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Pass the salt: Blood Angels decurion rumors/wishlisting


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Ok, get out the salt shakers. Get out on the barrel of salt. Heck, even break into the desalination plants:

 

**********NONE OF THIS IS CONFIRMED OR EVEN REMOTELY CLOSE TO IT in any way, shape, or form. ************

 

 

There are rumors of "There will be two new campaign books this year, covering Blood Angels, Grey 

Knights, Tyranids and Orks, and will include formations for all of them. 
This is because they are the pre-formation codexes." 

http://natfka.blogspot.com/2016/04/40k-and-aos-rumors-blood-angels.html 

 

 

Time to whip out the wishlists and start compiling what we would all like to see the most from a Blood Angels Decurion. Be honest....you have done it yourself! There's about a thousand other posts on here talking about our ideas, but with the above news, it could be fun to dare to dream just a little bit. 

 

For starters, here's my rampant dream list:

 

-be called something remotely more creative than "Bloody Strike Force of Blood Spear bathed in Blood." Like maybe "Seraphim Strike Force?" or "The Avenging Host"?

 

-NOT be just a repackaging of the bazillion Formations from the Shield of Baal campaigns. Some originality and creativity that brings BA within grasp of their peers would be nice.

 

-Assuming nothing with the BA's core stats/features changes (so our "Chapter Tactics" is still "just" Furious Charge)....stackable Detachment bonuses providing some combination of permanent +1 Initiative (not just on Charge), +1 Attack across the board and/or Rage, Fleet, Counter-Attack, Relentless (i.e. "Relentless within 6" of an Objective controlled by the enemy"), or "All Transports count as Assault Vehicles" would be awesome. I am not asking for ALL of these, just any sort of combo of any of those would be both fluffy and crunchy

 

-some form of Assaulting the same Turn you Deep Strike

 

-some form of Deep Striking Jump Packs Turn 1

 

-some upgrade to Razorbacks that gives them Skyfire/Interceptor (think the "Linebacker" upgrade for the M3 Bradley IFV)

 

-some form of "Red Wing": Flyers get +1 Jink (re-rollable? or is that just too much?) and +1BS against Flyers, and/or Strafing Run (screw my above idea...who needs AA tanks?) 

 

-....getting more Flyers than just Stormravens: Stormtalons, Baal-Pattern Stormtalon (completely made up idea that last one)? 

 

-What would reduce grown men to tears: some form of Encarmine Fury from 30k (  Blood Angels require one less than they normally need to wound in assault to a minimum of 2+. )....So regardless of whether you Charged or not, you are wounding other SM on a minimum of 3+ at all times

 

-some sort of Sanguinary Conclave, where they give 4+ FNP in a bubble

 

-some sort of Chaplain Conclave.....Erelim! (that would help that new BA Chaplain sell!)

 

-some rule that says any HQ choice that brings a Jump Pack makes Assault Marines count as Troops

 

-Dante getting Orbital Bombardment and/or a 2nd additional Warlord Trait (for a max of THREE) if he is the Warlord of the Decurion (hey, he's 1200 years old...he's learned a few tricks). 

 

-Encarmine Swords being S+2 AP3, Melee, Master-Crafted (so they are at least on par with Relic Blades)

 

-Death Mask upgrades for SG providing a +1 Invuln Save (so 6++ native, 4++ when receiving Shield of Sanguinius)

 

-Sanguinary Guard getting 

 

 

NOTE: 

Before you start hating: The above is semi-silly wishlisting. 

 

"Safe" bets that we are actually most likely to see:

-Dreadnoughts getting 4 Attacks base (DC Dreads getting 5 Base? "stop that! That belongs above in dreamland!")

-Scouts getting WS4/BS4

-Terminators getting base cost reduction

-Vanguard/Sternguard veterans getting wargear price reductions

-TechMarines getting 2 Wounds

(and any other of the "obvious" ones we have been asking to get FAQ'ed)

-Grav cannons and shtuff

-some sort of Librarius Conclave

-squadrons for vehicles

 

 

Dream on.

 

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Random dice roll after each combat (won or lost) that can result in guys turning into Death Company... Wait, I've heard that before... ;)

 

Landspeeder storm? Thunderfire?

