what do I need?

[fearlessgod]

Hi guys. I'm a long time played who is returning to the hobby after 6 years of inactivity. I'm dying to get into 30K and the Betrayal at Calth boxed set seems like a great jumping off point. So, I know I need the 40k rulebook, but what book/books are essential to have (to begin playing asap) from FW? I'm looking to do a Ultramarines army if that makes any difference. Any help is appreciated.

[GhostMalone]

Legion crusade army book or the first 3 books from the Istvaan series

[Slips]

Legion crusade army book or the first 3 books from the Istvaan series

Actually not the case since he's playing Ultramarines.

 

LA:CAL and AOD book would be the absolute minimum required or LA:CAL and Book 5 for Ultramarines and Book 6 for the units that book adds alongside any other RoWs and stuff.

 

That'd change when they finally update LA:CAL though.

[depthcharge12]

Do you have an idea of what you want your army to look like? Do you have a vision? :)

[GhostMalone]

Derp my bad I forgot it was ultras!

[fearlessgod]

Do you have an idea of what you want your army to look like? Do you have a vision?

Hmmm. Not sure if I really have a "vision" yet. To be honest, I'm coming back to the hobby looking for fun and something to keep me busy. I am an older player (bought the first WHFB rules in 1982) and am trying to get past the passing of my wife. I stopped playing when she got sick and I'm looking to use the hobby as an escape from my sadness.

As far as what I want from my army.... I want a fun and fluff based army that I can use against all comers. I was heavily into tournament play, but I grew tired of trying to squeeze every ounce of effectiveness from every army I played. I want an army to take to my LGS or GW store and have fun with. Boys before toys, so lots of tacticals backed up by a few elite/heavy choices is what I'm looking for. I'm interested in playing for fluff and fun nowadays. Not sure if this helps, but it's all I got right now.

[marine7312000]

Do you have an idea of what you want your army to look like? Do you have a vision?

Hmmm. Not sure if I really have a "vision" yet. To be honest, I'm coming back to the hobby looking for fun and something to keep me busy. I am an older player (bought the first WHFB rules in 1982) and am trying to get past the passing of my wife. I stopped playing when she got sick and I'm looking to use the hobby as an escape from my sadness.

As far as what I want from my army.... I want a fun and fluff based army that I can use against all comers. I was heavily into tournament play, but I grew tired of trying to squeeze every ounce of effectiveness from every army I played. I want an army to take to my LGS or GW store and have fun with. Boys before toys, so lots of tacticals backed up by a few elite/heavy choices is what I'm looking for. I'm interested in playing for fluff and fun nowadays. Not sure if this helps, but it's all I got right now.

First off, my condolences. I'd suggest getting the Betrayal at Calth box to start in addition to book to Book 5 Tempest. The Legion Astartes book should be getting an update soon so I'd hold off on that. Take a look through the Heresy models on Forgeworld and see what you like, for the most part every legion can take every model.

[Reldn]

Greetings all! I've recently boarded the heresy train, and, thanks to Betrayal at Calth? I'm able to start a decent (plastic!) Word Bearers army.

I just have hit one snag: I'm completely new to a 30k-era army and am not entirely certain what I truly have to work with between One-and-a-half boxes of BaC. (One box will be assembled as per the game: UM vs WB.) plus some extra Mk. IV Tacs for Heavy/special weapons bearers.

It seems like Legion Veteran squads operate like 40k's regular Tactical Marine squads, and the 30k Tac squad seems to be 20 Marines with all Bolters, and/or Close Combat weapons? I know from Bac I can at least assemble some Veteran squads and/or regular Tac squads as well as a Contemptor and some Cataphractii, but, what else can I create, unit-wise for my Word bearers out of these boxes? Thanks in advance!

[Jerichus]

First off, Welcome to the Heresy Brother! (although you do side with the treacherous Horus...)

Thankfully for you, there are quite a few things in the B@C(Betrayal at Calth) set that lend themselves to the XVII Legion.

First things first, I would recommend getting either the AOD + Crusade Legions red books or the requisite black books so you can have the rules to play. I know it hurts to spend money on the books instead of more models; but it really is necessary.

as an additional note, WB can ally with Daemons; making them one of the cheapest legions if you choose to go that route.

Now, from what I recall the Word Bearers are one of the factions that can footslog quite well due to their LD bonuses, so you probably won't have to buy too many transports if you don't want to. The chaplain/Dark Apostle that comes in the set is almost required to play the bearers of the word(You have to bring a Dark Apostle or Centurion as a 2nd HQ) and all of the HQ's can become minor psykers! Your Cataphractii are useful for both escorting your Termi HQ(whether he's a centurion or a Praetor) and for being a tough-as-nails anvil. I'd recommend regular tac squads in preference to vets to help bring weight of fire and bodies(I'm partial to 2x 15 man tacs myself).

