Legacy of Russ 6: Wolf Trap (Discussion)

[NightHowler]

 

 

 

 

I'm not going to criticise the writer, I'm enjoying the series and given the author was told the beginning and the outcome he's trying to create a meaningful event that moves the story on without killing any major characters. If it wasn't happening to my Wolves I'd be enjoying it a lot more of course.

 

Then I'll criticize the author for you. He may write well but he has demonstrated ignorance of lore that has existed since at least 4th edition; he writes like he's absolutely enjoying the destruction of our chapter; he lacks the creativity to create dramatic threat through any means but killing ever greater and greater numbers of our chapter and destroying all of our system's defenses; and I for one hope to Russ and the Allfather that in the next book the author gets sucked into his own book, eaten alive by a great unclean one, and then pooped out the other end still breathing but busting at the seems with every foul disease known to Pappa Nurgle.

**spits on the ground to get even the mention of that author out of my mouth**

I feel like I should point out that Space Wolves aren't the only faction engaged in these stories. While fans of the Wolves may be lamenting losses (that still amount to well under 50% of the Chapter), there are Dark Angels readers who are demanding to know why no named Wolves are being killed off, why Fenris hasn't been bombarded and why the Inquisition hasn't declared the Wolves to be traitors. And that's not to mention all the daemon fans who think their faction are coming across as nothing more than fodder and aren't doing nearly enough damage to the Wolves, given this is one of the largest daemonic incursions in 40k lore. 

 

Speaking of the lore, I feel I should repeat the fact that getting to write about the Wolves is my biggest honour as an author to date (I mean, you could point out this is also my first full-length novel, but it still stands). I have nothing but respect for them. Unfortunately no matter who wins War Zone Fenris I'm going to lose it, given one side has to be defeated for there to be any progression.

As a person who has been playing GW games since the 1990s, and who has only ever played Space Wolves, painting space wolf models, scouring old White Dwarf articles for any scrap of Space Wolf lore, reading the flavor texts under all the pictures that decorate every corner of each edition of our codexes, and having written my own short stories and detailed history for my personal chapter, I hope that you can understand why I care so little about people who clamor for the absolute destruction of my favored chapter and where my anger comes from when I hear that their concerns are even contemplated however briefly. Upset because we're not seeing our named characters killed off? This isn't game of thrones.

I admit that in my frustration at watching my faction reduced to rubble I hadn't considered your feelings when I railed against you, and for that I apologize. But nothing less than what I wrote would adequately describe my impotent rage at losing something I'd always thought was inviolable. "Only 50% losses" for a chapter are huge. The loss of the defenses of our system leave us naked. As long as we are left strong I will probably get over it, but if we are left a shattered chapter with no way of defending ourselves, I won't.

Don't worry about it, writers should all have thick skins. But let me reassure you on the "50% casualties" matter, because it deserves examination. Of the 12 Great Companies, 5 are en-route to Fenris and are at this stage almost completely undamaged. That leaves Grimnar's, Egil's, Sven's, Harald's, Ragnar's, Bran's and Krom's Companies. Of the seven, Krom's suffered only minor losses in Curse of the Wulfen purging the Wolf Moon and are currently unengaged on Fenris. Ragnar's has so far suffered less than 20% casualties. Egil's withdrew to orbit above Midgardia after around 30% losses. Bran's has just arrive in-system undamaged. That means only Grimnar's, Sven's and Harald's Great Companies have taken any substantial hits, and by substantial I mean Sven and Harald's are approaching - but still haven't reached - 50% casualties. Grimnar's losses remain uncertain due to the Champions of Fenris being scattered underground, but we know they haven't been wiped out.

 

Now, given that the 13th are arriving to reinforce the Chapter, I'd say current losses are 20% or less. The worlds of the Fenris system have been damaged, certainly, but as I've said I didn't go about writing it purely as a Space Wolf fan.

I may have misjudged you Author, and for that, again, I apologize. Thank you for coming here and braving the slings and barbs cast your way to reassure us.

[Fang_Guard23]

RobMac,

Thanks for coming along and joining the conversation; that's very cool of you, and I for one appreciate getting to enjoy additional perspective straight from the author.

V

No worries, it's a pleasure to be here. I knew as soon as I saw some rumour sites declaring that Fenris had been destroyed that there would be a lot of misinformation, so just trying to combat that. Plus, I've been a lurker here for, like, a decade. Now seemed as good a time to join as any!

But please, I'm not here to cramp anyone's style, speak freely

why does everyone think that fenris was hit first? the planet is capable of sustaining a siege since the fang managed to hold a chaos fleet at bay.

