Blood Angels 2k ORBITAL

[m0nolith]

Iv never run this nor have I faced it, so I thought Id ask how effective you guys would think it would be.

 

Blood Angels Legion - Orbital Assault RoW

 

HQ

-Cataphractii Praetor w/ Blade of Perdition, Digital Lasers

4x Legion Chosen Bodyguards (Cataphractii Terminators) w/ 2 chainfists, 2 power axes, 2 combi-melta (all in Dreadclaw)

 

TROOPS

-10x Tactical Squad w/ Sgt AA + Power Axe, Melta Bomb, Vexilla, Extra CCW, Drop Pod

-10x Tactical Squad w/ Sgt AA + Power Axe, Melta Bomb, Vexilla, Extra CCW, Drop Pod

-8x Tactical Support Squad w/ Sgt AA, Melta Bomb, Flamers (or maybe Chargers), Extra CCW, Drop Pod

 

ELITES

-Apothecary w/ AA (with Support Squad)

 

Fast Attack

-Anvillus Pattern Dreadclaw Drop Pod (carrying Praetor and Bodyguard)

 

Heavy Support

-Leviathan w/  Siege Claw, Siege Drill, Armored Ceramite, x2 Assault Cannons, Dreadnought Drop Pod

-Leviathan w/  Siege Claw, Siege Drill, Armored Ceramite, x2 Assault Cannons, Dreadnought Drop Pod

 

One thing that I have to utilize are the tactical marines since I have about 30 on the way to be fully painted (with Legion Upgrades and everything) and because I really take a loooong time to paint, I dont want to have all that work wasted and give up on the project.

And another thing, would Chargers be better on the Support Squad?

Blood Angels do have that -1 to wound in CC, and considering that Chargers are Assault 2 it would be fun to maybe *Choom* and then charge in (that is if they survive to next turn)

 

I really could use your thoughts.

[Runefyre]

If there was some way to fit a 7th pod in, that would make the most efficient use of DPA.

 

You could save some points by just making the tac squads despoilers. That would also make them less of a points sink into a unit that can get blown of the board relatively easily.

 

The other option is take away the dreadclaw and deep strike the command squad. Purchase nuncio voxes for both tac squads for plenty of no scatter coverage.

[m0nolith]

The Despoiler thing may be true, but like i said the Tac Squads have to stay as marines because the models are already being painted. 

[m0nolith]

Are to Levis too much?

Im wondering if its a good idea to invest 840 points in just 2 units, even if they'll be out behind the enemy's line on turn 1?

[Riot Earp]

A levi can be oneshooted to useless bitz so i would only field one in the pod or both on foot with ranged weapon.

[Baluc]

You may have issues with vehicles, but truthfully this is probably the best you can get.

 

Changes you could make.

 

Destroyers - pretty nifty with a drop pod and rad grenades, and missiles, can help your bolters do some extra damage

 

Contemptor Dreadnoughts - instead of Leviathans, significantly cheaper but much softer

 

Tartorus Armour - Since your cmd sqd is going to be in the pod you may as well be able to sweeping advance, your Praetor can still have an Iron Halo as well.

[Terminus]

Some things in the above post are misleading or wrong:

1. Destroyers are awful at everything and missiles can't help bolters.

2. Contemptor Primes are not good value proposition IMO, and the pod nerf really cut into the Cortus' impact and affordability. There is no comparison with Leviathans.

3. Artificer/Combat Shield is cheaper and better than Tartaros.

[Baluc]

Some things in the above post are misleading or wrong:

1. Destroyers are awful at everything and missiles can't help bolters.

2. Contemptor Primes are not good value proposition IMO, and the pod nerf really cut into the Cortus' impact and affordability. There is no comparison with Leviathans.

3. Artificer/Combat Shield is cheaper and better than Tartaros.

 

1. a. Actually rad missiles do help, there are several multiwound wound legion units Justaerin, Fire Drakes, Gal Vorbak, through T5 Mechanicum units and since the bolter marines are mandatory getting work out of them should be an                 important factor. Also in assault Tac marines would wound on 2's to afflicted units. Yes I understand majority T rules, seeing as you have 2 turns to rad-phage units. The missile isn't a particulary mandatory upgrade either. 

