Purchasing all of HH novels?

[Darkn3ssF4lls]

So i have up to book 5 on text, but the text is a lot of weight when you move around a lot. 

Does anyone think that it wouldn't be worth it to just by all 30ish novels in ibooks or black library and add it to ibooks to have them go around with me?

[bluntblade]

I'd say no. The quality can vary

[HeritorA]

There are like 10 awesome books, 5-10 good - everything else is .....let's say very 'not good'

[Darkn3ssF4lls]

I'd say no. The quality can vary

 

 

There are like 10 awesome books, 5-10 good - everything else is .....let's say very 'not good'

 

Doh, i've thought the first 4 were pretty good so far :( thats a shame when theres like 40 of them 

[Xisor]

Nah, if you liked the first four, there's a very strong chance you'll like almost all of them. Even myself (I chunter a lot about Angel Exterminatus and Vengeful Spirit, for example), but there's probably not 10 out of the 40 that I'd say are *really bad*. And I know plenty of people that like or love them.

 

What I would say, rather than a variation in quality, is that you just get a huge variation in style and, for some purposes, intent. You're unlikely to love all of it unconditionally; you'll definitely have favourites and not.

 

Looking back: I've read a dozens of them. Even the ones I moan about, I don't actually regret reading or begrudge whole heartedly. Every single one of them had plenty of redeeming features.

 

(Some just not *enough* of them...!)

[Roomsky]

Nah, if you liked the first four, there's a very strong chance you'll like almost all of them. Even myself (I chunter a lot about Angel Exterminatus and Vengeful Spirit, for example), but there's probably not 10 out of the 40 that I'd say are *really bad*. And I know plenty of people that like or love them.

 

                     I DISAGREE

 

There's a few factors you need to consider for the purposes of your collecting:

 

1: Are you loyal to the "old lore" (whatever Frankensteined story you've made your personal heresy by bastardizing 1st-4th ed material). This is a tricky one, you'd probably only want stories that conform/don't interfere with your idea of how the heresy went.

 

2: How high are your standards? And I don't mean to sound like some pompous idiot, I admit my quality standards are middling at best. Do you tend to enjoy most everything you read? Then read them all. Can you handle a few idiot plots, but can't stand it when the prose is awful? Avoid Gav Thorpe, his writing is six unique flavors of boring. Does it not matter how the story is written, so long as it has internal consistency and no one being a moron? Avoid poor Graham, who makes some truly stunning logical backflips.

 

3: Are you me? (The one everyone should strive for). If you are me, then congratulations you handsome rogue! You'll find almost everything worth a read (though maybe not a great read), except for:

 

Battle for the Abyss

Vulkan Lives

The Outcast Dead

Deliverance Lost

Vengeful Spirit

Deathfire

[helterskelter]

And of those you will get some enjoyment from battle for the abyss and vengeful spirit for some seriously cool ott shenanigans.

 

Personally i only really dislike the thorpe and Kyme novels. Gav I have no time for, read one and leave to accumulate dust because I need the plot details, and I struggle to finish kymes stuff. I find his writing flows a lot better during action scenes but in between takes some reading.

[HeritorA]

Nah, if you liked the first four, there's a very strong chance you'll like almost all of them. Even myself (I chunter a lot about Angel Exterminatus and Vengeful Spirit, for example), but there's probably not 10 out of the 40 that I'd say are *really bad*. And I know plenty of people that like or love them.

What I would say, rather than a variation in quality, is that you just get a huge variation in style and, for some purposes, intent. You're unlikely to love all of it unconditionally; you'll definitely have favourites and not.

Looking back: I've read a dozens of them. Even the ones I moan about, I don't actually regret reading or begrudge whole heartedly. Every single one of them had plenty of redeeming features.

(Some just not *enough* of them...!)

I hopefully presume that Battle for the Abyss, Outcast Dead, Vulkan Lives, Deathfire are not on the list

Nah, if you liked the first four, there's a very strong chance you'll like almost all of them. Even myself (I chunter a lot about Angel Exterminatus and Vengeful Spirit, for example), but there's probably not 10 out of the 40 that I'd say are *really bad*. And I know plenty of people that like or love them.

I DISAGREE

There's a few factors you need to consider for the purposes of your collecting:

1: Are you loyal to the "old lore" (whatever Frankensteined story you've made your personal heresy by bastardizing 1st-4th ed material). This is a tricky one, you'd probably only want stories that conform/don't interfere with your idea of how the heresy went.