There are enough power weapons/special weapons to make a couple tactical support squads, which are like 40k tac squads that all have special weps(in a transport with either plasma for TEQ-killing/distraction, melta to make vehicles cry or even flamers to roast some Loyalists), or a vet squad(you could run them with the Apostle as a hard-hitting hammer to follow up the Termis.). You could also make a couple Heavy Supports with missile launchers or some seekers with the combi-weps(Heavy supports are like devs but they all take the same weapon and seekers are sneaky types that have preferred enemy on one enemy unit you declare)

Really the WB are one of the most flexible legions and the B@C kit is really good for starting off! as you can see you've got tons of options, and whether you go for all vets all the time or for the drown-them-in-bodies approach, you'll have a good base from which to jump off. Their unique units are all fun and useful (I can heartily say Gal Vorbak are some of the most terrifying(/beautiful) things I've ever seen) and their characters are quite good, not to mention Lorgar is awesome(simultaneously one of the cheapest points-wise and one of the strongest power wise given he gets his psychic powers off. Did I mention he is currently one of the very few heresy characters with ML3?)

Anyhow, I hope this was of assistance, and godspeed on your journey into the heresy!

[Kodiak599]

So, like the title says, I want to get started in the world of 30k.  I like power armor, I like fighting power armor, I feel like 30k is alot better balanced than 40k.  I'm even willing to sell off my grey knights to fund my descent in (forgeworld) madness.  But I have a few questions before I take that step.

 

1 - What rulebooks do I need?  Forgeworlds website isn't exactly easy to tell what I need.  I don't know if I'm playing "good" or "bad" (not sure what the sides were called) but i do know that I need a rulebook.

 

2 - I know a great starting point in B@C, that dreadnought model......drools.  But I know nothing of force org or compositions in 30k, is a basic rulebook included with B@C?

 

3 - What legion to choose?  I have played Vanilla in 40k as Ultramarines, Salamanders, and Raven Guard.  I like mechanized and strike forces (entire salamanders army was in pods....including the dreads).  And I have always like the Thousand Suns and Iron Legion fluff.  This is honestly my biggest issue after finding what rules I need.  If I can read about the armies easily I might be able to make a decision easier, but I am extremely indecisive on my army.

 

4 - I hope I understand this correctly, but can 30k play against 40k?  I know they use the same statlines, but are they similarly balanced?  There are not (if any) 30k players in my area, and as much as I love modeling and painting (i truly do) I want to be able to play as well.

 

Thanks in advance for any answers!

[Slips]

So, like the title says, I want to get started in the world of 30k.  I like power armor, I like fighting power armor, I feel like 30k is alot better balanced than 40k.  I'm even willing to sell off my grey knights to fund my descent in (forgeworld) madness.  But I have a few questions before I take that step.

 

1 - What rulebooks do I need?  Forgeworlds website isn't exactly easy to tell what I need.  I don't know if I'm playing "good" or "bad" (not sure what the sides were called) but i do know that I need a rulebook.

 

2 - I know a great starting point in B@C, that dreadnought model......drools.  But I know nothing of force org or compositions in 30k, is a basic rulebook included with B@C?

 

3 - What legion to choose?  I have played Vanilla in 40k as Ultramarines, Salamanders, and Raven Guard.  I like mechanized and strike forces (entire salamanders army was in pods....including the dreads).  And I have always like the Thousand Suns and Iron Legion fluff.  This is honestly my biggest issue after finding what rules I need.  If I can read about the armies easily I might be able to make a decision easier, but I am extremely indecisive on my army.

 

4 - I hope I understand this correctly, but can 30k play against 40k?  I know they use the same statlines, but are they similarly balanced?  There are not (if any) 30k players in my area, and as much as I love modeling and painting (i truly do) I want to be able to play as well.

 

Thanks in advance for any answers!

If you want the books, refer to this thread:

http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/321184-new-to-30k-what-books-do-i-need/?do=findComment&comment=4356373

 

You will still need the 40k Standard BRB for play.

 

If you need help selecting a Legion, refer to this one:

http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/320317-the-legion-for-you-part-two-electric-boogaloo/

 

30k Standard Force Org (there are quite a few variations)

• 3 HQ
• 6 Troops
• 4 Elites
• 3 Fast Attack
• 3 Heavy Support 
• 1 Lord of War
• 1 Fortification

B@C is a standalone game and contains no rules to play 30k with.

 

40k vs 30k is not recommended since 30k was built from the ground up and balanced internally with itself in mind thus the power levels are not in line with each other in the first place even though 40k isnt in line with itself to begin with.

 

From an old FAQ that went over the subject:

 

Q: Are the armies and units in the Horus Heresy books by Forge World meant to be used in games against regular Codex armies, such as say Grey Knights or Orks?

