Armoured support and other things.

[Canadian_F_H]

I'm not an SoB player, but an SoB sympathizer.

 

Have any of you put any thought into some armoured support.

 

Namely the tank formations from adeptus astartes, tricked out as SoB and clearly with some augmented targeting systems (brings to BS4, not unreasonable if veteran IG get bs4)

 

SOB predators, vindicators, etc. Sometimes you just need the big guns, and I can't see why an army with so much access to rhino chassis vehicles and wit such a large and influencial organization backing it couldn't or wouldn't have a decent motor pool for just incase situations.

 

In a 3k game why not have a handful of predators?

 

 

Now I know they need to bring a tech marine but that could just be whatever heavily augmented tech priest is responsible for that detatchment from the motor pool ..

 

 

Thoughts?

[Grgobart]

I have to admit, I do know nothing about formations, but I see two problems with your suggestion:

1. It Might be the purist in me talking, but if it's not a genuine SoB vehicle it doesn't get the the Shield of Faith special rule. And I like my vehicles to have a 6+ invulnerable Save accross the board.

2. Of all the things I look enviously at the Astartes Codex, Predators are not among them. I'm far too happy with our Exorcists for that.

Now the Vindicator on the other hand, might combine two thing I find lacking in some situations: a big blast and str10 weaponry, but sadly it provides them for the sort of range, I never deemed the Sisters lacking firepower in.

My opinion about this particular suggestion aside, I'm all for a bit more variety in heavy support for the Sisters in future releases. But I'd like it to be rather unique (as unique as is still possible with all the things aready out there for the Astartes and the Imperial Guard) for the Sisters. I personaly would fancy something long range, incendiary and big blast .

[Canadian_F_H]

Well, you can use whirlwinds in that same formation for what it's worth.

 

I'm sure most wouldn't go for this idea, but GW has most armies in such narrow boxes now, using counts as is one of the only things you can do to break out of it...

[Servant of Dante]

*ahem* We already have codex-wide BS4! We are as good as marines, without any of the fancy genetic enhancements!

I'd rather avoid copy-pasting things from C:SM (and yes, it's still copy/paste in my book if you add SoF).

I'm with Grgobart on this one. Exorcists are really plenty good at . . . just about everything. I suppose a unique long-range anti-hoard vehicle would be nice. A variant Whirlwind might work.

What we really need, is a reliable way to deal with flyers, but the BA suffer from basically the same problem *shrug*

Disclaimer: a bit of a rant. Ignore at will.

As to formations, I don't have much interest in using them in the first place. I know that how you "have to" play now, but I flat out don't care. I didn't start a Sisters army to curb-stomp anyone, and I don't think Formations add anything especially interesting to the game. But if GW releases Sisters formations, I will of course take a look could be fun. I still have an issue with "you have X, Y, and Z in your army, so they all get better for no reason with no drawback." Makes no sense to me.

+++

My opinion about this particular suggestion aside, I'm all for a bit more variety in heavy support for the Sisters in future releases. But I'd like it to be rather unique (as unique as is still possible with all the things aready out there for the Astartes and the Imperial Guard) for the Sisters. I personaly would fancy something long range, incendiary and big blast .

We really have never had much "variety" across the board, but I'm OK with that. I do agree (as I said above), that a long range large blast would be nice to have for anti-horde.

[dracpanzer]

Could be interesting with Vindicators, though I would take the Exorcist over the Predator or Whirlwind.

 

An Exorcist formation where all the Exorcists roll a dice for number of shots and they all use the highest would be fun.

[Canadian_F_H]

Are sisters BS4 for all units? My bad, 3rd edition stuck in my head still.

[Grgobart]

Are sisters BS4 for all units? My bad, 3rd edition stuck in my head still.

Back then Sisters were also BS4. Even 2nd edition Sisters were at least BS4.

[Canadian_F_H]

3rd edition BRB SoB army list shows all SoB as BS 3 except the commander.

 

3rd editon "2nd book of the astronomicon" lists bs3 for all non-elite SoB units.