 

How about a formation that gives Devastators relentless and pinning and Assault Squads can charge the turn they arrive from deepstrike? Actually that's probably a bit broken...

 

I like the idea that captains with jump pack makes Ass Marines troops, harks back to good ol' days and is similar to the bikes rule. Either way i kinda expect a deepstrike bonus from our Decurion and some CC buff. I'd also like a general improvement in our 'Chapter Tactics'. Whilst I'm not complaining about Furious Charge, Red thirst built into every unit would be nice. It also doesn't make fluff sense that only some FORMATIONS/detachments get it... 'I can only be angry if I have the correct combination of Brothers around me...'

 

Chapter Master, Reclusiarch etc. would be nice.

 

What about Sanguinius returning from the dead? I heard he doesn't like all those Wulfen running around...

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How about a formation that gives Devastators relentless and pinning and Assault Squads can charge the turn they arrive from deepstrike? Actually that's probably a bit broken...

I see what you did there.

 

I like the idea that captains with jump pack makes Ass Marines troops, harks back to good ol' days and is similar to the bikes rule.

Making units troops is pretty much unnecessary in 7th ed. Just give them ObSec natively and you have all you could want.

 

Either way i kinda expect a deepstrike bonus from our Decurion and some CC buff. I'd also like a general improvement in our 'Chapter Tactics'.

5th Ed Furious Charge (i.e. +1I is part of FC) would be nice.

 

Whilst I'm not complaining about Furious Charge, Red thirst built into every unit would be nice. It also doesn't make fluff sense that only some FORMATIONS/detachments get it... 'I can only be angry if I have the correct combination of Brothers around me...'

QFT

 

Chapter Master, Reclusiarch etc. would be nice.

+1

 

What about Sanguinius returning from the dead? I heard he doesn't like all those Wulfen running around...

Hopefully not. Sanguinius is dead, even deader than Girlyman. While having at least one active loyalist primarch would be awesome, resurrecting him would cheapen his sacrifice.

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I sort of miss the 3rd edition red thirst rule, where you roll a one, and it forces you to move to the enemy. But that won't be coming back.

 

Anyways, I hope we aren't fighting the 'nids in this one. I would rather fight Orks or chaos, but I know it will most likely be the tyranids. I also hope they add in some stuff about successors other than the flesh tearers.

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Okay, so... You want a Decurion do you?

 

PERSONALLY between red marines and our book I'm happy.

 

BUT! We'll get one one day and I just hope to god it's better than the wolves, theirs is very iffy with not many choices. That or Vanilla are spoiled.

 

By looking at the other Marine factions we can give a pretty good estimate to what our formations will look like though, and what may even just be a copy and paste with some tweaking.

 

But before that we have individual unit changes:

 

Baals need a squadron bonus: 3 of them gives them scout back. Simple.

 

The Sanguinor: I'd totally redo this guy, I'd make it so he has the stats he has now, but chooses one HQ/ MC/ GMC/ LoW in the enemy army and while that is alive and out of combat he is SUPERMAN, but must move towards that unit and attempt to challenge/ kill it. If he does BA get a bonus, if he fails the army goes crazy and starts charging the enemy 3rd edition style!

 

Tycho: His glove is now AP3 with the option to Smash attack (half attacks, double S, AP2).

 

Scout: WS/BS4

 

Dreads: 4A, DC ones have 5.

 

COMMAND BENEFITS:

 

Red Thirst: +1I on the Charge. +1I is very powerful. Remember this will affect the entire decurion, which I think is where it's power will lie. Also, we ignore the penalty for disordered charges. Perfect.

 

Company Support: Free Transports. It'll happen, you know it will. Red wunz go fasta though ya gitz! A Dream would be being able to assault from Rhinos with some sort of condition, maybe disordered overriding the above (and our FC/ Red Thirst bonus?).

 

CORE:

 

Easily extrapolated from the other codecii. Assault Company may be a stretch, as DA have only one core choice.

 

Demi Company: Tried and True. Our new version will probably have the option for a Furioso, and bikes as an option of the assault squad like the Vanilla one or possibly the chance for more assault squads, although I expect them to have thier own formation. Also Obj Sec. So:

 

We actually already have this but with the BSF it is literally useless, as all it does is give you Red Thirst but force you into the 3 Tacs, 1 Assault, 1 Dev, Boring Dread + Cap/ Chap. I imagine it will just be improved unless GW do the worst copy and paste job ever and take it from Exterminatus (yes, I'm worried too).