[Valerian]

Rob, while you're here, I don't suppose you'd do us a favor and kill off Canis and Lukas would you?

[Lukasthetrickster]

pls don't kill me

[MaveriK]

interesting....

[Guest Triszin]

pls don't kill me

I agree, Lukas is fantastic. He just needs more lore, maybe Lukas is the one that gets assigned to the greyknights/inqusition/darkangels.

 

And he spreads his glee.

 

 

oh and Hello Rob. I know you had limited space to expand on the story as you were told where to start and end. so your working with what you can. sorry if we've been bastards. =/

[MaveriK]

 

pls don't kill me

I agree, Lukas is fantastic. He just needs more lore, maybe Lukas is the one that gets assigned to the greyknights/inqusition/darkangels.

 

And he spreads his glee.

 

 

oh and Hello Rob. I know you had limited space to expand on the story as you were told where to start and end. so your working with what you can. sorry if we've been bastards. =/

 

passionate bastards get it right!

[Lord Blackwood]

i love these threads , i normally enjoy them with popcorn in fact

The series has been a fun read for me so far definitely sitting on the edge with each new installment 


It also really makes me wish my 14th were a real thing cause this  is the sort of thing they would have to return to Fenris for @ u @ 

[Frater Cornelius]

Okay, if the '50% casualty thing' really isn't as dramatic as we though (thanks to RobMac for pointing that out), I guess I can calm down as well. I have been in the same camp as NightHowler in the sense that I do not enjoy seeing the Wolves suffer just to shake things up and leaving them exposed and crippled, especially seeing as they have no successors to call on and the rest of the Imperium eying them suspiciously because they dare to act humanely and protective of the general populace.

 

But the numbers that RobMac presented do make sense. As long as SW remain strong and capable of doing their thing then I am happy as well ;)

 

Edit: In terms of who wins, one should consider that if a human/Marine is dead, then that was is. A Daemon dying is a slight inconvenience and delay. In terms of casualties, the human ones hurt us far more than the Daemon one.

[TheWolfLord]

 

RobMac,

Thanks for coming along and joining the conversation; that's very cool of you, and I for one appreciate getting to enjoy additional perspective straight from the author.

V

 

No worries, it's a pleasure to be here. I knew as soon as I saw some rumour sites declaring that Fenris had been destroyed that there would be a lot of misinformation, so just trying to combat that. Plus, I've been a lurker here for, like, a decade. Now seemed as good a time to join as any! 

 

But please, I'm not here to cramp anyone's style, speak freely :)

Great to see you join in the discussion and personally I'm really enjoying the Legacy of Russ series.

 

I can understand others hatred of seeing the Wolves damaged and there were already some sizeable losses taken during The Curse of the Wulfen so much of their frustration isn't targeted at you but rather the story arc as a whole.

 

I'm excited at your statement that only fully fledged Wulfen have returned so far. Is it likely we'll see other members of the 13th make an appearance during Warzone Fenris?

[SW1]

I think asking Rob what happens next is a no go. Let's just enjoy the story as it unfolds and not put the author in a difficult position legally.

 

@Rob - Welcome to the pack. Do you hobby and care to share any pics? :p

[MaveriK]

Mmm... when I got Chris to do a Q & A for his Battle of the Fang right here in the SW forum, I ended up making a SW model for my army, in honour of him. I might as well do the same for you, but he's going to be a wulfen. I just need a proper name for the guy!

 

Anyway, the story you've written has helped give us a new perspective, a step forward in the 40K storyline, along with an updated codex and new plastic toys. So thank you for being a part of that!

 

For what it's worth, the fact that you've gotten so many people here worked up, defensive, scared and excited towards our beloved chapter is a clear indication that you've done your job as a storyteller.

 

have a mjod on me and welcome to the Aett!

[RobMac]

Also, if you get a chance, please let folks know that they've screwed up the Wolf Lord of the 13 Company name in the last two codices.

Um, I can try. I should point out before I get a raft of these questions though, that us BL writers are very separate from the rest of GW. We just do our thing, independent of the design team or the central planners (except when we're brought in on projects like this one).

sorry if we've been bastards. =/

Nah, I've enjoyed reading the threads! I think maybe this is a tiny fraction of what George R. R. Martin feels when he kills someone off in Game of Thrones.

I think asking Rob what happens next is a no go. Let's just enjoy the story as it unfolds and not put the author in a difficult position legally.

@Rob - Welcome to the pack. Do you hobby and care to share any pics?

