Terminator Chaplain and Death Company, Yay or Nay?

[appiah4]

Assuming they will be deployed via something the Terminator Chaplain can fit in (Drop Pod, Storm Raven, Land Raider), would you field a Terminator Chaplain alongside Death Company?  The 2+/4++ sounds like a great way to tank AP2 shots and I normally field a PA Chaplain with them anyway so it's a marginal points upgrade?  And the model is awesome, so..  Rule of Cool should win, no?

[Xenith]

Yes.

 

He will stop them from Sweeping advancing, though, so you might not be able to lock things in combat and get left out to dry in your opponent's turn.

[appiah4]

Yes.

 

He will stop them from Sweeping advancing, though, so you might not be able to lock things in combat and get left out to dry in your opponent's turn.

 

I know, but how bad is it in reality?  Has anyone tried?  It's not like losing Sweeping Advance is a game breaker - at worst you get a chance to destroy a unit that has already been crippled and likely won't do any damage back in their shooting turn..  And if you could actually Sweeping Advance you would probably have wiped them out, and ended up exposed anyway, considering you can't consolidate into another combat - this ain't no 3rd Edition no more son :)  Not to mention that the whole point of the Chaplain is to make the unit draw more fire away from the army and shrug that damage off easier?

[NTaW]

I'd sooner take Astorath, maybe DC Tycho if you just want to tank wounds. Not being able to sweep an opponent has been a great hindernace to me in the past.

[appiah4]

I'd sooner take Astorath, maybe DC Tycho if you just want to tank wounds. Not being able to sweep an opponent has been a great hindernace to me in the past.

DC Tycho doesnt buff the squad and you cant put astorath in a pod or land raider.

[evildrcheese]

Why would you want DC in a pod/LR? Jumppacks are now reasonably costed and the mobility is a strength of the DC. Besides sweeping units can be huge, like if you're trying to churn through a blob of Cron Warriors.

 

EDC

[Dont-Be-Haten]

I would rather put a chappy on a bike with JP Death Company rather than TDA with foot slogging DC. I do have non JP DC as well as JP DC and both fill different rolls. So to answer the OP No. I would not take a TDA Chaplain with Death Company.

[ServoBadger]

I have a Terminator Chaplain, a load of foot DC and a LRC.  I'm going to have to give this a go. :)

 

I love the Terminator Chaplain model too.  I don't run him often, but when I've run him in the past it's been with five LC Terminators in the LRC.

[NTaW]

 

I'd sooner take Astorath, maybe DC Tycho if you just want to tank wounds. Not being able to sweep an opponent has been a great hindernace to me in the past.

DC Tycho doesnt buff the squad and you cant put astorath in a pod or land raider.

No, but I thought the point was to tank wounds with a 2+/4++ not necessarily Zealot or fitting into all of the transport options. You could play Tycho with your Chaplain in the transport, though that is dependant on how many points you want to spend on the unit.

 

I like the terminator model a lot too, but would sooner field it with fellow terminators.

[appiah4]

Why would you want DC in a pod/LR? Jumppacks are now reasonably costed and the mobility is a strength of the DC. Besides sweeping units can be huge, like if you're trying to churn through a blob of Cron Warriors.

 

EDC

 

What kind of question is this?  I would want DC in a Pod for a million reasons.  Being able to deploy them wherever I wish being at the top of the list.

[evildrcheese]

Sure you can deploy them wherever you want, but you won't be able the charge anything until T2 at the earliest, and worse you leave them open to being counter charged and losing out on all their on the charge bonuses.

 

Then to top it off they are then forced to footslog it across the board...from my experience slow assault based units don't strike fear in to the heart of the enemy.

 

I'm struggling to see the appeal to be honest. A LR is a better option but even then I'm not convinced about the TDA Chappy, losing the potential to sweep xenos is huge.

 

EDC

[CovertToaster]

No, no sweeping advance kinda kills the reason you use melee centric units. Also I think chappy's have lost too much since IC's can't pass around special rules like they used to.

 

As the above people have said Astorath, DC Tycho, or Lemmy is the way to go.

[The Unseen]

If your putting a big squad in a land raider crusader, then yeah. But in general thats a terrible idea, since land raiders are pretty bad, but if you absolutely want to use one, thats the way to do it.. But with 14 DC and a Chappy, nothing lives long enough to get swept. So its a moot point, and the 2+ save on the chappy is really nice. Otherwise, leave the termie armour at home.

[appiah4]

Ok first off personally I use a footslogging Boltgun DC in a pod anyway and apparently this is a revelation to some here but they are a great unit. They dont need the T1 charge (nothing gets a T1 charge anyway) but the point is that they draw fire away from T1 and can use their boltguns to munch soft backfield units. So they arent melee centric but actually a rather very well rounded unit with a purpose of throwing a wrench in the enemy deployment.

 

The appeal of the TDA Chaplain here is that he will make the unit much more resilient ain that role. I dont care about losing SA because if I charged amd broke a unit that would mean its no danger anymore. Please tell me why I should worry about a firewarrior squad down to 3 models with a 2+/4++ FNP unit? And if I had swept it I would still take all the fire from the other units.

[SnorriSnorrison]

Mate, do it then. Personally, I'd put the DC in either a SR or better yet, with Jump Packs. They can still drop down via deepstrike if you want, but as said by others, deepstriking in general leaves them open to countercharges and they'll lose everything they excel in: close combat.

The fact that they can use boltguns to shoot and assault is nice, yes, but I believe their melee attacks are the better option, even without WS5.