 

These are the only versions of SoB rules I've ever owned so that's what I've been familiar with. If it's BS4 across the board now, that's pretty good.

[A.T.]

Back then Sisters were also BS4. Even 2nd edition Sisters were at least BS4.

 

They were BS3 in the 3rd edition core rulebook. Faith or sacred rites were introduced later to try and prop them up along with the Chapter Approved 2001 codex (including the exorcist - AV11, D6 S8 AP3 shots at BS3) but as a faction they were pretty reliant on flamers to get anywhere until the Witch Hunters release.

 

 

As for a little extra firepower - my first instinct with sisters is to reach for my Obsidian Knight... :p

[Servant of Dante]

3rd edition BRB SoB army list shows all SoB as BS 3 except the commander.

3rd editon "2nd book of the astronomicon" lists bs3 for all non-elite SoB units.

These are the only versions of SoB rules I've ever owned so that's what I've been familiar with. If it's BS4 across the board now, that's pretty good.

Ah, OK. I had forgotten about that (I even own that book ). Codex: Witch Hunters has them back at BS4, and I can confirm that the 2E 'dex has them at BS4 as well (I opened up my copy to check just now - thanks for the excuse to get it out!)

Back then Sisters were also BS4. Even 2nd edition Sisters were at least BS4.

They were BS3 in the 3rd edition core rulebook. Faith or sacred rites were introduced later to try and prop them up along with the Chapter Approved 2001 codex (including the exorcist - AV11, D6 S8 AP3 shots at BS3) but as a faction they were pretty reliant on flamers to get anywhere until the Witch Hunters release.

As for a little extra firepower - my first instinct with sisters is to reach for my Obsidian Knight...

Sacred Rites where only in the 2E codex, and Acts of Faith where added in the 3E Chapter Approved codex.

. . . crap! I had forgotten there was even a Sisters list in the 3E core book!

[Canadian_F_H]

Lol. That 3rd edition BRB was a bit of a wonder wasn't it? The entire rule set was under 100pages. It had full (if simple) army lists for every faction available at the time, and a ton of missions, and campaign stuff like unit experiance points etc...

 

Glad I helped y'all dust off your old tomes. :)

[Goonbandito]

An Imperial Knight is going to be more useful than a Space Marine Armoured Task Force in most situations (and is actually cheaper than taking 3 kitted Predators/Vindicators and a Techmarine).  Plus the Exorcist basically fills the same role as a Predator anyway.

 

An Emperor's Fist Armoured Company might be a more interesting fit for Sister Allies.  Leman Russ' can give some options that Sisters do lack, mainly ranged Blast weapons for dealing with Infantry (Eradictors with Heavy Bolter Sponsons are quite good at that) or the all-rounder flexibility of an Exterminator (with Plasma Sponsons it can find a target against basically anything).  That of course would require a decent points investment in Russ Hulls though (like 800 odd points), which may or may not fit the rest of the Sister Army.  Especially when you could take 2 Imperial Knights for those points...

[A.T.]

Sacred Rites where only in the 2E codex, and  Acts of Faith where added in the 3E Chapter Approved codex.

 

According to my notes they had Sacred Rites in White Dwarf 232 - written by Gav Thorpe. I believe that's 3rd edition, the chart differs from the 2nd edition codex.

 

D6 Score Effect

    1    No effect.

    2    The unit never counts as being outnumbered in an assault.

    3    The unit cannot be pinned.

    4    The unit ignores any negative modifiers on morale and pinning tests.

    5    The unit may re-roll any failed morale check.

    6    The unit may always attempt to regroup, with no restrictions.

    7    The unit never falls back and is automatically assumed to pass any morale check it is required to make.

    8    In close combat, the unit always hits on a 3+, regardless of relative Weapon Skills.

    9    All models in the unit add +1 to their Attacks for the duration of the battle.

 

Each infantry unit rolled once with the highest bonus for an attached character from -  Canoness +3,  Celestian Superior +2, Veteran Sister Superior +1

[Servant of Dante]

Sacred Rites where only in the 2E codex, and Acts of Faith where added in the 3E Chapter Approved codex.

