Memento Of Prospero Posted June 2, 2016 Share Posted June 2, 2016 Afternoon dudes and dudettes! I am looking for more in dept information on knight households and would like to shamefully tap into the collective knowledge of breakless train that is the AoD forum. A few things: -Anyone have any more information about House Col'kahk? Other than book 4, there is very little available on them. No scheme for them, and other than the fact that they are intimately tied to Titanicus Legio Atarus (Firebrands) -What's the combat strength of the average Knight Household? I think in Mechanicum the Knight Household who defended the Magma City was 30 strong? -What is usually the size of detachments sent to war, baring the exceptional Freeblades? Does it have a specific name? Thanks in advance for the input ;) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/322915-knight-household-structure-and-logistics/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
GhostMalone Posted June 2, 2016 Share Posted June 2, 2016 Hmmm well I can't help you on the household part as really they've only been covered in book 4 briefly. In saying that you can sort of try discern information, using hermatika as an example; oath bound to Mezoa forgeworld which couldn't produce titans due to unstable surface conditions but could produce alot of knights for the houses Vyronii and makabius aswell. Which in turn makes me see that out of those 3 households only hermatika were fully Mechanicum bonded (compared to the other 2) so from that deduction I can safely assume they'd have access to more knights then the other 2 and any other off world households. Therefore I'd see their knights numbering hundreds or maybe even more as the family is a controlled hierarchy. I therefore think seeing 5 or more knights would be common in the household and they'd have access to more exotic Weapons such as the atropos Styrix and Maegera etc etc. So I'd consider following the same sort of thought process, after all this is the Horus Heresy we've had years to build up strength during the great crusade and you'd need to account for attrition for the households. Like 30 knights doesn't seem that effective in a system spanding conflict and if a whole world is contributing to a household I'd expect their to be enough pilots. Ohh and if I recall correctly makabius is made up of many smaller clans from their world, they conquered rival households and took their assets pre imperium. So your house could be made up from 5 or so families etc after all its a big universe Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/322915-knight-household-structure-and-logistics/#findComment-4410649 Share on other sites More sharing options...
GhostMalone Posted June 2, 2016 Share Posted June 2, 2016 Just some facts; •continuous supply of magaera and Styrix pattern Knight armours from the forges of Atar-Median. •the pitiless thrall-Knights of House Col'Khak are renowned for fielding entire formations of these machines in support of the Legio Atarus •The colours of House Col'Khak are not listed in current Imperial records. But due to their close association with the Adeptus Mechanicus, one can assumed that they have more than likely adopted the signature red colour of the Maritan priesthood of Mars (I'd personally go with an iron grey as your main colour followed by red black and metallics sort of like my household) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/322915-knight-household-structure-and-logistics/#findComment-4410654 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Memento Of Prospero Posted June 3, 2016 Author Share Posted June 3, 2016 Mmm, I did not know about the large supplies of Magaera abd Styrix knights! I have a few plastic kits on hand I could convert to suit. It's tricky. In Vengeful Spirit, House Devin had 15 knights on the battlefield to combat take down the Imperial Warlord titan, and it seemed to be the whole Household. Then again, I don't think knights operate in a system wide operation. They are a defense force on the planetside from my understanding. Lots of good tidbits there Karuma ;) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/322915-knight-household-structure-and-logistics/#findComment-4410801 Share on other sites More sharing options...