 

Assault Company: I'm not sure if this will be a thing, but if GW are listening I know a few of you have leagues of Assault Marines that you want to use, and the FTSF just. Isn't. Enough! My guess is that it'll be similar to the Hunting Force formation that white scars get for bikes.

 

Captain or Chaplain, 2-5 Assault Squads, 1-3 Land Speeder Squads, 1 Furioso in Drop Pod. Everyone must have a jump pack and arrive by deep strike. One less D6 Scatter. Possibly something like RG's double jump pack usage.

 

COMMAND:

 

Strike Force Command: Captain or Chaplain (can be replaced with Dante/ Seth/ Astorath/ Tycho/ Karlean/ Malakim Phoros), 0-1 Command Squad, 0-1 Sanguinary Guard (I'm hesitant to include these guys here but Vanilla get honour guard so screw it).

 

Librarius Conclave: Same but we can sub in Mephiston.

 

Sanguinary Priesthood: 3-5 Priests. Corbulo can be one of them. We all want this a LOT.

 

AUXILIARY:

 

Armored Task Force: Same as the vanilla dex, but Baals included. 1 Techmarine, 3-5 Tank units. Ignore Shaken/ Stunned when within 6" of the Techy (better give him a jump pack) and he get's +1 to repair rolls.

 

Dreadnought Coven: 3-5 Dreads and a Techmarine. Normal, Furioso, Librarian available. Dreads all make a unit together and at 3+ they get re-rolls to hit in combat and make BA within 6 Stubborn. Being within 6 of the Techy grants IWND. Lifted from the Wolves.

 

10th Company Assault Coordination Force: 5 Scouts/ Scout bikes. All sarges must be upgraded to veteran but gain a locator beacon. Units arriving from Deep Strike (NOT PODS) within range of 3 or more beacons may charge on the turn they arrive. This could be hideously powerful, but hell if it isn't fluffy and adds some nice synergy. 5 Units and having the sarges alive makes it a good points/ power ratio.

 

The Black Rage: Strike force Mortalis without the need for Storm Ravens. 1 Chaplain (Or Lemartes), 3-5 DC squads, 1-3 DC Dreads (Or Moriar) and option for Crazy Tycho if he's not in the command choice. Same rampage-lite and crusader.  Paint yourself black and paint them red.

 

Archangels Sanguine Wing: I actually think this formation is fine as is inside Exterminatus. 2 Vanguard and 1 Sternguard units and a Raven is a hefty investment but it get's you 400ish points of free gear. I'd probably take away the "must be 10 models" restriction though.

 

Archangel Paragons: 3-5 Terminator/ Assault Terminator Units. Can shoot and run when they arrive from deep strike and arrive together on a single roll. Fear & Fearless. Preferred enemy against a single target. Combo of ours and the vanilla one with more emphasis on deep strike than imposing leadership negatives.

 

The Sanguine Host: 1-3 Sanguinary Guard, Optional Sanguinor. Deathmasks are free upgrade. One squad must have a banner. Sanguinor gets a power boost depending on how many Sanguinary guard units are near him or having the Sanguinor gives them an invuln? I'm unsure what to do here really...

 

Skyhammer Annihilation Force: You know what this is and you dream about a red version of it. 'nuff said.

 

 

Personally, I'd say that's pretty damn awesome! I'm intrigued to see what of this may com true :P

 

Maybe i'll add more to this, but this was a good hours work :') Enjoy fraters!

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I just want a librarian conclave with furioso dreadnoughts. 5 AV13 dreadnoughts flying around with boosted stats? Yes please.

I considered having them in the conclave but it felt weird when there was a dread formation. Could work though.

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I have some thoughts on this wish listing crusade. 1. I'm sorry but as a practicality think we'll just get a repack of the formations in one codex. 2. What attributes and units should define BA, who are we really at this point? 3) How can the rules be adjusted to bring what we are into our best light? 