According to my notes they had Sacred Rites in White Dwarf 232 - written by Gav Thorpe. I believe that's 3rd edition, the chart differs from the 2nd edition codex.

D6 Score Effect

1 No effect.

2 The unit never counts as being outnumbered in an assault.

3 The unit cannot be pinned.

4 The unit ignores any negative modifiers on morale and pinning tests.

5 The unit may re-roll any failed morale check.

6 The unit may always attempt to regroup, with no restrictions.

7 The unit never falls back and is automatically assumed to pass any morale check it is required to make.

8 In close combat, the unit always hits on a 3+, regardless of relative Weapon Skills.

9 All models in the unit add +1 to their Attacks for the duration of the battle.

Each infantry unit rolled once with the highest bonus for an attached character from - Canoness +3, Celestian Superior +2, Veteran Sister Superior +1

Oh! Cool! The bonuses granted by characters on the roll seem to be the same as for the 2E dex, but the results are different.

Thanks for pointing that out! I always love to see how the rules evolve over editions, it's quite fascinating. A bit of a amateur rules historian, and a bit of a collector.

Here's where I need to point out that I've only been playing for 3 years, and some of these books are practically as old as me

[tvih]

Meh, Exorcist is better than a Predator. Sisters don't really get blast templates, so I guess in that sense a Vindicator or a Whirlwind could work... but at the end of the day, I'd really prefer allying over counts-as or such. Then again marines are my main army anyway so doing so is no problem.

[dracpanzer]

The FAQ (draft so who knows) allowing Exorcists to draw LOS from any point on the organ barrels. I dont see a need to replace it with an allied tank, an Exorcist formation might be nice, probably mostly from saving room for other HS units. Free benefits for buying models might be nice, but I'm more inclined to go double CAD full Dominions in Repressors first.

 

With I think ten games against competitive lists using it the last few weeks I have really begun to enjoy it. I dont miss my Exorcists. Siezing the initiative with all those scouting Repressors full of melta is too much fun.

[dracpanzer]

According to my notes they had Sacred Rites in White Dwarf 232 - written by Gav Thorpe. I believe that's 3rd edition, the chart differs from the 2nd edition codex.

 

D6 Score Effect

    1    No effect.

    2    The unit never counts as being outnumbered in an assault.

    3    The unit cannot be pinned.

    4    The unit ignores any negative modifiers on morale and pinning tests.

    5    The unit may re-roll any failed morale check.

    6    The unit may always attempt to regroup, with no restrictions.

    7    The unit never falls back and is automatically assumed to pass any morale check it is required to make.

    8    In close combat, the unit always hits on a 3+, regardless of relative Weapon Skills.

    9    All models in the unit add +1 to their Attacks for the duration of the battle.

 

Each infantry unit rolled once with the highest bonus for an attached character from -  Canoness +3,  Celestian Superior +2, Veteran Sister Superior +1

Was always so hard to keep those straight back in 3ed tourneys. Rolling before each game for each unit was such a pain.

[Beams]

Meh, Exorcist is better than a Predator. Sisters don't really get blast templates, so I guess in that sense a Vindicator or a Whirlwind could work... but at the end of the day, I'd really prefer allying over counts-as or such. Then again marines are my main army anyway so doing so is no problem.

I weirdly like the idea that sisters don't have blasts. It forces us into a different role. There's a lot that other armies have that we dont, but at least we do it in style.

[Servant of Dante]

 

Meh, Exorcist is better than a Predator. Sisters don't really get blast templates, so I guess in that sense a Vindicator or a Whirlwind could work... but at the end of the day, I'd really prefer allying over counts-as or such. Then again marines are my main army anyway so doing so is no problem.

I weirdly like the idea that sisters don't have blasts. It forces us into a different role. There's a lot that other armies have that we dont, but at least we do it in style.

 

well, you can always throw a frag grenade, so technically we do have blasts, all of us (even Repentia).