 

    b. destroyers actually wound anything T4 on 2's in combat, and can use all their rules our of a pod. Everything from phosphex bombs to counter attack

 

    c. They obviously cost quite a bit, but nothing does what they do

 

2. Nothing you said here is conflict with my point. They are softer and cheaper, and yet still worth looking at.

 

3. Except he has a terminator Praetor, chainfists, and can take a dedicated dreadclaw. They actually cost the same points for basic relevant gear (power weapons and combat shields), the only difference would be frag grenades

[Nightmare84]

this is coming from a guy that loves his painted destroyers. but they do nothing for their points costs

 

335- for 10 with 2 missile launchers and a pod is crazy talk. the Blood angel rules do help them but still not enough. you are better sinking same amount of points into assault marines

 

regarding your support squad. i would use chargers, death rays is one of the benefits of playing 30k. 

[Terminus]

 

Some things in the above post are misleading or wrong:

1. Destroyers are awful at everything and missiles can't help bolters.

2. Contemptor Primes are not good value proposition IMO, and the pod nerf really cut into the Cortus' impact and affordability. There is no comparison with Leviathans.

3. Artificer/Combat Shield is cheaper and better than Tartaros.

 

1. a. Actually rad missiles do help, there are several multiwound wound legion units Justaerin, Fire Drakes, Gal Vorbak, through T5 Mechanicum units and since the bolter marines are mandatory getting work out of them should be an                 important factor. Also in assault Tac marines would wound on 2's to afflicted units. Yes I understand majority T rules, seeing as you have 2 turns to rad-phage units. The missile isn't a particulary mandatory upgrade either. 

 

    b. destroyers actually wound anything T4 on 2's in combat, and can use all their rules our of a pod. Everything from phosphex bombs to counter attack

 

    c. They obviously cost quite a bit, but nothing does what they do

 

2. Nothing you said here is conflict with my point. They are softer and cheaper, and yet still worth looking at.

 

3. Except he has a terminator Praetor, chainfists, and can take a dedicated dreadclaw. They actually cost the same points for basic relevant gear (power weapons and combat shields), the only difference would be frag grenades

 

1. Rad grenades do not help you wound on 2+s vs T4 when you are S4. Please check your math and rulebook. -totally does when you're Blood Angels, eating crow on this one. Talking about getting a rad missile to debuff ONE 2W model out of a squad to reduce its toughness by 1 is frankly absurd. Again, please check your rulebook about how rad-phage actually works. Destroyers are garbage, through and through and in every way utterly unexceptional despite rad and phosphex weaponry, and could be 100 points cheaper without anyone blinking an eye.

 

2. In a completely different context, sure.

 

3. On top of frag grenades they also get an extra attack per guy and can bring a cheap apothecary.  You can also fit more of them in a dreadclaw.

 

<edited for less douche factor, original version below>

[Nightmare84]

 

 

Some things in the above post are misleading or wrong:

1. Destroyers are awful at everything and missiles can't help bolters.

2. Contemptor Primes are not good value proposition IMO, and the pod nerf really cut into the Cortus' impact and affordability. There is no comparison with Leviathans.

3. Artificer/Combat Shield is cheaper and better than Tartaros.

 

1. a. Actually rad missiles do help, there are several multiwound wound legion units Justaerin, Fire Drakes, Gal Vorbak, through T5 Mechanicum units and since the bolter marines are mandatory getting work out of them should be an                 important factor. Also in assault Tac marines would wound on 2's to afflicted units. Yes I understand majority T rules, seeing as you have 2 turns to rad-phage units. The missile isn't a particulary mandatory upgrade either. 