Yeah, I've gotta keep tight-lipped on all that stuff. And what stuff it is! As for the hobby, I have a Guard army for 40k but haven't played in years. In terms of tabletop I much preferred Fantasy (Chaos, Vampire Counts and Skaven) but have yet to find the time to transition to Age of Sigmar.

Mmm... when I got Chris to do a Q & A for his Battle of the Fang right here in the SW forum, I ended up making a SW model for my army, in honour of him. I might as well do the same for you, but he's going to be a wulfen. I just need a proper name for the guy!

Anyway, the story you've written has helped give us a new perspective, a step forward in the 40K storyline, along with an updated codex and new plastic toys. So thank you for being a part of that!

For what it's worth, the fact that you've gotten so many people here worked up, defensive, scared and excited towards our beloved chapter is a clear indication that you've done your job as a storyteller.

have a mjod on me and welcome to the Aett!

Don't worry, when NightHowler said I still write well even though he hates that I've been killing Wolves I knew everything was okay, I mean telling a story is my number one priority. And I'd slaughter every Wolf if it made me a successful writer.

And my own Wulfen? That'd be a great honour. Just make sure he's ginger

[TheWolfLord]

Rab Redmane?

 

Also when you go on a murderous rampage do you tend to go for a hammer or an axe first?

[RobMac]

Rab Redmane?

 

Also when you go on a murderous rampage do you tend to go for a hammer or an axe first?

I like it. Also, while mauls are my favourite medieval weapon (I'm a Military History student, I'm allowed to be nerdy, right?), I'd have to go with a good ol' axe in this case. 

[Dantay VI]

Oh gosh no Rob!! Axes are so last Helwinter... A nice chunky warhammer is where it is at ;)

 

Spiked at on end, then pure blunt killing power at the other end.

 

Btw, aren't people forgetting that there are quite a few Space Wolves warbands and Great Companies, who for whatever reason are no longer part of the Chapters active roster?

 

Snippets of which are in the old WD's. I am sure Valerian has linked them before, but I seem to recall WD245 or 246 having some information. Such as units not having the ability to return to Fenris or being on campaign so far away they decided not to go back but keep fighting elsewhere. These all kept their promise to the AllFather and Russ, even though they have broken away from the Chapter.

 

Maybe a call has gone out and the wayward packs will return to their ancestral home, at it's time of direst need?  

 

If at all possible I would suggest that it would be an idea to pick Valerians brains, as Val is a great source of Wolf lore.

[Leif Bearclaw]

Btw, aren't people forgetting that there are quite a few Space Wolves warbands and Great Companies, who for whatever reason are no longer part of the Chapters active roster?

 

Snippets of which are in the old WD's. I am sure Valerian has linked them before, but I seem to recall WD245 or 246 having some information. Such as units not having the ability to return to Fenris or being on campaign so far away they decided not to go back but keep fighting elsewhere. These all kept their promise to the AllFather and Russ, even though they have broken away from the Chapter.

 

Maybe a call has gone out and the wayward packs will return to their ancestral home, at it's time of direst need?  

 

Well, if people have, then it's only because GW has too. I can't recall a mention of the Lost Companies since those WD articles. So if an element of the fluff has been forgotten/overlooked for 15/16 years, can you really blame people if they don't expect it to crop up now? Especially as more than a few fans aren't long in the tooth enough to remember those days.

[Fang_Guard23]

 

Btw, aren't people forgetting that there are quite a few Space Wolves warbands and Great Companies, who for whatever reason are no longer part of the Chapters active roster?

 

Snippets of which are in the old WD's. I am sure Valerian has linked them before, but I seem to recall WD245 or 246 having some information. Such as units not having the ability to return to Fenris or being on campaign so far away they decided not to go back but keep fighting elsewhere. These all kept their promise to the AllFather and Russ, even though they have broken away from the Chapter.

 

Maybe a call has gone out and the wayward packs will return to their ancestral home, at it's time of direst need?  

 

Well, if people have, then it's only because GW has too. I can't recall a mention of the Lost Companies since those WD articles. So if an element of the fluff has been forgotten/overlooked for 15/16 years, can you really blame people if they don't expect it to crop up now? Especially as more than a few fans aren't long in the tooth enough to remember those days.

 

true, I remember hearing about the lost company of Svengar the Red, and how his great company went missing after they went beyond the Ghoul Stars and into the intergalactic void

[Wispy]

god forbid these black library writers serve the story instead of factions of fanboys (who all want to be the star).

[Frater Cornelius]

The solution is that everyone ganks up on the races we collectively hate. Eldar come to mind :D

[maverik_girl]

Plot twist, you people got it all wrong! the space wolves chapter will not be saved by Russ but by a legion of fleet based squats.... “Cousins, we fight by your side. For the all-father!”

