Rangaman Posted October 21, 2016 Share Posted October 21, 2016 As I come towards the end of my Sons of Horus and plans are now in motion to finish off my remaining Knights, I have decided to look a little further and see where my Emperor's Children are headed. As I want a different playstyle to the SoH (Armoured Spearhead) and don't really want to be running a pruple version of my sea-green one, I have thrown together a list that I think could be fun and looks a bit different to most others I have seen. As of this moment I only have the two Veteran squads assembled, one of which is completed, so I am fairly open to change with other's input. This list is designed to be used with Fulgrim taking the "Master of Ambush" trait and giving the Veteran squads Infiltrate. Meanwhile, the Dreadclaws and Kharybdis will drop their Terminator squads in the best place to assault artillery and heavy tanks, after which they will fly around burninating things and generally being a nuisance. I have never really been a fan of deathstars since they can be easily avoided, so I may look into removing the Phoenix Terminators in general for a more useful unit. I am not the most experienced gamer and have little knowledge of Dreadclaws and using flyers to their optimum, so your input is greatly appreciated. +++ EC Primarch's Chosen (2425pts) +++ ++ Legiones Astartes: Age of Darkness Army List (Age of Darkness) (2425pts) ++ + HQ (130pts) + Legion Centurion (130pts) [Tartaros Terminator Armour with Combi-bolter and Power Weapon, Thunderhammer] May be upgraded to one of these Consul roles: [Chaplain] + Troops (1215pts) + Legion Terminator Squad (350pts) [Anvillus Pattern Dreadclaw Drop Pod, 4x Combi-Weapon, 4x Legion Terminators, 4x Power Fist, Tartaros Terminator Armour with Combi-bolter and Power Weapon] Legion Terminator Sergeant [Combi-Weapon, Power Fist] Legion Terminator Squad (350pts) [Anvillus Pattern Dreadclaw Drop Pod, 4x Combi-Weapon, 4x Legion Terminators, 4x Power Fist, Tartaros Terminator Armour with Combi-bolter and Power Weapon] Legion Terminator Sergeant [Combi-Weapon, Power Fist] Legion Veteran Tactical Squad (230pts) [9x Legion Veteran Space Marines, Marksmen, 2x Plasma Gun] Legion Veteran Sergeant [Artificer Armour, Plasma Pistol, Power Fist] Legion Veteran Tactical Squad (285pts) [9x Legion Veteran Space Marines, Marksmen, 4x Power Weapon, 2x Volkite Charger, 7x Volkite Serpenta] Legion Veteran Sergeant [Artificer Armour, Lightning Claw, Volkite Serpenta] + Elites (465pts) + Apothecarion Detachment (120pts) Legion Apothecary [Combi-weapon] Legion Apothecary [Power Sword, Volkite Charger] Phoenix Terminator Squad (345pts) [6x Phoenix Terminators] + Heavy Support (235pts) + Legion Kharybdis Assault Claw (235pts) + Legion + Legion Astartes [iII: Emperor's Children, Traitor] + Lord of War (380pts) + Fulgrim the Illuminator (380pts) [Primarch] Master of the Legion [Primarch's Chosen] Created with BattleScribe Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/327088-iiird-fulgrim-terminators-and-jetbikes-25k/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
K3nn3rs Posted October 21, 2016 Share Posted October 21, 2016 The advantage with Primarchs Chosen is that you can ditch the normal HQ - saving you points - as Fulgrim can fill the HQ slot. I'd drop the plasma pistol of the vet Sgt - a combi plasma would be better (and cheaper) Currently you have no room for your apothercarys - either drop them or drop a vet from each sqd (but you'll need to drop the second special weapon). If you keep them use the points from the dropped vet to give them artificer armour. I think at least one of your terminator units needs chain fists in, ideally all 5 of them. This would allow them to charge heavy armour/ superheavies on T2. If you go with that route cataphractii armour might be a better option - it gives them a fighting chance of sieving against a night with the improved 4++. If you drop the apothercarys and Chaplain you might be able to squeeze in some air support such as a lightning to help deal with super heavies or a fire raptor for mass fire support. A leviathan in a DDP would be a brutal addition to this list at 3000pts and fits the drop pod theme. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/327088-iiird-fulgrim-terminators-and-jetbikes-25k/#findComment-4539198 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rangaman Posted October 22, 2016 Author Share Posted October 22, 2016 Thanks K3nn3rs, I took the Chaplain for the To Hit Re-rolls so that the Phoenix Terminators would hit as hard as they can on the charge to try and stop them getting tarpitted. The Veterans are not in any transport at this moment, the plan was to Infiltrate them somewhere safe to start and wait for the Terminators to arrive, is this unwise? I will definitely get a chainfist for each Terminator squad and probably run them in Cata armour, isn't a full squad of chainfists overkill? The list isn't exactly 2.5k yet either so I think squeezing a Leviathan in would be a good plan, are the Veteran squads a redundant idea? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/327088-iiird-fulgrim-terminators-and-jetbikes-25k/#findComment-4540317 Share on other sites More sharing options...
