening their assault units enough to give the strong BA assault units the edge in combat.

 

C) use fast BA vehicles to support bikes and termis of the DA. Pretty simple really but adds a lot of mobility to an already fast ravenwing army.

 

If you don't have a proper plan for battles, then just get Death Company. And Sang priests are nice. But mainly Death Company...