Considering skitarii/cult need help

[ThatOneMarshal]

Hello robots and cyborgs, I come bearing questions!

 

So for a while I've been all heresy focused as I've fallen in love with the settings. However I've recently run into a problem which is that not everyone wants to play 30k, thus I'm forced to play my 40k armies. However my 40k armies are black Templars and blood Angels, and truth be told I've become quite bored with my Templars after non stop play for 3-4 years straight and my angels are in pretty bad spot at the moment. Thus I've figured that I would like to for an army outside of space marines and the skitarii look the coolest.

 

So here's my question in regards to skitarii:

 

1. How well can they stand as an army? Do they rely a lot on allies as they themselves are a bit light in selection compared to other armies. I know that the war convanction is rocking the tourneys but how do they do without that?

 

2. What kind of playstyle do they have? I've always been in favor of a really quick force that's highly aggressive, I depise gunlines.

 

3. How well do they competent the cult mechanicus? Do they have synergy or they kinda just act like seperate armies?

 

4. Is there any way to incorporate those rad looking forgeworld mechanicus into 40k?

 

5. And finally what would you suggest as a good code for a beginer to start with? How many vanguard/ rangers do you suggest to use per a list? Is the start collecting a good place to go?

 

Thank you so much in advance!

[MajorNese]

1. They can be played standalone without problem. They don't have a lot of units, but those are quite versatile and fill every necessary role. Maybe a bit light on AP2.

 

2. Lightly armoured, rather short ranged firepower. Highly aggressive playstyle is necessary to make the most of them, as their BS is insane at the start, and degrades every round. Scout and Crusader for everything (skitarii detachment) gets them close enough.

 

3. Cult is a bit of a mixed bag, but they do complement them well. The HQ is excellent, the kataphron give ranged AP2/haywire, the Kastelan soak up a huge amount of firepower, while killing marines by the dozen. Electro priests are just plain bad.

 

4. A FW Imperial Armour book will come in a few months, but so far, no one can tell you which units will be in there, and which won't.

 

5. Start Collecting is the best option out there, as you save a lot of money. Onager 52€, box 65€, so if you ever considering onagers, take the box instead. Vanguard need to be numerous anyway, as they are great, cheap, but not very tough. Rangers, maybe a squad for backfield camping, but not considerably more. I field 40 vanguard and 10 rangers on 1500p, that's a good ratio, as well as 3 Onagers. Onagers are the only longer ranged support, and have enough magnetizable options to vary a bit. Good thing about the box, the formation lets you include a (cult) HQ into the (HQ-less) skitarii, to give you a real HQ, not just declare a sergeant the warlord. From then on, add some CC units (ironstrider dragoons or infiltrators) and maybe expand Cult with kataphron and kastelan.

[DeStinyFiSh]

Hello robots and cyborgs, I come bearing questions!

So for a while I've been all heresy focused as I've fallen in love with the settings. However I've recently run into a problem which is that not everyone wants to play 30k, thus I'm forced to play my 40k armies. However my 40k armies are black Templars and blood Angels, and truth be told I've become quite bored with my Templars after non stop play for 3-4 years straight and my angels are in pretty bad spot at the moment. Thus I've figured that I would like to for an army outside of space marines and the skitarii look the coolest.

So here's my question in regards to skitarii:

1. How well can they stand as an army? Do they rely a lot on allies as they themselves are a bit light in selection compared to other armies. I know that the war convanction is rocking the tourneys but how do they do without that?

2. What kind of playstyle do they have? I've always been in favor of a really quick force that's highly aggressive, I depise gunlines.

3. How well do they competent the cult mechanicus? Do they have synergy or they kinda just act like seperate armies?

4. Is there any way to incorporate those rad looking forgeworld mechanicus into 40k?

5. And finally what would you suggest as a good code for a beginer to start with? How many vanguard/ rangers do you suggest to use per a list? Is the start collecting a good place to go?

Thank you so much in advance!

As a non tournament player:

1. They are pretty solid ! Firepower is realy good, but you need to get in mid range to get the full potential. Dragoons, Ruststalkers and Infiltrators help out in CC, as well as the -1 T debuff the Vanguards give in CC and the Doctrinas that boost the WS, but you are not a CC army !

Allied transports would be great, but not necessary. I play them together with Cult, Knights, an Inquisitor or add some Assassins and they do fine.