 

I both love and hate when the fluff or storylines advance. Emphasis and nuance on attributes of the sons of Baal changes as things go along. The Angels are in a tough spot rules wise though. As the fluff fills out with every space marine chapter now having measurable popularity as opposed to a single obscure paragraph in some codex, it's hard to determine exactly what the Blood Angels should be. What i mean is particular units seem more and more hardened into specific chapters now--e.g. bikes to white scars, jump packs to raven guard, land speeders to dark angels. Likewise even the feel of Blood Angels is a little crowded out, they certainly aren't the only chapter with anger issues and a penchant for close combat.

 

The reason I'm saying this is because codex changes and formations have actually succeeded in getting some armies to play and feel just like the codex artwork (take necrons for example, just impossible to kill and as much as I complain, their slow and inevitable advance is probably exactly how they should play). It's easy enough to achieve a glorious last stand on the table top these days with BA, but there's also something to be said about staying with the competition. So, what would make them comparable, not even 'broken' in a rules/meta sense? I think/hope GW can make this happen (maybe it's no better than muttering 'the emperor protects').

 

Still, what they need are formations to improve gameplay outside the straight up statistical comparisons. I think formations can be an additional filter/lense in which to view the old points based analysis of balancing play. However, the current formations aren't the best.  An initiative bonus on the charge is nice, but it only comes into play in limited circumstances, e.g. on the charge, generally against I5 or lower, non-unwieldy weapons. Comparatively toughness seems to have more impact. Hit and Run really seems to have more impact. But even more than saying I'd like a different special rule, I'd like formations that put the units in a better tactical position--Death company are great, but running across the table under threat of S8 AP3 blasts or whatever is not so great. Even hugging cover only goes so far, and there are a lot of really mean assault units now. And even if we get skyhammer or similar, we don't have rerolls shooting or hit and run, so these formations would be likely be suboptimal. Instead I hope that if GW wants to keep the I5, furious charge, and feel no pain, that formations are developed to accentuate this strength and provide a method to reliably deliver this strength into combat with some level of success. 

 

Drop Death company to BS 1 and bring them to WS 6! 

Bring back the Reclusiarch!!!

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The cynical side of me is guessing they'll just take different Formations from Shield of Baal and piece them together into a Decurion.

 

The Dante's Avenging Host may be the blueprint for what that could look like, for starters.

 

The dreamer part of me hopes they get some original ideas and that are both fluffy and nasty. The Counter-Charge ability for the Space Wolves Decurion is pretty interesting, and would actually make more logical sense for us if they want us to be THE Charge-centric Faction (Furious Charge, Rage, etc...). However, since that's the Wulfen's shtick now, I am speculating that perhaps the BA will skew the other direction with stuff like universal Rage and Counter-Attack. The +1I as a permanent universal trait is extremely solid...that gives pause to any other MEQ to engage BA at all, but forces that already eat MEQ for breakfast won't be that daunted. I also think variations of Fleet and Relentless of some sort really fit in as well....after all, what's the difference between a Blood Angel and a Khorne Berzerker? The BA knows when to shoot and maneuver as well Charge in and rearrange faces.

 

Further ideas:

-Death Company and/or Sanguinary Guard to be able to Charge 3D6" with Jump Packs

-Death Company get +1T the Turn they Charge into Combat. Nice and fluffy: they are basically normal Astartes but when they lock their blood-crazed eyes on a foe, few things can stop them from reaching their foe

-Dante and Seth get Orbital Bombardment (they are Chapter Masters, after all). Dante can use his prior to arriving by Deep Strike (there's a fun but gripe-worthy rule!)

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oh I do love me some some wish listing,

 

I believe the minimum we will get will be us brought back in line with csm with regards to our dreads, scouts, vv et....

 

The optimist in me thinks we may get something like: 

 

Baal strike force:
command benefits, all rhinos have the assault vehicle special rule and all models with jump packs gain the jink special rule.
company support, no idea but something fun

battle demi company, 1 captain or chaplin, 0-1 command squad, 3 tacticals, 1-3 assault squds, land speeders, bikes. attack bikes. 1 unit of devistatots, 0-1 dread of any kind
strike force comman, special characters here
Auxullary, libby conclave with options for mephiston and libby dreads, armoured task force with rules for baal predators, an updated archangels force, strom raven formation,updated strike force mortalis, a unique formation for sanguinary guard.