2: How high are your standards? And I don't mean to sound like some pompous idiot, I admit my quality standards are middling at best. Do you tend to enjoy most everything you read? Then read them all. Can you handle a few idiot plots, but can't stand it when the prose is awful? Avoid Gav Thorpe, his writing is six unique flavors of boring. Does it not matter how the story is written, so long as it has internal consistency and no one being a moron? Avoid poor Graham, who makes some truly stunning logical backflips.

3: Are you me? (The one everyone should strive for). If you are me, then congratulations you handsome rogue! You'll find almost everything worth a read (though maybe not a great read), except for:

Battle for the Abyss

Vulkan Lives

The Outcast Dead

Deliverance Lost

Vengeful Spirit

Deathfire

Yes, I'm you

[Mellow]

I have them all on iBooks but my God. There are some awful stories that did nothing for me or my perception of the storyline.

 

There are of course some gems as well.

[Allart01]

I have the main e-book series up to date.

I was thinking about getting the series' in paperback,, but damn, starting to buy it now would be overwhelming - and as others said, not all the books are worth it.

My solution? The anthologies that came out this year.

Crusade's end, The razing of Prospero, The last Phoenix... they give a good representation of the series' pivotal moments and are a great value too.

I really hope they'll keep pumping those out.

[Sandlemad]

I have the main e-book series up to date.

I was thinking about getting the series' in paperback,, but damn, starting to buy it now would be overwhelming - and as others said, not all the books are worth it.

My solution? The anthologies that came out this year.

Crusade's end, The razing of Prospero, The last Phoenix... they give a good representation of the series' pivotal moments and are a great value too.

I really hope they'll keep pumping those out.

 

Yeah, this is good sense. This will give a solid grounding for the pivotal moments, though they don't touch on some of the more recent 'draw the plot lines together' books. Ebooks are the way to go for this I think, both cost-wise and because some novels don't warrant more than one read-through, but YMMV on that.

 

Possibly the best decision you could make would be to see about getting some of the anthologies of short stories and novellas: Age of Darkness, Shadows of Treachery, etc. Xizor mentioned not feeling regret after reading any particular HH book. I have with some novels but never with an anthology. There's always been sufficient variety and more than a few good 'uns in each book.

 

Above all, if you find you don't like one short or author, well, there's another in a few pages. It's a good way to figure out which authors you like, which you can then direct towards whatever novel reading you want to do. One possible downside to this is that a lot of the anthologies presume a certain amount of knowledge of the events of the novels - Mark of Calth works heavily from the events of Know No Fear - but to be honest you're going to run into the same thing with the novels.

[DarkChaplain]

I honestly don't think ebooks are the way to go. You barely save anything, and sometimes the ebooks can be more expensive than the paperbacks. If you buy the books off of Amazon, you'll usually pay around 10-13€ per large paperback, and 8-10€ for the mass market releases. Looking at Eye of Terra for example, its 13,49€ on Black Library as ebook, and I paid about 12 by preordering the large paperback print off Amazon.

 

Its just not very cost efficient to go ebook when you have retailers selling at better prices for the print editions. I'd rather have a paperback on my shelf than paying the same or even more for a digital release.

[Xisor]

Cost efficient be damned. I hate hauling a hardback around with me, and only rarely do any reading in the house. MMPB's were manageable, but the new trade paperback versions are just as awkward as the hardbacks.

 

Also, for The Beast Arises, ebooks are instant.

 

---

 

Also also, how much shelf space do you people have?

[DarkChaplain]

Plenty. Never enough, though. I might have to mount new lengthy shelves above the current ones next year, after renovating my apartment. Problem is, I might need a ladder to reach up there then

I get your problem with hardbacks though. Its part of the reason why I usually wait for trade paperbacks down the line, unless it is something special. Cheaper, lighter and easier to transport, and trade paperbacks are far sturdier than mass market releases, which is especially true when it comes to spine creases (which I despise)

[Darkn3ssF4lls]

Yea i have to agree, i'm not doing this cost savings to me haha, if that was the case i wouldn't be asking in the first place. Weight is at a premium when you move every few years and have to tow around books and models and more books and clothes etc haha.

[Mellow]

Nothing to do with cost for me. It's iBooks or no-books. There's no way I'm going to carry books around in any format. Being on your phone or whatever is so much more convenient.

