I've been drooling over Militarum Tempestus lately...

[Emicus]

I'd take to take a minute to just rant about the Militarum Tempestus.

​God damnit I want some of those cheeky devils.

 

​I've got a real underdog fetish and the Scions are just so... underrepresented (damn near unique?). I mean the Codex is about 4 pages (one for each unit, hah!) but they've got some really cute tricks such as 4x Deep Striking, Twin-Linked Plasma Guns. I can't even find a dozen articles about them. And Taurox Primes are made of paper, but it's slightly stronger paper than Land Speeders even if they are more expensive and they can even carry some dudes.

 

I reckon they'd be passable with a Knight to take the heat off.. and I found a nice deal on the old Militarum Tempestus Storm Scions box set (25 men, Commissar, 2 Tauroxes and 1 Valkyrie) for 25% off.

​And
And
And...

​EDIT: if anyone has the hardback Militarum Tempestus codex and would like some money, hit me up.

[duz_]

I bought that box set really good value

I just bought another 5 man box now I have the following set up

2x ccs w/ 3 plasma, vox

3x 5 man squads w/ 2 melta, vox

1x 5 man squad vox

2x taroux primes

 

I'd like to play with them more but I find anything more than 3 squads and they quite a point sink and squishy at that

 

But certainly their MT orders work great for them especially TL or PE plasma command squads

[WarriorFish]

Sounds like you're buying that box Emicus... ;)

[Ulrik_Ironfist]

I too started scions with that box. Though I ended up getting a bunch of Kasrkin to replace them. Lately I've been using my kasrkin as Carapace vets, so not as militarum tempestus. It's a great box to get started with scions. Now scions have their downfall, in that they must get very close to do their best work, well within charge range, closer if you want to take advantage of the sgt's hot shot pistol (unless you gave him a BP or PP). They lack the requisite wargear to make them painful to charge, as 5th ed stormies, could rapid fire their turn at full BS, then rapidfire at overwatch, and then chuck out 21 attacks in the ensuing combat. Now they'll wilt in close combat, since they really won't do any meaningful damage in the melee.

 

Now if you can keep them out of combat, that's another ball of wax. The taurox prime really shines since it's bristling with firepower. Cruising Speed and firing 2 weapons at full BS is nice. rather than the none that non-fast vehicles get. The prime is a nasty machine, as long as it's on the table, so make the most of it while you have it, because it'll die easily.

 

Scions ability to deep strike is probably their most useful feature. MTC means they ignore Dangerous Terrain tests, so deep strike that 5 man unit into cover and then ruin someone's day.

[Kontakt]

Ditto on starting with that box.

If I am going to a tournament, where winning is everything, I'm still going to play my templars every time. However, if I am just playing a game of 40k, I sure as heck will go for my scions.

I left imperial guard in 6th edition because I wanted to play mostly stormtroopers. This is the book for that itch. It has all those cool toys and tricks and can be painful to deal with by an inexperienced opponent.

 

Edit: Knights are ideal allies for these guys. Srsly.

[Emicus]

Trying to track down the codex (hardcover!) right now... Gotta hold back for as long as I can. I mean I'd at least have to have a colour scheme ready, right? and a few other excuses... Like having to finish assembling the rest of the marines (which has given me an amazing kick in the ass to build them).

[Ubique]

I run my army almost identical to Duz but a bit different:

 

2x MT CS w 3xHSVG and 1xVox

3xMT Scion w 2xPlasmagun/1xPP and 1xvox

2xMT Scion w 2xMeltagun

1xMT Scion w 2xFlamer

2xTaurox Prime w CamNet, Autocannons/Battlecannons

 

That's a bit over 1000 pts there. Usually have an Inquisitor to get the Servoskulls for the deepstrike help as well as keeping the battlecannons on target.

 

All of my special weapons guys are magnetized so I'm considering getting some use out of all those extra Meltas on my sprues and building up 6 more for the command squads. I think that with 4xTL Meltas firing the volume of shots might make an excellent warlord killer unit.

 

Better living through firepower

[Kenderleech]

I mostly play apoc games, so whats 1500 points of support troops look like?

 

CS 4x plasma, plasma pistol

CS 4x hot shot volleys

MT 2x melta (times six)

MT 2x grenades launcher (times 2)

 

as a group effort, they have 23 knight kills, 2 warhounds,  2 stompas, 5 wraithknights, 2 tau whatever it is, 1 greater brass scorpion, and 1 reaver titan kill

[Emicus]

Damn thats a nice tally of Superheavies! I can totally see why you take melta over plasma in that environment too

[duz_]

Plasma is good in the ccs because you can take up to 4 and they're always going to be in range for the twin linked or preferred enemy order

 

Melta for the squads because you're never certain to be in order range and deep striking melta does work on tanks without orders anyways

[Kontakt]

If you have ever seen the glory that is punishing a marine player for bringing terminators by rapid firing a command squad with 4 plasma guns, then you truly understand why these guys are fun to play.

[Tallarn Commander]

Hmm, thanks for the idea!  For some reason, I've never thought about using 4 plasma MT command squads. I've always just taken squads with 4 meltaguns.  I'll have to try the plasma variant out.  

[march10k]

They're godlike when they pepper a foe with 8 twinlinked plasma shots on a perfect deepstrike!

[Kontakt]

Melta command squads are effective, but you have a limited number of command squads.

My current plan is 2 knights causing some serious trouble while the scions arrive from deepstrike. I'll be letting the knights do most of the tank killing.