 

To the original question: a TDA Chaplain looks boss, no doubt. Chaplains in general are terrible now, though. When they were Reclusiarchs, I'd advise you to take one, no matter what. Now, they're simply bad beatsticks. The unit buff is fairly okay, but I'd take Lemartes over a regular chaplain, since he doesn't use an HQ choice but an elite one(which is silly in its own right).

 

I don't know, really. Footslogging Pod DC I never found appealing because they're so easy to outmanouvre and counter-attack. Boltguns are cool and all that, but that's an expensive Tactical squad you're placing in the middle of the opposing player's deployment zone.

 

 

Snorri

[evildrcheese]

DC are a melee centric unit, just look at their rules. Yeah you could drop them in with bolters, but a Tac squad will do that for cheaper. I could use the thick end of a spanner to bash a nail in a piece of wood; yeah it'll work but is it the best tool for the job?

 

You seem to have made your mind up anyway, so not entirely sure what you were hoping for when you asked the question, but by-and-large the community thinks its sub-optimised.

 

Don't get me wrong, play how you want to play (I love running termies despite the fact that they're actually pretty terrible), just don't be surprised when people say it's not the most effective build/use of a unit.

 

EDC

[Xenith]

DC are a melee centric unit, just look at their rules. Yeah you could drop them in with bolters, but a Tac squad will do that for cheaper. I could use the thick end of a spanner to bash a nail in a piece of wood; yeah it'll work but is it the best tool for the job?

 

 

I think you're missing the point slightly, the DC aren't doing the tacs job, nor can tacs do the DC's job. The DC can drop, put out 20 bolt shots, then charge the next turn with 4A each, after another round of rapid fire.

 

Sure, the opponent can move away from this unit, as they are slow once disembarked, but every move away from this unit should be towards one of your other units.

[evildrcheese]

 

 

DC are a melee centric unit, just look at their rules. Yeah you could drop them in with bolters, but a Tac squad will do that for cheaper. I could use the thick end of a spanner to bash a nail in a piece of wood; yeah it'll work but is it the best tool for the job?

 

I think you're missing the point slightly, the DC aren't doing the tacs job, nor can tacs do the DC's job. The DC can drop, put out 20 bolt shots, then charge the next turn with 4A each, after another round of rapid fire.

 

Sure, the opponent can move away from this unit, as they are slow once disembarked, but every move away from this unit should be towards one of your other units.

I get it, and viewed in a vacuum it's fine, but we can't account for what happens in your opponents turn. The DC getting Counter Charged is what really puts me off, especially if they're charged by another melee centric unit, which without the buffs DC won't be able to handle from my experience.

 

That's why I don't like it, it gives the opponent an opportunity to neutralize the threat of my unit, killing them at worst or locking them in combat them up at best.

 

EDC

[SnorriSnorrison]

DC are a melee centric unit, just look at their rules. Yeah you could drop them in with bolters, but a Tac squad will do that for cheaper. I could use the thick end of a spanner to bash a nail in a piece of wood; yeah it'll work but is it the best tool for the job?

I think you're missing the point slightly, the DC aren't doing the tacs job, nor can tacs do the DC's job. The DC can drop, put out 20 bolt shots, then charge the next turn with 4A each, after another round of rapid fire.

Sure, the opponent can move away from this unit, as they are slow once disembarked, but every move away from this unit should be towards one of your other units.

I get it, and viewed in a vacuum it's fine, but we can't account for what happens in your opponents turn. The DC getting Counter Charged is what really puts me off, especially if they're charged by another melee centric unit, which without the buffs DC won't be able to handle from my experience.

That's why I don't like it, it gives the opponent an opportunity to neutralize the threat of my unit, killing them at worst or locking them in combat them up at best.

EDC

Yeah, that sounds like a vacuum. I believe from what appiah has told us he has used the DC in a pod with success, so let's keep it at that.

If they're in a pod anyway, then a TDA chaplain will add a wound-soaker until there's that melta or battlecannon shot and he or his unit is turned to dust. I don't know what the OP uses as his other HQ, but unless intended to charge things, I'd not put a chaplain in a DC. Then, I don't kit them out for ranged combat because of their insane melee damage output. I just like rolling lots of dice.

To the OP I'd say try it out if you have the model anyways.

If you don't want your DC in close combat, it doesn't matter that they don't get Sweeping Advance, but against all races other than SM that stuff is huge. That would be my biggest gripe with the build.

Because eventually they will wind up in close combat, and if your opponent is either not prepared or unlucky, they might even win. And then that unit gets away, leaving your DC in the open. It is true that they would also be out in the open if they had swept that unit away, but then they'd at least scored a victory point.

On another note: "munch soft backfield units"? This unit can be used to take down things like Riptides and other monstrous things with relative ease, so why munch the soft ones? Surely there are better units to mow down guardsmen-equivalent units in our codex.

Snorri

[Charlo]

From what I can see it's probably not worth it. Astorath is the same as a tank (2+/4++) but also lets the squad retain mobility and buffs them to high heaven.

 

A normal chappy in TDA just restrict movement (unless you are on foot) and sure you can put them in a pod but that bolter salvo (for me at least) isn't as necessary.

 

NOW though, if you are running multiple DC squads, having a Jumpy one with Astorath and a pod bound bolter one with a TDA chaplain would be pretty great.

 

No sweeping advance sucks but I suppose DC will often murderise things so bad that whatever is running away isn't going to be rallying anytime soon...

 

Conversely though, if you are putting them in a LR, I see no reason for a TDA chappy. The only thing he should be tanking is Overwatch and even then that won't be too much unless you are against Tau/ DA, which can still be mitigated with a handy scout squad charging first.