Help me corrupt the innocent - 1k v 1k for a new player

[God-Potato of Mankind]

Hi gang, 

I am attempting to subvert my partner into enjoying 30k. 

So I am arranging a small, 1k a side game to test the waters. I thought 1k was the best start (I'd probably start with 40k, but I don't have sufficiently large armies for this).

 

What I'm looking for are two, balanced and fun lists that aren't too mismatched or cheesey. 

 

I've come up with this so far, Salamanders versus World Eaters, perhaps using a book 1 or 2 mission:

 

Salamanders

 

 

Sallies

 

Praetor in Cataphractii armour, with paragon stabby & Legion goodies 

 

10 breachers with 2 flamers, sergeant with artificer, melta bombs & master fist

10 tacticals, rhino and sergeant with artificer & master fist

 

Javelin with heavy flamer, 2x HKs

 

Land Raider Achilles - Pintle MM

 

 

 

World Eaters

 

 

 

Khârn

Gahlan

 

14 Inductii, sergeant with artificer & fist

14 despoilers, sergeant with artificer & fists 

 

2 Babby 'temptors (Cortus) with kheres cannons

 

 

 

Would these lists be relatively equal/fun to fight with?  The World Eaters will trash things on the charge, but will have to contend with multiple flamer templates. The Kheres will put out a lot of shots, but will have to watch out for multi-melta blasts and shatter shells from the raider. 

 

Thoughts? (Partner is playing WE, so if anything I'd be inclined to make that list the "easiest" to play)

[Apostle of the 30th Host]

Personally, I would say that this is very much in favour of the Salamanders - The Achilles is AV14 all round with 3 Multi Meltas and a Quad Launcher: nothing he has can even come close to harming it and it will destroy those Contemptors!

That and the Javelin with Hunter Killers, his only option is just to run at you (and I know that is about as sophisticated as World Eaters tactics get in the fluff but still) and the rest on your army will just take him to pieces from range.

 

Personally I would cut the Special Characters and Tanks and stick to Infantry and Walkers just to learn the basics. Maybe use Consuls instead of a Praetor as well as they are cheaper and less significantly powerful.

 

Does it have to be Salamanders v World Eaters?

[God-Potato of Mankind]

Personally, I would say that this is very much in favour of the Salamanders - The Achilles is AV14 all round with 3 Multi Meltas and a Quad Launcher: nothing he has can even come close to harming it and it will destroy those Contemptors!

That and the Javelin with Hunter Killers, his only option is just to run at you (and I know that is about as sophisticated as World Eaters tactics get in the fluff but still) and the rest on your army will just take him to pieces from range.

 

Personally I would cut the Special Characters and Tanks and stick to Infantry and Walkers just to learn the basics. Maybe use Consuls instead of a Praetor as well as they are cheaper and less significantly powerful.

 

Does it have to be Salamanders v World Eaters?

 

I can also utilise Solar Auxilia, but the Eaters are fixed. I see your point, what about this:

 

Salamanders

 

 

 

Centurion - Terminator armour, stormshield & master thunder hammer

5 Terminators - Thunder hammers, shields & heavy flamer

 

10 Breachers, flamers, sergeant with fist & artificer

10 Tacs, rhino, sergeant with fist & artificer

 

Contemptor dreadnought, heavy flamer

 

 

 

World Eaters

 

 

Centurion, artificer, power axe & refractor field

 

30 despoilers, sergeants with fists & artificer

 

2x Kheres Cortus babbynaughts

 

6 Culverin heavy support troopers

 

 

 

Would giving Sallies terminators be too much? I think the choomsquad should be able to saturate the troops well and Contemptors can reasonably batter the Terminators? They are obviously at a disadvantage with no transport!

[Apostle of the 30th Host]

Here is a pair of lists I just put together building on what you suggested. I think they are quite evenly matched and introduce him to the basics of the game, including Rites of War, as well as the way the World Eaters wage war.

Word Eaters 1200 Points
Rite of War: The Crimson Path (Infantry gain FNP, or +1 to an existing FNP, and characters gain It Will Not Die, both in the enemy deployment zone)

Legion Centurion – 100
(Delegatus Consul, Artificer Armour, Master-Crafted Power Axe, Refractor Field)

15 Despoilers – 205 / 305
(Artificer Armour, Power Fist, Chainaxes, Melta Bombs)

15 Despoilers – 205 / 510
(Artificer Armour, Power Fist, Chainaxes, Melta Bombs)

Tactical Support Squad (10) – 195 / 705
(Volkite Chargers, Chainaxes)

3 Apothecaries – 165 / 870
(Artificer Armour)

Contemptor-Cortus Dreadnought – 165 / 1035
(Kheres Pattern Assault Cannon, Meltagun)

Contemptor-Cortus Dreadnought – 165 / 1200
(Kheres Pattern Assault Cannon, Meltagun)

 

*Word Eaters Tactics: All 3 squads have an Apothecary (4+ FNP with RoW), Delegatus joins one of the 3 - two squads for close combat, Volkite squad fire support or combat. They all charge at the enemy alongside the Contemptors. FNP helps them to stay alive until they get there.