 

    b. destroyers actually wound anything T4 on 2's in combat, and can use all their rules our of a pod. Everything from phosphex bombs to counter attack

 

    c. They obviously cost quite a bit, but nothing does what they do

 

2. Nothing you said here is conflict with my point. They are softer and cheaper, and yet still worth looking at.

 

3. Except he has a terminator Praetor, chainfists, and can take a dedicated dreadclaw. They actually cost the same points for basic relevant gear (power weapons and combat shields), the only difference would be frag grenades

 

1. Rad grenades do not help you wound on 2+s vs T4 when you are S4. Please check your math and rulebook. Talking about getting a rad missile to debuff ONE 2W model out of a squad to reduce its toughness by 1 is frankly absurd. Again, please check your rulebook about how rad-phage actually works. Destroyers are garbage, through and through and in every way, and could be 100 points cheaper without anyone blinking an eye.

 

2. In a completely different context, sure.

 

3. On top of frag grenades they also get an extra attack per guy and can bring a cheap apothecary.  You can also fit more of them in a dreadclaw.

 

 

 

1. he is referring to rad grenades and encarmine fury. so for the first round it is wound on 2+ against other toughness 4 and 3+ from there on

[Terminus]

Ah apologies, then yes, that's correct.  Everything else is still wrong. :D 

 

Also, since we're talking specifically in the context of Blood Angels, I don't think Destroyers are a fluffy unit choice for them in any case.

[TheCelticRaven]

Ah apologies, then yes, that's correct. Everything else is still wrong.

Also, since we're talking specifically in the context of Blood Angels, I don't think Destroyers are a fluffy unit choice for them in any case.

yeah, the blood angels have a bad history with radiation...

[m0nolith]

Ah apologies, then yes, that's correct. Everything else is still wrong.

Also, since we're talking specifically in the context of Blood Angels, I don't think Destroyers are a fluffy unit choice for them in any case.

yeah, the blood angels have a bad history with radiation...

Having an irradiated wateland for a planet would make you an expert on radiation, no?

Plus most legions still has a solid number of Terran veterans that utilize the same weapons they did during the Unifacation Wars.

Id say they're pretty fluffy for BAs, if not very useful.

[Terminus]

"Considered
dishonourable by some
Legions who make little
use of them or eschew
them altogether, the
Destroyers are equipped
with and expert in the use
of otherwise proscribed
and forbidden weaponry.

Marked by their ?re-
blackened and chem-
scalded armour, Space
Marine Destroyers
are often shunned and
deemed somehow tainted
by their battle-brothers
in many Legions and
considered at best a
necessary evil, although
the effectiveness of
their relic weapons
cannot be denied."

 

Given that the Blood Angels are among the bleeding-heart-nice-guy Legions, I would assume they are among the group that feels that slagging people into goo and/or constituent atoms is probably a bit of a dick move.  The Angels are fully invested in the ideals of the Crusade and are trying to build a better tomorrow, not leave rad-blasted wastelands like their home town in their wake.

[m0nolith]

Look, were simply not going to agree here.

Was Sanguinius a bleeding heart nice guy when he recommended committing what would today essentially be called genocide with orbital scarring in Angels of Caliban?

See, everyone in this whole thing is a son of a bitch, just different shades of it.

Slagging people into goo is a dick move, but how much of a crap situation do you have to be in before even most bleeding heart nice guys start being desperate?

Do the Death Guard avoid using chem weapons just because Barbarus is a chemical wasteland, or do they become experts in it?

What about the Salamanders? Do they avoid flame based weapons because of Nocturne?

 

 

Heres the way FW describes them;

In battle, the Blood Angels Legion was the incarnation of the Emperor's wrath upon those who rejected the gift of Unity. Led by their angelic Primarch Sanguinius, their coming was nothing less than apocalyptic judgement delivered upon the guilty from on high.

 

FW is really pushing for a Renaissance era aesthetic of wrathful but controlled angels, in many ways the same way archangels were depicted in history. 

Incredibly protective of those they deem worthy, but genocidal wrath to those who who reject the Emperor.

I fully expect when the BA HH book come out, were going to read some stories of pure chivalry on their part, contrasted by stories of terrible things they have also committed in the name of their Ideology. They can conquer and defend, but they can also destroy.

No, the Blood Angels aren't good guys, there are no good guys here.

Everyone is a son of a bitch.