[Allart01]

Cost efficient be damned. I hate hauling a hardback around with me, and only rarely do any reading in the house. MMPB's were manageable, but the new trade paperback versions are just as awkward as the hardbacks.

 

Also, for The Beast Arises, ebooks are instant.

 

---

 

Also also, how much shelf space do you people have?

 

This.

Instaread+free space make it for me.

Sure, the prices are high, but I don't mind four or five books per year.

I keep the shelves for models and limited special very nice edition omnibus stuff.

[bluntblade]

They should really do a Scars bundle with Wraight's trilogy plus Brotherhood of the Moon and Allegiances

[Phoebus]

So i have up to book 5 on text, but the text is a lot of weight when you move around a lot. 

Does anyone think that it wouldn't be worth it to just by all 30ish novels in ibooks or black library and add it to ibooks to have them go around with me?

I went with iBooks. I just can't deal with the shelf space and, in all honesty, I wouldn't be interested in having several entries in hard copy.

 

If you're up to Fulgrim and concerned about being able to read the series as a whole, I would suggest sacrificing:

 

Descent of Angels

Battle for the Abyss

Mechanicum

Nemesis

The Outcast Dead

The Mark of Calth

The Damnation of Pythos

Legacies of Betrayal

Pharos

 

This isn't a list of novels that are necessarily "worse" than others. I'd be opposed to steer you away from any book due to personal preference, as everyone's tastes differ. Rather, I would offer that the above entries are not integral to the overall storyline.

 

For instance, believe it or not, you don't necessarily need to read Descent of Angels in order to get through Fallen Angels. There is a bit of a gap in terms of the relationship between Nemiel and Zahariel if you go this route, but it's nothing that detracts from the plot. Similarly, Mechanicum is perhaps the central entry concerning the Tech-Priests of Mars, but very little found within its pages ties in to the other thirty-nine numbered books in the series. There is something good to be found in each of these novels, but if your concern is that the series as a whole is too large to catch up to, these entries aren't directly tied to the war itself.

 

I would also offer the following qualifiers to the above list. I didn't include Vulkan Lives or Deathfire because they tie in closely to the Imperium Secundus arc and are integral to Vulkan's own plot line. That having been said, Imperium Secundus itself is notable in that it is a storyline involving events kept hidden from the wider Imperium after the Heresy. Thus, unless you're desperate to know why the Dark Angels and Blood Angels didn't head to Terra following the events shown in The Primarchs and Shadows of Treachery, you could realistically omit The Unremembered Empire and Angels of Caliban, as well. Where that last entry is concerned, you must understand that you'll miss out on some interesting developments that will culminate in the post-Heresy battle between the treacherous Lutherites and the Lion's loyalists... but, again, you're not missing anything central to the main storyline.

 

Going that route, you could focus on just twenty-one of the thirty-four numbered entries you have left after Fulgrim. Again, however, I'm not advocating that you skip on any of these on the basis of them being "worse" or what have you. Either way, I hope that helped.

[DarkChaplain]

I wouldn't sacrifice Descent of Angels or Fallen Angels. They play things up for Angels of Caliban. Maybe delay them til you reach that, but skipping them makes you lose out on the characters.

Fallen Angels never shows Zahariel and Nemiel in the same plotline, so you're missing out on the entirety of their brotherhood, and the whole origin of the Order. Besides, I thought it was a fine novel, even if more on the fantasy side than you'd expect.

 

Pharos is a pretty important bit too I'd argue. Sanguinius and Curze get interesting development, Alexis and Barabas stole the show with their scenes, and it advances the Night Lords plot in general.

 

Skipping might have been an option with the early novels that acted mostly stand-alone, but now? Everything's intertwined and part of an arc, or more. Skip one book and you'll lack context for a lot of others.

[Xisor]

Amusingly, skipping Vulkan Lives & Deathfire would really ram home the weirdness of the Unremembered Empire.

 

 

Insane Vulkan appears from nowhere, goes on a rampage, has an elaborate galactic plot to kill him, dies.

 

 

Then later events in Deathfire - are they even mentioned in Pharos or Angels of Caliban?

 

 

Almost no-one remarks or reflects on the implications of that Primarch's body being nicked by deserting Marines who bugger off amidst the bloodiest, most catastrophic war Humanity has ever known...

 

 

In that respect, the only thing lost is knowing what's actually going on. And, as per Deathfire:

 

that knowledge isn't really useful. Magnus sees that... Vulkan lives... is that it...? I forget.