Salamanders 1200
Rite of War: The Covenant of Fire

Legion Centurion – 115
(Delegatus Consul, Cataphractii Armour, Master-Crafted Thunder Hammer, Dragonscale Strom Shield)

Legion Terminator Squad – 250 / 365
(Thunder Hammers and Dragonscale Storm Shields)

Breacher Squad (10) – 245 / 610
(Artificer Armour, 2 Flamers, Power Fist)

Breacher Squad (10) – 245 / 855
(Artificer Armour, 2 Flamers, Power Fist)

Contemptor Dreadnought – 185 / 1040
(Heavy Flamer)

5 Pyroclasts – 160 / 1200

 

*Salamanders Tactics: Salamanders hold the line and Terminators/Contemptor counter attack. Flame and Melta fits their Special Rules and can counter the World Eaters' Dreadnoughts, but not too overpowered.

 

I would say that both lists are equally matched and it would be a very tactical game for one to take the edge. Introduces the new player to Rites of War as well as building a decent core to what could be a bigger army. Furthermore, both are very thematic and show of the traits of their respective Legions.

[God-Potato of Mankind]

Here is a pair of lists I just put together building on what you suggested. I think they are quite evenly matched and introduce him to the basics of the game, including Rites of War, as well as the way the World Eaters wage war.

 

Word Eaters 1200 Points

 

 

Thanks, the primary issue there is I don't have 2 apothecaries, 10 breachers and a charger support squad. 

 

I have a randomly huge amount of Salamanders but my Eaters are fairly small currently:

 

60 Despoilers

10 Cataphractii

10 Culverin heavy troopers

2 Spartans

1 Deredeo

2 Kheresnaughts

Gahlan

Chaplain

Khârn

Angron

 

So there is a small limit to what I can run with them, but run them I must. 

 

For my Salamanders:

 

 

 

20 Tacticals

2 Rhinos

10 Firedrakes (Or regular terminators by proxy)

10 Breachers

3 Jetbikes

1 Javelin

2 Achilles

5 Pyroclasts

2 Magnamelta preds

2 Techmarines

3 Contemptor (dual AC, dual fist & stock) 

3 Vorax and a Praevian

 

 

 

For my Auxilia

 

 

 

30 Veletarii

Enginseer & 4 automata

Lasrifle section (might be elsewhere not sure)

2 Vanquishers

1 Infernus

Command Section

Lord Marshall

Dracosian

Lightning

3 Quad Mortars

 

...basically it's heavily mechanised.

 

 

 

 

I left the big guns out. 

[Apostle of the 30th Host]

To be honest, I recon you could just use stand-ins for those units to play with your mate and then when they build their own army they can get them. Wouldn't be too hard.

 

Khârn counts as the Delegatus

Ghalan counts as one Apothecary, whilst 2 spare Despoilers stand in for the other 2.

10 Heavy Volkites stand in for the Chargers.

 

I know it's not quite right but if you explain that I think the new player will understand?

 

Because really the Apothecaries and Chargers are kind of important to balance the lists and RoW's as the World Eaters FNP comes up against the superior firepower of the Salamanders while the chargers are assault weapons so they can all charge forward to put the pressure on you.

 

Obviously it is your lists so do just ignore me, but I think a bit of proxying is worth it for a nice balance.

[God-Potato of Mankind]

To be honest, I recon you could just use stand-ins for those units to play with your mate and then when they build their own army they can get them. Wouldn't be too hard.

 

Khârn counts as the Delegatus

Ghalan counts as one Apothecary, whilst 2 spare Despoilers stand in for the other 2.

10 Heavy Volkites stand in for the Chargers.

 

I know it's not quite right but if you explain that I think the new player will understand?

 

Because really the Apothecaries and Chargers are kind of important to balance the lists and RoW's as the World Eaters FNP comes up against the superior firepower of the Salamanders while the chargers are assault weapons so they can all charge forward to put the pressure on you.

 

Obviously it is your lists so do just ignore me, but I think a bit of proxying is worth it for a nice balance.

 

Ah, yes. Good idea, I shall proxy. Not sure why I didn't just think of that! 

Cheers, you've been super helpful. 

[Apostle of the 30th Host]

No worries mate! Hope it goes well and you win them over to 30k!! Let us all know how the game runs in case the lists need a bit more tinkering after the first game.