 

 

 

then the dreamer in me thinks:

 

sanguinary guard will get base 3 attacks
encarmine swords will get s+1 ap 3 but ap 2 on the charge, axes will get to fight at I on the charge.
the sanguinor will get s5 t5 wounds5 and become a jump monstrous creature
mephiston will get to roll 3 powers as well as keep st10 power
blood talons generate more attacks per kill again
lemartes gets an extra wound and does not take up a slot if in a squad of death company
we get a new flyer
we get a new vehicle, maybe a funky speeder
we get our own artillary piece that has 6 shots s6 rending

 

 

this rumor has got me excited because of how well i think they did the space wolves release

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You know, on one hand I'd welcome a 'decurion' like formation, as most of them grant powerful bonuses. But on the other hand, I'd hate that it would be harder to include FW units like my beloved Sicaran, Fire Raptor and Deredeo Dreadnought; I usually include at least the Sicaran in my lists because I love it.

 

I hope FW makes decurion plugins by adding Auxiliary entries with their units someday soon.

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For the blood Angel strike force, You'll get a generic Demi company type of deal, basically the Battle company from the codex halved. An armoured strike force, maybe with Baal predators included. Probably a librarius conclave, an axillerys that allows you to take more hq's and then just all of the formations from the shield of Baal. Oh and don't forget loads of land speeders wedge into a bunch of formations for no apparent reason. Hopefully you'll get access to grav cannons and evisorators. An evisorators taken by death company would be pretty good.
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So for those who were wondering where exactly the rumor came from, it was posted from a famous (infamous?) comedy website forum under their 40k gaming section. Not sure if they themselves got it from someone else's site so I am not certain who I should credit for this:

 

May as well drop some rumours here.

40k will get a new edition in September. It is a minor clean up of the current rules, they won't even be changing the cover art, and they will put an FAQ that covers the changes online. It's basically an amended reprint.

There will be two new campaign books this year, covering Blood Angels, Grey Knights, Tyranids and Orks, and will include formations for all of them. This is because they are the pre-formation codexes.

The studio knows there are problems with the Ork book, but there is no clear direction as to where they want to go with it in balancing it with the current codices beyond minor rewrites and adding formations. Ork Clan formations are very likely.

GW are married to formations now, and will give the studio a brief of things like do some formations for an army and how much the formation should cost to buy the models for, ie a £200 formation.

On fantasy there will be a tournament format for AoS with points. The sales plummeted for AoS but the current fantasy range sales look healthier than before the change (though how much this is people buying stuff to finish their collections I wasn't told). Feedback on the rules was incredibly poisonous, and GW want to move past it and heal.

Bretonnians were going to be in the next WFB starter before it was scrapped in favour of AoS, meaning there are some lovely plastics that made it to prototyping that will likely never be seen now, including a hero on hippogriff better than the Elf Prince from Island of Blood.

Lord of the Rings will include both the Strategy Battle Game and a new version of War of the Ring where it is possible to play a ranked up fantasy game, because Forgeworld know there is a gap in the market.

Forgeworld will have finished their new production facility at some point next month, though they will not be available to order to store until the production quality issues are solved and they can produce in the volume and quality required.

GW will be launching an anonymous feedback system for staff next month, for a number of reasons. Such as 50% of staff not passing 3 month probation and 25% of staff left not finishing the year, which is an eye watering turnover even for retail. These will be gone through for action points, and followed up at monthly meetings.

Kirby is now gone, and everyone is rejoicing because the new CEO plays the game, won't force people out for telling it to him like it is (as Kirby did to Alessio Calvatore after his presentation to the board where he told them they were pricing out kids, which meant Jervis came back from holiday to find out Alessio had resigned rather than be fired) and actively wants to listen to people.

Forgeworlds star has been rising because of Horus Heresy and Betrayal at Calth, and there are behind the scenes discussions about FW being delivered to store and the Specialist Games range being available through the store.

The new store planograms are here to stay, though some stores don't have enough shelving units.

Kirby in his new adviser to the board hasn't attended a single meeting now the reins of power have passed to Kev Rountree, because they always seem to be held when he is unavailable. Kirby also once loudly and publicly announced no one played games and rules didn;t matter in a Throne of Skulls tournament.