[Terminus]

Salamanders specifically dislike Dark Age technology because they are so nice. Sanguinius is portrayed as quite likable and reasonable in his few appearances in the HH series so far (see response to Nikea, conduct in Fear to Tread and Imperium Secundus), so I would expect him not to want to use the same tech that made his homeworld such a hellhole. Your interpretation is of course your own to have, but there are degrees of sons of bitchness in my opinion. Yes, Guilliman, Sanguinius and Dorn and the like will destroy your way of life and turn you into a cog in the Imperial machine, but that's still preferable to being fisted with a chainaxe by a crazed worldeater, or having the Night Lords play with you. If the wolves come running through, you may as well burn everything to the ground because you'll never get that wet dog smell out. Etc.

[m0nolith]

Salamanders specifically dislike Dark Age technology because they are so nice. Sanguinius is portrayed as quite likable and reasonable in his few appearances in the HH series so far (see response to Nikea, conduct in Fear to Tread and Imperium Secundus), so I would expect him not to want to use the same tech that made his homeworld such a hellhole. Your interpretation is of course your own to have, but there are degrees of sons of bitchness in my opinion. Yes, Guilliman, Sanguinius and Dorn and the like will destroy your way of life and turn you into a cog in the Imperial machine, but that's still preferable to being fisted with a chainaxe by a crazed worldeater, or having the Night Lords play with you. If the wolves come running through, you may as well burn everything to the ground because you'll never get that wet dog smell out. Etc.

 

Yes, Sanguinius is portrayed as someone who is quite likable, but what im arguing is that even he can be a monster. Hell, even Vulkan, the nicest of the nicest killed an Eldar  child in Vulkan Lives. This is what Grimdark is.

 

But were talking about whether or not the Blood Angels make use of Destroyers or not. 

Take your point of Gulliman. Say what you will about him, hes on the lower end of the son of bitchiness scale without a doubt, on par with Sanguinius. Hes reasonable, astute and fair in his dealings very similarly to Sanguinius in that regard. On the metric of goodness in 30k/40k hes one of the good guys. Simply put, hes a dictator but not a tyrant, and yet FW made an effort to show Destroyers in his Legion in HH book 5, so far in fact that they actually did a full page mock up of one.

 

The point being, almost everyone makes use of Destroyers if push comes to shove, including the "good" legions. The only ones that may not use them would maybe be the Salamanders due to their protective Promethean creed (and that's a maybe) and the Thousand Sons due to their low numbers and having almost no Terran survivors.

 

Finally,  Salamanders are like the way you mentioned, but their homeworld is a lava covered death world, so they know how to make use of flamethrowers ect ect. Thats what I meant by that point.

Same thing with Barbarus. They know how to use chem weapons because of where they come from.

 

Simply put, using them in a BA force is fluffy not simply because of their necessity in specific situations, but also because of the state of Baal.

[Terminus]

I figured they use Chem weapons because they are resistant to them so they are less of a double edge sword, and because Mortarion has PTSD from being one of the few Primarchs to fail in his conquest of his home planet (Angron being the other one).

[Charlo]

BA will unleash these weapons when Compliance is no longer an option.

 

If you have turned from the Emperor's light then you deserve no mercy. Sanguinius will weep for you then unleash his legions wrath from on high.

 

That's why I'm going to include Phosphex Quads in my BA Siege company list using DoR! They're the force you send in when utter divine judgement is the nature of the war, a pure white cleansing flame ;D

 

But yeah, Day of Revelation almost makes destroyers worth the points with pinning and a 5+ cover save. Plus Jump Apothercary access only helped them further. Plus Inferno Pistol Moritat needs some bodies too!

[m0nolith]

BA will unleash these weapons when Compliance is no longer an option.

 

If you have turned from the Emperor's light then you deserve no mercy. Sanguinius will weep for you then unleash his legions wrath from on high.

 

That's why I'm going to include Phosphex Quads in my BA Siege company list using DoR! They're the force you send in when utter divine judgement is the nature of the war, a pure white cleansing flame ;D

 

But yeah, Day of Revelation almost makes destroyers worth the points with pinning and a 5+ cover save. Plus Jump Apothercary access only helped them further. Plus Inferno Pistol Moritat needs some bodies too!

This.

Accept the Emperors light, or be wiped out. 

There is no in between.