2. I think you may like Skitarii then! They all get Scout and Crusader when you field them as Skitarii Maniple, so you can move up quickly. MSU is the most effective way to play them. Small squats of Vanguard with a few Plasma (3 shots !) or Haywire guns that move up the field to get in range backed up by some Rangers (that can also move up quickly with Move Through Cover), Ironstriders and Onagers. Single Dragoons are cheap but dangereous engough for the opponent to not ignore them. Infiltrators are a little harder to play, since they are pretty expensive and fragile, but if you get them into CC they kick a*s! Both, dragoons and infiltrators are fast as hell, as well as Ruststalkers and Ironstriders. They get +3" to every move (move, run, charge) plus the scout and crusader rules when used in the skitarii maniple.

3. In my opinion they act as seperate armys. I field them together because of the fluff, but to make them more efficient I am sure other allys would help them more. Cult has a lot of high AP, long range fire power and the units are way more durable though, so they help out in these 2 aspects. But they do not help very much in CC and they don't have transports to help you skitarii getting into range. The Dominus however is a very good tank and makes a very hard to kill warlord. Put him in front of a Vanguard squad and they will get where you want them to be without beeing shot to pieces.

4. At the moment only through house rules. Some people are scared because they think 30k (or forgeworld in general) is way to strong. I am not sure about that, but the few 30k units I played in 40k (Thallax, Archmagos and Avenger Strike Fighter) didn't do very much. But it was only one game... However, there will be a new IA book, rumoured for Q3 this year. This will include some Mechanicum units, but we do not know what units will make it into the book or not. Up to know there have been pictures showing the Thanatar, thats the only thing I know.

Mid July will be the FW Open Day, I guess we will get some new informations then.

5. Start collectin is a good idea. You will never leave house without Vanguard and Onagers, and the Dominus is a must have if you want to include Cult sooner or later. The formation rules in there are OK and you can add the Dominus to the Skitarii this way without adding more Cult units, but the Skitarii Maniple is better most of the time.

In generall Vanguard are better than Rangers. In my last 750 point game I had 4x 5 Vanguard and 1x 5 Rangers for backfield objective camping.

Depending on your budget I would suggest 2x the getting started box, a box of Infiltrators and maybe 2 Ironstriders / Dragoons. This can be a nice 1000 point army to start with:

Dominus Maniple

1 Dominus (Warlord)

10 Vanguard with Plasma

1 Onager with anti air

Skitarii Maniple

5 Infiltrators

5 Vanguard with Haywire

5 Rangers with Sniper (underwhelming most of the time) or Haywire

2x 1 Dragoon

1 Onager with Neutron Laser

And then you can test them and decide how to proceed. More Vanguard, Onagers and Ironstriders would be a good idea then, but you could also add anything else mentioned in point 1. above.

Another quick hint: There are rumours that there will be a new Ad Mech Codex this year that includes both, Skitarii and Cult in one book.

Hope this helps, and welcome to Ad Mech

[Tyriks]

I have played both BT and BA, so I can say that if you're looking to change things up, this is a great choice.  They playstyle is very different.

 

I do prefer usually running Cult Mech and Skitarii together, as I think they do complement each other very well.  Cult Mech has a fair amount of slow but very durable and hard-hitting units (excluding the electro priests which, as MajorNese said, are just not good right now.  Hopefully they'll get some buffs somehow that make them worth looking at) whereas Skitarii have very numerous and generall mobile but fragile units which are still extremely hard-hitting.  If your were going to run just one, I would say go for Skitarii over Cult since everything Skitarii has can be devastating, whereas Cult has no worthwhile elites and no fast attack at all.  That said, I cannot wait to get my hands on some Kastelans (Cult heavy support unit, looks extremely useful!).

 

I do agree that the Start Collecting! box is the way to go.  I've bought 2 so far and will almost definitely get another one sometime because the savings are so good.  Even if you throw out the Dominus, you're saving $20 on buying the box instead of individually.  And the formation is decent, in part because it can let you reroll shooting sometimes but also it does let you bring a durable HQ to an otherwise vulnerable army.  

 

As far as gunlines go, while AdMech is a very shooty army, they are not really a gunline army.  As said, you have to be very agressive with them, and they have tons of synergy with each other.  For example, Vanguard (basic troops) are definitely a shooty unit, with mid-range guns that cause bonus wounds on 6s.  They are cheap as can be and can bring down a variety of targets just through sheer numbers of wounds.  But, should they find themselves locked in close combat, they give -1 toughness to the enemy, making them very vulnerable to counterattacks from some Sicarians or a dragoon.  If you use the two varieties of Sicarians together, they are extremely lethal; one gives -1 WS, BS, Ld and Init, the other is simply brutal but fragile (has ap2 and auto wounds on 6s, all rolls become ap2 after the first turn of combat).  Using them together, they tend to make most targets more vulnerable than they are and they make them have a harder time hitting back.  