[NightHowler]

Oooooh, if we're making requests, I have one: Russ not only returns with his retinue of heroes and the entire remaining Wolves of the 13th company, but he comes back to us with the prize he had left to quest for - none other than the Fruit of the Tree of Life. The tree it turns out, stood next to Pappa Nurgles great cauldron, and the fruit is revealed to be a mysteriously radiant Eldar maiden driven mad by milennia of captivity and torture but with miraculous healing powers - now totally enamoured with her savior, following him everywhere, and sighing as she gazes upon his rugged good looks.

 

If you do this author, I could begrudge you none of our losses, and I would build a shrine in your name where nerds would travel from all over the world to sing your praises!

[MaveriK]

Enjoy RobMac, he is Tormund Redpelt. Frostborn son of Fenris with a crooked smile and red hair. As a man, he was gifted with words that could rival the greatest skjalds. But as a warrior of Russ, he is born for the murdermake...

[Valerian]

 

 

Btw, aren't people forgetting that there are quite a few Space Wolves warbands and Great Companies, who for whatever reason are no longer part of the Chapters active roster?

 

Snippets of which are in the old WD's. I am sure Valerian has linked them before, but I seem to recall WD245 or 246 having some information. Such as units not having the ability to return to Fenris or being on campaign so far away they decided not to go back but keep fighting elsewhere. These all kept their promise to the AllFather and Russ, even though they have broken away from the Chapter.

 

Maybe a call has gone out and the wayward packs will return to their ancestral home, at it's time of direst need?  

 

If at all possible I would suggest that it would be an idea to pick Valerians brains, as Val is a great source of Wolf lore.

 

Thanks for the mention, dantay.  

 

You are correct, it was US WD245 that had the 'Lone Wolves' article that was about 'lost companies.'  It also had the story of Wolf Lord Jotun Bearclaw who chose to stay behind and support a Kimmerian IG regiment against some Tyranids, if memory serves (actual magazine is boxed up somewhere in the basement).  I don't remember all of the details, but they chose to stay and fight, rather than return to The Fang, because it was going to take too long to get home, and they had to do something to slow down the advance of the Xenos.  This GC, and others like them, are presumably gone, although Inquisitor Asmorales Harkenforth surmises that, "Given sufficient geneseed and technical competence it is entirely possible for such a company to maintain its strength over a protracted period, inducting and training new recruits in the same way as a normal Chapter.  Less well-supplied companies might have to resort to training ordinary humans to fill their ranks or face the prospect of gradually dwindling in numbers until the company ceases to exist."

 

The various codices have mentioned/hinted at other lost companies, like Bearclaw's that remained loyal, but can't return, but also others foreswore their oaths and left, like Sven Ironhand, who took his Great Company and left into exile 815M41.

 

Regardless, the Space Wolves don't have a connection to any of these Lost Companies (at least none has ever been mentioned in the fluff), which is why their Grand Annulus stone gets retired, and a new Great Company raised in their place.  The Dark Angels and Blood Angels can call on their successors for help, but the Space Wolves don't have that luxury (only successor lost or destroyed millennia ago, and Lost Companies, well, lost).

 

I presume that the Space Wolves will find the Chapter's salvation in the 'original lost company', which is, of course, Jorin Bloodfang's 13th Company of Wulfen.

 

It will be very, very, interesting to see what Rob and other writers do with the 13th Company.  I like the fact that all we've seen so far return to the material plane are full-fledged Wulfen, as RobMac pointed out.  This meshes well with original lore, which had the entire 13th Company as the organization into which Russ consolidated all of the Wolves that had turned Wulfen during the Great Crusade/Heresy era; the old lore doesn't say whether the various officers of this formation were 'regular' or if they, too, had gone Wulfen.  However, this doesn't mesh well with the old 13th Company army list from the Eye of Terror campaign and the associated Children of the Night article from US WD 283.  I presume that the old EOT army list had Grey Slayers, Storm Claws, and regular characters (Lords and Priests) because they had no inclination to do an army list of nothing but Wulfen and so-called Alpha Wulfen.  I'm curious to see if these old EoT units get retconned away, or if they actually reemerge in the future, as we hopefully learn more about the 13th, and why they've returned.

 

V

[RobMac]

Enjoy RobMac, he is Tormund Redpelt. Frostborn son of Fenris with a crooked smile and red hair. As a man, he was gifted with words that could rival the greatest skjalds. But as a warrior of Russ, he is born for the murdermake...

That is quite simply one of the most glorious sights I have ever seen!