 

A: While Forge World’s on-going range of Horus Heresy books and their game content are all designed to use and be compatible with the Warhammer 40,000 rules, they have been fine-tuned and focused on playing battles in the milieu of the Horus Heresy rather than in conjunction with the Codexes representing warfare in the 41st Millennium, and this will remain the case.

 

Designer’s Note: This means that while you are, of course, free to have fun and play games against your friends using any forces you like, and Horus Heresy forces will be broadly ‘a fair fight’ with Codex forces of the same scale, certain rules anomalies and inconsistencies may be thrown up that you have to deal with, although these should not seriously affect the game in most cases. (For example, certain units, such as those with the Stubborn special rule are at a premium costing in Horus Heresy armies over their regular Codex counterparts, owing to the results of play testing within their own sphere.)

 

In terms of using Lords of War and the Primarchs, however, these are definitely not intended to be used in standard Warhammer 40,000 games, but only in games where both sides use the Age of Darkness Force Organisation chart, and the specific provisions within, and in games of 2,000 points or greater.

 

Designer’s Note: So if, for example, you wanted to play a battle representing a narrative where the Sons of Horus Legion fought Orks or Eldar during the Great Crusade, you could quite easily use those xenos forces’ Warhammer 40,000 Codexes (possibly house-ruled to accommodate larger squads) to proxy for their Heresy-era counterparts. In this case, however, both sides should be using the Age of Darkness Force Organisation chart, with the army’s own Apocalypse level units and flyers available as Lords of War entries following the guidelines found on page 184 of Betrayal.

https://www.forgeworld.co.uk/resources/fw_site/fw_pdfs/Horus_Heresy/Betrayal_FAQ_Errata_V2.pdf

 

Here is the most recent 7th ed FAQ: https://www.forgeworld.co.uk/resources/fw_site/fw_pdfs/Horus_Heresy/Horus_Heresy_7th_Edition.pdf

[Reldn]

First off, Welcome to the Heresy Brother! (although you do side with the treacherous Horus...)

Thankfully for you, there are quite a few things in the B@C(Betrayal at Calth) set that lend themselves to the XVII Legion.

First things first, I would recommend getting either the AOD + Crusade Legions red books or the requisite black books so you can have the rules to play. I know it hurts to spend money on the books instead of more models; but it really is necessary.

as an additional note, WB can ally with Daemons; making them one of the cheapest legions if you choose to go that route.

Now, from what I recall the Word Bearers are one of the factions that can footslog quite well due to their LD bonuses, so you probably won't have to buy too many transports if you don't want to. The chaplain/Dark Apostle that comes in the set is almost required to play the bearers of the word(You have to bring a Dark Apostle or Centurion as a 2nd HQ) and all of the HQ's can become minor psykers! Your Cataphractii are useful for both escorting your Termi HQ(whether he's a centurion or a Praetor) and for being a tough-as-nails anvil. I'd recommend regular tac squads in preference to vets to help bring weight of fire and bodies(I'm partial to 2x 15 man tacs myself).

There are enough power weapons/special weapons to make a couple tactical support squads, which are like 40k tac squads that all have special weps(in a transport with either plasma for TEQ-killing/distraction, melta to make vehicles cry or even flamers to roast some Loyalists), or a vet squad(you could run them with the Apostle as a hard-hitting hammer to follow up the Termis.). You could also make a couple Heavy Supports with missile launchers or some seekers with the combi-weps(Heavy supports are like devs but they all take the same weapon and seekers are sneaky types that have preferred enemy on one enemy unit you declare)

Really the WB are one of the most flexible legions and the B@C kit is really good for starting off! as you can see you've got tons of options, and whether you go for all vets all the time or for the drown-them-in-bodies approach, you'll have a good base from which to jump off. Their unique units are all fun and useful (I can heartily say Gal Vorbak are some of the most terrifying(/beautiful) things I've ever seen) and their characters are quite good, not to mention Lorgar is awesome(simultaneously one of the cheapest points-wise and one of the strongest power wise given he gets his psychic powers off. Did I mention he is currently one of the very few heresy characters with ML3?)

Anyhow, I hope this was of assistance, and godspeed on your journey into the heresy!

Thank you for the advice! Also, if it's any consolation? I'm planning on a small force of either UM (Invictarus Suzerains!) or Salamanders (Pyroclasts!) as well as my Word Bearers. *laughs*

I do currently have the Crusade Army List and HH Book 2: Massacre. With the Age of Darkness List on its way to me. I just haven't had much time to sit down and really dig into it.

I'm not too sure how I want to run my Word Bearers at the moment, but, it's definitely nice to know that they're flexible so I've got options! Thanks again for your help!

[Iduddy]

For UM you need the Crusade Army list red book and Book 5 for the rules.  IDK if UM are in the AOD book yet, since my AOD book is coming in the mail ATM.

[Ishagu]

They are in the latest AoD book, yes :-)