Hopefully Helen Highwater can confirm some of this, as I got it from someone in GW management,, but I don't know how much they might have been yanking my chain.

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It's sorta a "given" that a BA Librarius Conclave will show up. However...I think it would be more interesting if it does NOT allow you to substitute Mephiston. Hear me out: Mephy is a unique dude, both fluff and crunchwise. He is held in both awe and fear to such a degree by even his own brethren that having him conform to a traditional Conclave format does not seem to do his character justice.  I think it would cool and original if they recognize that by giving him his entirely own auxiliary Formation within the "Blood Decurion" format. Something that gives him special rules, of course, that bring him to wear he "should be" (assuming no Codex release boosts his native stats prior). Btw, why the heck isn't Mephy's Force Sword Master-Crafted? It just seems so weird to me. 

 

Ditto for the Sanguinor. If ever there was a character that deserved a "Formation of One" status its him. 

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Mephiston is still Chief Librarian though, he'd lead the others and command them. His rules are pretty good as is, so I'd just have him in the Concalve personally.

 

Need the Sanguinor by himself though. I want my rules for him to be real. Silver bullet superman FTW.

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I personally think that +1I only when you're the one doing the charging is a pathetically weak "chapter tactic".

 

I'd prefer the following 2 rules as chapter tactics:

 

The Red Thirst

+1 Initiative at all times on all units.

Upon receiving a wound from an over watch shot, any Blood Angels unit may roll 2d6 and discard the lowest result. On a roll of 5 or 6, the wound is ignored. On a 3 or 4, that model is removed as a casualty after 1 round of combat, on a roll of 1 or 2 the model is removed as a casualty as normal.

 

Orbital Insertion

Blood Angels units deployed via Deep Strike scatter 1d6 less than normal and may chose to either assault or shoot (but not both) upon arrival. This may stack with Decent of Angels or other rules of similar nature. (note: his deliberately DOES NOT include models arriving in a pod. Jump packs or TDA only)

 

If we're going to be a close combat chapter, we need to be able to get to combat. We take losses from shooting while jumping up the board, we charge and get shot during our own turn, then if we make it to combat, the enemy gets to swing back in our turn again. We take far too much punishment before we even get into combat. The ability to strike faster in combat and avoid some of that incoming fire fits perfectly with our close-combat preference. Decent of Angels is another thematic fit, whether it's teleporting onto Space Hulks or orbital insertion via drop-pod, Storm Raven, Thunder Hawk or simple jump packs, the Blood Angels are the masters of accurate and timely arrivals.

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I personally think that +1I only when you're the one doing the charging is a pathetically weak "chapter tactic".

 

I'd prefer the following 2 rules as chapter tactics:

 

The Red Thirst

+1 Initiative at all times on all units.

Upon receiving a wound from an over watch shot, any Blood Angels unit may roll 2d6 and discard the lowest result. On a roll of 5 or 6, the wound is ignored. On a 3 or 4, that model is removed as a casualty after 1 round of combat, on a roll of 1 or 2 the model is removed as a casualty as normal.

 

Orbital Insertion

Blood Angels units deployed via Deep Strike scatter 1d6 less than normal and may chose to either assault or shoot (but not both) upon arrival. This may stack with Decent of Angels or other rules of similar nature. (note: his deliberately DOES NOT include models arriving in a pod. Jump packs or TDA only)

 

If we're going to be a close combat chapter, we need to be able to get to combat. We take losses from shooting while jumping up the board, we charge and get shot during our own turn, then if we make it to combat, the enemy gets to swing back in our turn again. We take far too much punishment before we even get into combat. The ability to strike faster in combat and avoid some of that incoming fire fits perfectly with our close-combat preference. Decent of Angels is another thematic fit, whether it's teleporting onto Space Hulks or orbital insertion via drop-pod, Storm Raven, Thunder Hawk or simple jump packs, the Blood Angels are the masters of accurate and timely arrivals.

 

Completely agree. That's why some form of Fleet (whether as part of "Chapter Tactics" or Formation buffs) would be a VERY glad addition.

 

My game last night I missed 2x key charges with my DC because I rolled a 6 and a 7 when I need a 7 and a 8 respectively. That's simply unacceptable for a Faction who's entire shtick has become "hope you get the charge, buddy!"

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