GhostMalone Posted June 3, 2016 Share Posted June 3, 2016 No problem mate! Also look at them as independent task forces say you have 15 on molech there could be say 3 task forces of 5 left to defend the world as its within guarded Imperial space as far as we know they might have been a small household only numbering a few hundred so a 10th of their strength remained while multiple smaller task forces are crusading. As members die young nobles take up their mantle meaning a constant number of active knights are always deployed. As new suits are delivered or replacing catastrophic damaged chasis their numbers slowly expand. I think your household is like mine closely allied to the Mechanicum and utilizing the nasty toys. Your house however loves Death rays and scorching Infantry under their big cousins feet According to book 4. Honestly though it's not hard to say order some boxes of renegade and just order some upgrades from devilish suppliers if you were to go the route of lightning beams and ray guns Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/322915-knight-household-structure-and-logistics/#findComment-4410831 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Rohr Posted June 3, 2016 Share Posted June 3, 2016 Afternoon dudes and dudettes! I am looking for more in dept information on knight households and would like to shamefully tap into the collective knowledge of breakless train that is the AoD forum. A few things: -Anyone have any more information about House Col'kahk? Other than book 4, there is very little available on them. No scheme for them, and other than the fact that they are intimately tied to Titanicus Legio Atarus (Firebrands) -What's the combat strength of the average Knight Household? I think in Mechanicum the Knight Household who defended the Magma City was 30 strong? -What is usually the size of detachments sent to war, baring the exceptional Freeblades? Does it have a specific name? Thanks in advance for the input ;) FW has been basing their organizational information of the Heresy era on Epic Space Marine Army Lists. I believe the detachment of knights that could join a space marine or imperial army battle force was 5. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/322915-knight-household-structure-and-logistics/#findComment-4410839 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Memento Of Prospero Posted June 3, 2016 Author Share Posted June 3, 2016 No problem mate! Also look at them as independent task forces say you have 15 on molech there could be say 3 task forces of 5 left to defend the world as its within guarded Imperial space as far as we know they might have been a small household only numbering a few hundred so a 10th of their strength remained while multiple smaller task forces are crusading. As members die young nobles take up their mantle meaning a constant number of active knights are always deployed. As new suits are delivered or replacing catastrophic damaged chasis their numbers slowly expand. I think your household is like mine closely allied to the Mechanicum and utilizing the nasty toys. Your house however loves Death rays and scorching Infantry under their big cousins feet According to book 4. Honestly though it's not hard to say order some boxes of renegade and just order some upgrades from devilish suppliers if you were to go the route of lightning beams and ray guns I have a few necron toys I could use to make the nastier looking toys. Afternoon dudes and dudettes! I am looking for more in dept information on knight households and would like to shamefully tap into the collective knowledge of breakless train that is the AoD forum. A few things: -Anyone have any more information about House Col'kahk? Other than book 4, there is very little available on them. No scheme for them, and other than the fact that they are intimately tied to Titanicus Legio Atarus (Firebrands) -What's the combat strength of the average Knight Household? I think in Mechanicum the Knight Household who defended the Magma City was 30 strong? -What is usually the size of detachments sent to war, baring the exceptional Freeblades? Does it have a specific name? Thanks in advance for the input FW has been basing their organizational information of the Heresy era on Epic Space Marine Army Lists. I believe the detachment of knights that could join a space marine or imperial army battle force was 5. I am thinking 5 is a good number for a detatchment, I will probably shoot for 10 in the long run to run alongside my Maniple Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/322915-knight-household-structure-and-logistics/#findComment-4410850 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nusquam Posted June 3, 2016 Share Posted June 3, 2016 The Imperial Knight companion gives a lot of great detail into Knight Households. They are extremely varied. Some had only a handful of functioning suits by cannibalizing others, some have hundreds of Knights to go to war with. It depends on each house. Basic formations are found in the Imperial Knight Codex, like the Baronial Court. Each Baron leads his vassals and sometimes the High King leads his Barons. It also has basic structures. Which for AdMech is: Princeps Master Tactician - Master of the Vox - Master of Lore - Forge Master - [Additional Baron/etc] Each lord below Princep is a Baron Prime, with vassals underneath them. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/322915-knight-household-structure-and-logistics/#findComment-4410861 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Memento Of Prospero Posted June 3, 2016 Author Share Posted June 3, 2016 The Imperial Knight companion gives a lot of great detail into Knight Households. They are extremely varied. Some had only a handful of functioning suits by cannibalizing others, some have hundreds of Knights to go to war with. It depends on each house. Basic formations are found in the Imperial Knight Codex, like the Baronial Court. Each Baron leads his vassals and sometimes the High King leads his Barons. It also has basic structures. Which for AdMech is: Princeps Master Tactician - Master of the Vox - Master of Lore - Forge Master - [Additional Baron/etc] Each lord below Princep is a Baron Prime, with vassals underneath them. Ah, this is a juicy morsel. One can assume the structures have not really changed since 30k, I could defintely transpose that to the setting. Thanks Nusquam! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/322915-knight-household-structure-and-logistics/#findComment-4410872 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Rohr Posted June 3, 2016 Share Posted June 3, 2016 No problem mate! Also look at them as independent task forces say you have 15 on molech there could be say 3 task forces of 5 left to defend the world as its within guarded Imperial space as far as we know they might have been a small household only numbering a few hundred so a 10th of their strength remained while multiple smaller task forces are crusading. As members die young nobles take up their mantle meaning a constant number of active knights are always deployed. As new suits are delivered or replacing catastrophic damaged chasis their numbers slowly expand. I think your household is like mine closely allied to the Mechanicum and utilizing the nasty toys. Your house however loves Death rays and scorching Infantry under their big cousins feet According to book 4. Honestly though it's not hard to say order some boxes of renegade and just order some upgrades from devilish suppliers if you were to go the route of lightning beams and ray guns I have a few necron toys I could use to make the nastier looking toys. Afternoon dudes and dudettes! I am looking for more in dept information on knight households and would like to shamefully tap into the collective knowledge of breakless train that is the AoD forum. A few things: -Anyone have any more information about House Col'kahk? Other than book 4, there is very little available on them. No scheme for them, and other than the fact that they are intimately tied to Titanicus Legio Atarus (Firebrands) -What's the combat strength of the average Knight Household? I think in Mechanicum the Knight Household who defended the Magma City was 30 strong? -What is usually the size of detachments sent to war, baring the exceptional Freeblades? Does it have a specific name? Thanks in advance for the input FW has been basing their organizational information of the Heresy era on Epic Space Marine Army Lists. I believe the detachment of knights that could join a space marine or imperial army battle force was 5. I am thinking 5 is a good number for a detatchment, I will probably shoot for 10 in the long run to run alongside my Maniple Thats perfect, as it could be two 'wings' of knights or something. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/322915-knight-household-structure-and-logistics/#findComment-4410874 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nusquam Posted June 3, 2016 Share Posted June 3, 2016 The Codex covers the Knight world before they were knight worlds; Pre-Emperor, Pre-Crusade. Back when they were bright eyed humans searching for hope among the stars. And one point they drive across is that their sense of tradition is nigh unbreakable. To the point some worlds stagnated into death. Usually a handful of household Knights, 3-5ish, is the average I see in see in non-apocalypse style battles. They are typically referred to as 'lances' comprised of 'troop' equivalent knights, sometimes led by a Baron of some sort. Or a Court of Barons led by a higher baron/or High King equivalent. But YMMV and could be anything of your own design. I really recommend the 'dex and companion. They're great. I'm sure you could find cliff notes of them somewhere too. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/322915-knight-household-structure-and-logistics/#findComment-4410877 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Memento Of Prospero Posted June 3, 2016 Author Share Posted June 3, 2016 I am picking up the 'dex this week. Will look around for the companion ;) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/322915-knight-household-structure-and-logistics/#findComment-4410893 Share on other sites More sharing options...
GhostMalone Posted June 3, 2016 Share Posted June 3, 2016 I still say go crazy alot of those 40k entries are okay but your best bit would be perhaps to just abide by the Questoris list as we don't have barons etc we have sneschels and arablasters etc completely different kettle of fish as the mech aligned 30k houses don't do "courts" like the 40k counterparts. Houses like Vyronii ohrlaac and makabius have a similar situation to the courts but our bad boys are more secretive and :cuss due to the heavy Mechanicum ties. Hell your guys are like Iron Hands with a whole flesh is weak persona Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/322915-knight-household-structure-and-logistics/#findComment-4410896 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Rohr Posted June 3, 2016 Share Posted June 3, 2016 I still say go crazy alot of those 40k entries are okay but your best bit would be perhaps to just abide by the Questoris list as we don't have barons etc we have sneschels and arablasters etc completely different kettle of fish as the mech aligned 30k houses don't do "courts" like the 40k counterparts. Houses like Vyronii ohrlaac and makabius have a similar situation to the courts but our bad boys are more secretive and :cuss due to the heavy Mechanicum ties. Hell your guys are like Iron Hands with a whole flesh is weak persona The Quaestoris list provide titles, not ranks. The ranks are for you to make up, as each one is total dependent on the language and culture of the homeworld. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/322915-knight-household-structure-and-logistics/#findComment-4410904 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nusquam Posted June 3, 2016 Share Posted June 3, 2016 AdMech Knights do have courts and, like the Imperial house, is called an Exalted Court with which the Princeps has selected four Baron Primes to be in. It's not a rule, but a common practice. The Knight codex covers from pre-imperium to current day. The FW HH books are an example of when your mileage may vary. There is no 'codex' from which knight houses are supposed to conform to. A lot of terms and titles are for us outsiders looking in to get a general idea of structure. The Codex and HH Knight list weren't made side by side for consistency unfortunately. If you look at them both as a guide, then the HH list is an example of generic internal structure and the codex highlights additional specific titles and organization within the general structure. Then the codex is the over-all timeline and the HH books are specific entries on the timelines pertinent to the current setting. The household ranks are an example of generic baron or troop equivalents. A Lord Seneschal may be High King in some houses, or Princep in others. A scion is like that of a generic knight, divided into things like aspirant for the newer warriors and martial for seasoned but not yet lordly warriors. A Preceptor may be a Master Tactician of an AdMech house, or a Lord Scion may be a Kingsward of an Imperial house, etc, etc, etc. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/322915-knight-household-structure-and-logistics/#findComment-4410907 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Memento Of Prospero Posted June 3, 2016 Author Share Posted June 3, 2016 As they are drawn from a nascent forge world and close ties to Legio Atarus, I would assume house Col'Khak would use the Mechanicum hierarchy of titles as it eould have little established history byeond what was brought over from the Original homeworld. I also like the idea of Freeblades in a post Isstvan V setting for my renegade Iron Hands. Drawing on the attrocities commited at the dropsite massacre against Legio Atarus, my clan could have raised several volunteers from the household and Titanicus elements to begin it's crusade of retribution Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/322915-knight-household-structure-and-logistics/#findComment-4411085 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodunius Posted June 3, 2016 Share Posted June 3, 2016 FW has been basing their organizational information of the Heresy era on Epic Space Marine Army Lists. I believe the detachment of knights that could join a space marine or imperial army battle force was 5. The Knight entry in WD126 was up to 4 Paladin or Lancer Detachments with a minimum size of four machines, Wardens were 0-1 detachment of minimum 3. There was no limit on size: "..there are many tales of the stirring sight of 30 or 40 knights bearing down on the enemy lines, weapons glinting and banners streaming behind as they charge into battle." Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/322915-knight-household-structure-and-logistics/#findComment-4411104 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Rohr Posted June 3, 2016 Share Posted June 3, 2016 FW has been basing their organizational information of the Heresy era on Epic Space Marine Army Lists. I believe the detachment of knights that could join a space marine or imperial army battle force was 5. The Knight entry in WD126 was up to 4 Paladin or Lancer Detachments with a minimum size of four machines, Wardens were 0-1 detachment of minimum 3. There was no limit on size: "..there are many tales of the stirring sight of 30 or 40 knights bearing down on the enemy lines, weapons glinting and banners streaming behind as they charge into battle." 5 = 4+1 :D Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/322915-knight-household-structure-and-logistics/#findComment-4411393 Share on other sites More sharing options...
KBA Posted June 4, 2016 Share Posted June 4, 2016 Anyone else feel this house will get an official scheme by the end of the heresy? They've been talked about a few times in the book. It definitely stayed my hand from trying them. About knight house size - House Orhlacc is considered a Secondus Household at roughly 300 knight suits Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/322915-knight-household-structure-and-logistics/#findComment-4411761 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Rohr Posted June 4, 2016 Share Posted June 4, 2016 Pretty sure col'khak is the house from heresy master class. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/322915-knight-household-structure-and-logistics/#findComment-4411787 Share on other sites More sharing options...
GhostMalone Posted June 4, 2016 Share Posted June 4, 2016 Well 300 knights is a bit of a stretch but I'm at 3 and im hoping to pick up another 2 very soon. We should do an official 30k knight appreciation club volkites are cool but knights are terrifying and full of conversion potential. I know DC12 is in knight heaven and Kba is mad for it. I might send some pm's when I wake up but I really like the thought going into this thread, too see official 30k knights is my dream Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/322915-knight-household-structure-and-logistics/#findComment-4411794 Share on other sites More sharing options...
KBA Posted June 4, 2016 Share Posted June 4, 2016 I'd be a regular contributor to such a thread. I'm doing House Orhlacc (that purple will look gorgeous next to the sea green) and my next vow is pure Knights :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/322915-knight-household-structure-and-logistics/#findComment-4411813 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlo Posted June 4, 2016 Share Posted June 4, 2016 Would be cool, could all post up our houses colours and fluff... Also I see another has joined the GOC and embraced the sig. One day maybe i'll be able to wear my creation.... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/322915-knight-household-structure-and-logistics/#findComment-4411818 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nova_chron Posted June 4, 2016 Share Posted June 4, 2016 This thread has caused an itch in my hobby fingers... need me some Knights Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/322915-knight-household-structure-and-logistics/#findComment-4411925 Share on other sites More sharing options...
fedratsailor Posted June 4, 2016 Share Posted June 4, 2016 Have 20 Knights so far. 4 paladins, 4 errants, 3 wardens, 3 gallant, 3 crusaders. Have one of each, Atrapos, Magaera, Styrix. Plan to buy a Lancer, Acheron, and a Porphyrion when it releases. All are painted in a mechanicum theme. Haven't officially named the house yet. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/322915-knight-household-structure-and-logistics/#findComment-4411988 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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