[Emicus]

And even while deviating the plasma at least has a range up to 24" whereas the melta will be out of luck.

 

Just a shame you only get 1 order per command, imagine getting 2 similar to guard CCS... Could make for some proper havoc

[Kontakt]

The problem is the scions are only getting the equivalent of a PCS. It would seem GW do not see them operating as a company of soldiers on the table, even if the fluff says otherwise.

[Ulrik_Ironfist]

I like to use the scion book as allies. Using them in much the same way as the US's Delta or DEVGRU, or the British SAS, you might deploy the whole Company/Troop but each squad does it's own missions to accomplish the overall objectives, with little reliance on outside orders. The command squad serves the function of a small firetem of weapons specialists to get specific force multiplication tasks accomplished.

 

Honestly I think that the Scion book should have given sgts the option to issue certain orders to their own squads. The orders I'd have given sgts would have been the twin linked order and the fleet order, because that's what sgts should do, make their units shoot better, and move better.

 

Ah well, no big deal, they're still useful as heck, and I'll be using them a lot with my new Raven Guard army.

[march10k]

Delta and DEVGRU are too elite and too small for comparison to scions...I would put them somewhere along the lines of FAST, force recon, or 75th...although 75th is probably slightly under-elite for comparison to scions.

[Kontakt]

   In my opinion, I would not compare scions with modern special forces, since the scions are far more desensitized, resocialized, reprogrammed, brainwashed etc. Their training has been both extensive and harsh to the point of brutality.... and then flying past that point (borderline sadism). Clearly, the brutality and willingness to die in order to meet objectives is something that reeks of spetsnaz. But the professionalism is more western. These are supposedly the best humanity could make a soldier while keeping his anatomy human.

 

That's just an opinion, of course.

[Ulrik_Ironfist]

   In my opinion, I would not compare scions with modern special forces, since the scions are far more desensitized, resocialized, reprogrammed, brainwashed etc. Their training has been both extensive and harsh to the point of brutality.... and then flying past that point (borderline sadism). Clearly, the brutality and willingness to die in order to meet objectives is something that reeks of spetsnaz. But the professionalism is more western. These are supposedly the best humanity could make a soldier while keeping his anatomy human.

 

That's just an opinion, of course.

I think you might be onto something there. That does seem more Spetznaz than USSOCOM. I love stormies, they are absolutely a fantastic part of Imperial Guard lore. I love them.

[Emicus]

Delta and DEVGRU are too elite and too small for comparison to scions...I would put them somewhere along the lines of FAST, force recon, or 75th...although 75th is probably slightly under-elite for comparison to scions.

Too small? When the comparison is billions upon billions of Guardsmen compared to what? 2.2m US forces including the reserves? That's not even a percentage of Cadia alone (est 850million)

 

When you have a couple hundred thousand space marines running around. I reckon you could have a few million Scions and still be as elite as you please.

[march10k]

 

Delta and DEVGRU are too elite and too small for comparison to scions...I would put them somewhere along the lines of FAST, force recon, or 75th...although 75th is probably slightly under-elite for comparison to scions.

Too small? When the comparison is billions upon billions of Guardsmen compared to what? 2.2m US forces including the reserves? That's not even a percentage of Cadia alone (est 850million)

 

When you have a couple hundred thousand space marines running around. I reckon you could have a few million Scions and still be as elite as you please.

 

 

I disagree...anyway, the proper comparison is the half-million in the active army against a couple dozen at most in delta or maybe as many as ten score in the SEALs.  Let's say 100 billion guardsmen.  That would equate to maybe 40 million stormtroopers.  One stormtrooper for every 2500 guardsmen would be inconsistent with the casual contempt that the line troopers in the guard have for them.  We're talking less than a stormtrooper platoon for every 100,000 guardsmen. That's not consistent with them being a frequent enough sight on the battlefield, let alone in rear areas, for regular joes to have the familiarity that is prerequisite to such contempt.  Numbers-wise, contemporary SOF have to be rarer than scions.  Numbers-wise, rangers, given that there's an entire regiment of them among the ~450k on active duty, are a much better comparison...but eliteness-wise, rangers are more like vets with the forward sentries and demolitions doctrines (although rangers would have deepstrike and move through cover, as well...but not carapace and hellguns)

[Kontakt]

In response to scion rarity or numbers:

The lore allows for primitive planets suited only for the crudest of infantry units, as well as technologicly advanced planets whose average troop quality would be similar to Kasrkin or grenadiers. Since the specifics of all imperial planets are not given by GW (obvious reasons), any concept of storm trooper numbers is speculation.

And for my speculation:

1.Since entire regiments and sometimes multiple regiments are obliterated on a halfway regular basis in the fluff, I would lean towards there being a considerable supply of scion regiments.

2.Furthermore, since the best candidates of the schola progenium are often chosen to be commissars for the guard, we can further extrapolate from the apparent number of commissars that the number of scion regiments is certainly finite, but by no means rare.

3. Given the galactic population includes many trillions of humans and many billions of guardsmen, a number of scions in the hundreds of millions would be conservative.

4. Since a regiment is only about a thousand soldiers (especially a SF regiment), we can postulate that there are hundreds of thousands of regiments at any one time.

Still, it's all speculation and opinion.

[Emicus]

There's obviously only one solution. I'll just have to buy them all so I can tally up

[Emicus]

May or may not have managed to score a Militarum Tempestus Storm Scions box :)