 

Another change from marines is that every unit is really different.  I find marines to be good but a little boring since they are basically all the same but with one weapon changed or one special rule added.  That's nice sometimes, since you can have units act outside their specific roles, but I get a little bored by it.  AdMech is not that way.  You really have to use the right unit for the right job or they are toast.  

 

What I would recommend is play a proxy game or two with a friend who won't mind to see how they play.  That's how I started out, and I loved it.  

[MoGuy]

 

 

So here's my question in regards to skitarii: 

 

1. How well can they stand as an army? Do they rely a lot on allies as they themselves are a bit light in selection compared to other armies. I know that the war convanction is rocking the tourneys but how do they do without that? 

 

2. What kind of playstyle do they have? I've always been in favor of a really quick force that's highly aggressive, I depise gunlines. 

 

3. How well do they competent the cult mechanicus? Do they have synergy or they kinda just act like seperate armies? 

 

4. Is there any way to incorporate those rad looking forgeworld mechanicus into 40k? 

 

5. And finally what would you suggest as a good code for a beginer to start with? How many vanguard/ rangers do you suggest to use per a list? Is the start collecting a good place to go? 

 

Thank you so much in advance! 

 

 

1. and 2. Cult and Skitarii are designed to be played together because they align so well. From a playstyle perspective, Ad Mech is a shooty-heavy army with varying "effective-kill-ranges", which makes them not as static as e.g. Tau or IG. 

We definitely do NOT need allies when it comes to guns. Seriously, Ad Mech has some of the most whacky but very strong weapons in the game (apart from Eldar which get D-Weapons like children get candy). Pie plates, small blasts, low AP, high AP, close range, long range, haywire, grav... you name it, we got it. The only thing Ad Mech lacks are transports and fliers. We do have some neat close combat units but those are expensive glasshammers.

 

3. They do have synergies as the Cult provides tough(er) units (Kastelans, Kataphrons) and an HQ unit (Dominus) whilst the Skitarii have effective "normal" troops (Vanguards, Rangers) that are somewhat expendable and squishy. Skitarii also has good support units (Onagers, Dragoons, Balistrarii) and dedicated close combat units (Ruststalkers, Infiltrators). Broadly speaking, Cult provides the units that will mow down TEQs and MEQs and Skitarii leans more towards killing MEQs and squishy units. 

 

4. House rules. Rumors say that we will get a new Imperial Armour Book this year that contains rules of the 30K Mechanicum. And since Imperial Armour Books are supplements for 40K that means that you will be able to field 30K units with 40K rules. The catch is that forgeworld is really, REALLY expensive.

 

5. Get yourself the Start Collecting Box. You might even want to buy it two times and sell the second Dominus (or keep him, you can take up to 2 HQs). You should have at least 20 Vanguard or Rangers (consensus on the net is that Vanguard are better than Rangers in terms of killing-power-per-point), 1 Dominus and 1 or 2 Onagers. This will suffice for small matches. If you want to expand get the following:

 

1x Box of Rangers/Vanguard (if you have build the first 20 models as Vanguards than you can build 5 Rangers and 5 Vanguard. Rangers are nice to have since they can hold objectives in one's deployment zone and offer long-ranged fire support)

 

2-3x Dragoons  

 

2x Boxes of Kataphrons

 

1x Box of Kastelan Robots (optional as these guys hit very hard, are tanky as hell but eat up points as if they were free candy)

 

If you want more close combat power get 2x Boxes of Sicarians. Both variants are potent melee fighters but they are very squishy. Play them as if they were Marines and they will die before ever reaching the enemy. Play them careful and as a counter-charging unit and they will be devastating.

 

If you want allies, go for the Inquisition as they offer cheap HQs, transports and good melee units (yes, Crusaders + Assassins + Priest will ruin the enemy's day!).

[MajorNese]

 

4. House rules. Rumors say that we will get a new Imperial Armour Book this year that contains rules of the 30K Mechanicum. And since Imperial Armour Books are supplements for 40K that means that you will be able to field 30K units with 40K rules. The catch is that forgeworld is really, REALLY expensive

I'd just wait with purchases until the book hits. FW fluff directly states that some units are extinct after the heresy, so some units or equipments might not make it into the IA book. Which would be quite expensive, if already bought.