 

 

 

I didn't realise I was so down on these - especially as I enjoyed VL.

 

They're not integral to the series, however, and unless the third one changes things, can be heartily omitted.

 

The novella Scorched Earth, similarly, could be omitted - but it's of sufficiently excellent quality that I really wouldn't recommend skipping it. It's very good.

[Phoebus]

I don't disagree with your points on principle. What you state more or less describes how I felt after reading the series as a whole.

 

In terms of what the original poster was asking, though, my sole criteria for elimination was whether an entry wasn't tied to the central storyline. With that in mind, you certainly don't see the relationship between Nemiel and Zahariel if you don't read Descent of Angels, but I would ask if that relationship matters in the grand scheme of things. Similarly, with Pharos, I would ask how crucial the advancement of the Night Lords plot is. When I ask those questions, I frame them within the context of, "If the original poster had to choose between either of those two novels or, say, Betrayer, which should they go for?"

 

To me, the answer is obvious. One could argue that Betrayer itself focuses on the Shadow Crusade, which is just one of the theatres of war the Traitor Legions are engaged in, but it is also the tale of how Angron becomes a Daemon Primarch, which is an absolutely huge development - for the setting as a whole and for the Heresy specifically.

[DarkChaplain]

Judging from the setup for Vulkan and what's come up in The Beast Arises, I predict the third Vulkan book to have him defending the webway in some capacity. We'll see how it is handled in the end.

 

As for the oddities of Imperium Secundus, I'm currently working on a lengthy write-up on its failings and what it did right, including publishing mistakes like scheduling. Hopefully gonna be done by tomorrow at this rate, still a lot of stuff to talk about.

 

 

Phoebus, I see where you're coming from. But likewise, Descent of Angels shows the initial steps of Luther's apparent corruption and the Lion's distrust. It gives plenty of Legion background that is snatched up in later works and expanded upon. I'd consider Luther's fall and the schism's origin to be a pretty pivotal moment of the Heresy and after.

With Pharos, there is a whole lot of stuff involving Sanguinius' role within Imperium Secundus that hasn't been tackled before, and not to the same degree in Angels of Caliban. Curze, too, has some massive implications in his conversation with Sanguinius which echo throughout the series. And the Night Lords, post-Prince of Crows, will be playing a role in the rest of the series too, so the shift in leadership and potential rescue/whatever of Sevatar would be important to read about, moreso as new parts of the plotline get revealed down the line.

 

What I'm trying to say is that it really depends on one's personal perspective of what is important, and that a lot of the more recent releases can't really be taken either way yet. We all know how The Unremembered Empire fits into the bill, with it being firmly placed between various novels and novellas, but can't say the same about the last few books which haven't been squeezed in yet. Right now, Pythos may be seen as an outlier that isn't important to read, but hinging on future stories about Madail's rampage, and potential presence at the Siege of Terra, that might change drastically.

[Tymell]

My 2p regarding skipping any - The ones I've felt were genuinely bad (5/10 or less) were:

 

Nemesis

Fallen Angels

The Outcast Dead

Vulkan Lives

Battle for the Abyss

False Gods

Descent of Angels

 

Out of those, I'd say Battle for the Abyss and Descent of Angels are the most truly "skipable", in that they are very poor books and they add nothing to the series as a whole. You will miss nothing by not reading them. Others in that list I think are bad, but at least serve a purpose within the overall story (False Gods for instance).

I'd also throw the novellas The Honoured, Scorched Earth and Promethean Sun in there as being basically pointless and badly written. Cybernetica's pretty dire too, but again I feel like it could have some impact in the long-term, if they revisit Mars.

[HeritorA]

I honestly don't think ebooks are the way to go. You barely save anything, and sometimes the ebooks can be more expensive than the paperbacks. If you buy the books off of Amazon, you'll usually pay around 10-13€ per large paperback, and 8-10€ for the mass market releases. Looking at Eye of Terra for example, its 13,49€ on Black Library as ebook, and I paid about 12 by preordering the large paperback print off Amazon.

Its just not very cost efficient to go ebook when you have retailers selling at better prices for the print editions. I'd rather have a paperback on my shelf than paying the same or even more for a digital release.

You miss the point, which is - ebook could be read during some event, or even at work at parallel window - but you wouldn't be able to open real physical book before your boss face