K3nn3rs Posted October 22, 2016 Share Posted October 22, 2016 No way - Vets are great with lots of cool ways to run them, some are more points efficient then others. With your +1 I and the +1 WS you can certainly run some solid close combat vets. Even with inflitration (I assume from Fulgrims selection of warlord trait?) putting them in a rhino will help keep them alive for a bit longer. Some may say 5x chainfusts in one squad is over kill but I use mine to hunt Spartans/ super heavies or to try and finish of knights. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/327088-iiird-fulgrim-terminators-and-jetbikes-25k/#findComment-4540683 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rangaman Posted October 22, 2016 Author Share Posted October 22, 2016 I must admit, I do like the idea of 5 Cataphractii all armed with chainfists...made some changes to the list, now everything is mounted in Dreadclaws. I know it will look cool fielded together but I cant help feeling that 25% of my list is wasted on transports. I went with a large Tactical squad to blanket Fulgrim (who will now be using the Strategic Genius trait), they have an attached Apothecary with Augury scanner and will ride in the Kharybdis while the Vets now each have lost a member to make room for the Apothecaries and will get a Dreadclaw as well. The two Terminator squads will go for heavy armour using the Dreadclaws to get into position and relying on the Cataphract armour to keep them alive. Thoughts? +++ EC Primarch's Chosen (2500pts) +++ ++ Legiones Astartes: Age of Darkness Army List (Age of Darkness) (2500pts) ++ + Troops (1455pts) + Legion Tactical Squad (254pts) [16x Legion Tactical Space Marines, Take an additional Chainsword or Combat Blade] Legion Tactical Sergeant [Artificer Armour, Power Fist] Legion Terminator Squad (375pts) [Anvillus Pattern Dreadclaw Drop Pod, Cataphractii Terminator Armour with Combi-bolter and Power Weapon, 4x Chainfist, 4x Combi-Weapon, 4x Legion Terminators] Legion Terminator Sergeant [Chainfist, Combi-Weapon] Legion Terminator Squad (375pts) [Anvillus Pattern Dreadclaw Drop Pod, Cataphractii Terminator Armour with Combi-bolter and Power Weapon, 4x Chainfist, 4x Combi-Weapon, 4x Legion Terminators] Legion Terminator Sergeant [Chainfist, Combi-Weapon] Legion Veteran Tactical Squad (188pts) [8x Legion Veteran Space Marines, Marksmen, Plasma Gun] Legion Veteran Sergeant [Artificer Armour, Power Fist] Legion Veteran Tactical Squad (263pts) [8x Legion Veteran Space Marines, Marksmen, 4x Power Weapon, Volkite Charger, 7x Volkite Serpenta] Legion Veteran Sergeant [Artificer Armour, Lightning Claw, Volkite Serpenta] + Elites (200pts) + Apothecarion Detachment (200pts) Legion Apothecary [Artificer Armour, Combi-weapon] Legion Apothecary [Artificer Armour, Power Sword, Volkite Charger] Legion Apothecary [Artificer Armour, Augury Scanner] + Fast Attack (230pts) + Anvillus Pattern Dreadclaw Drop Pod (115pts) Anvillus Pattern Dreadclaw Drop Pod (115pts) + Heavy Support (235pts) + Legion Kharybdis Assault Claw (235pts) + Legion + Legion Astartes [iII: Emperor's Children, Traitor] + Lord of War (380pts) + Fulgrim the Illuminator (380pts) [Primarch] Master of the Legion [Primarch's Chosen] Created with BattleScribe Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/327088-iiird-fulgrim-terminators-and-jetbikes-25k/#findComment-4540745 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terminus Posted October 23, 2016 Share Posted October 23, 2016 I don't think the big tactical blob is worth anything, I actually really liked the first list. Phoenix guard win on ties plus Fulgrim's bonus to resolution actually seemed really thematic and fun. The Centurion chaplain is a nice force multiplier and S8 for the unit although a Primus Medicae is also a very valid option. I question the serpenta veteran squad. Would this work better with combi-flamers than volkite? All chainfists in the terminator squads is overkill and you could shave points to go ahead and max the plasma marksman squad. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/327088-iiird-fulgrim-terminators-and-jetbikes-25k/#findComment-4541491 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rangaman Posted October 23, 2016 Author Share Posted October 23, 2016 I agree with you Terminus about the Tacticals, I replaced them with a Drop leviathan straight after making that list. The Volkite Veterans are just a unit I painted for rule of cool, but I will scrap them from this list. So now I am headed in a Terminator heavy direction, the rewrite has 145points left over but I could scrap one or both of the Centurions to squeeze a Contemptor-Cortus in with grav fists or do the Plasma Marksmen vet squad. +++ EC Primarchs Chosen Terminator Heavy (2355pts) +++ ++ Legiones Astartes: Age of Darkness Army List (Age of Darkness) (2355pts) ++ + HQ (265pts) + Legion Centurion (125pts) [Phoenix Spear, Tartaros Terminator Armour with Combi-bolter and Power Weapon] Legiones Astartes [Legion Specific Rules] May be upgraded to one of these Consul roles: [Chaplain] Legion Centurion (140pts) [Tartaros Terminator Armour with Combi-bolter and Power Weapon, Thunderhammer] Legiones Astartes [Legion Specific Rules] May be upgraded to one of these Consul roles: [Primus Medicae] + Troops (720pts) + Legion Terminator Squad (360pts) [Anvillus Pattern Dreadclaw Drop Pod, Cataphractii Terminator Armour with Combi-bolter and Power Weapon, 2x Chainfist, 4x Combi-Weapon, 4x Legion Terminators, 2x Power Fist] Legion Terminator Sergeant [Combi-Weapon, Power Fist] Legiones Astartes [Legion Specific Rules] Legion Terminator Squad (360pts) [Anvillus Pattern Dreadclaw Drop Pod, Cataphractii Terminator Armour with Combi-bolter and Power Weapon, 2x Chainfist, 4x Combi-Weapon, 4x Legion Terminators, 2x Power Fist] Legion Terminator Sergeant [Combi-Weapon, Power Fist] Legiones Astartes [Legion Specific Rules] + Elites (360pts) + Phoenix Terminator Squad (360pts) [6x Phoenix Terminators, Sonic Shriekers] [Phoenix Champion] Legiones Astartes [Legion Specific Rules] + Heavy Support (630pts) + Legion Kharybdis Assault Claw (235pts) Leviathan Siege Dreadnought Talon (395pts) Leviathan Siege Dreadnought [Legion Dreadnought Drop Pod, Leviathan Storm Cannon, Phosphex Discharger] + Legion + Legion Astartes [iII: Emperor's Children, Traitor] + Lord of War (380pts) + Fulgrim the Illuminator (380pts) [Primarch] Master of the Legion [Primarch's Chosen] Created with BattleScribe Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/327088-iiird-fulgrim-terminators-and-jetbikes-25k/#findComment-4541501 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terminus Posted October 23, 2016 Share Posted October 23, 2016 I think just a primus medicae with a Thunder Hammer is adequate support for Fulgrim and his squad. You don't really need to kill the opponent unless they are fearless, as the resolution bonuses almost ensure a victory every time. With the general lack of up-front anti-tank, I would arm the Leviathan with Siege Drill and a Melta Lance. You are in an awkward place with 4 pods, so Kharybdis/Leviathan first turn, and then waiting on reinforcements. You either need one more, or one less. The cortus in a pod may be a good way to go, although 2 Leviathans and Kharybdis with Primarch Death Star is the ultimate :cuss you Fulgrim does grant re-rolls to reinforcements if I remember correctly? What were you going to pick for your strategic trait? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/327088-iiird-fulgrim-terminators-and-jetbikes-25k/#findComment-4541568 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rangaman Posted October 23, 2016 Author Share Posted October 23, 2016 Two Leviathans would be the dream, but I don't think I can fit that all in. I overlooked Fulgrim's reserve re-rolls as I was going to take the Warlord trait that did that, I may take the Coordinated Assault trait then to make up for no Chaplain...I quite like the changes. +++ EC Primarchs Chosen Terminator Heavy (2495pts) +++ ++ Legiones Astartes: Age of Darkness Army List (Age of Darkness) (2495pts) ++ + HQ (140pts) + Legion Centurion (140pts) [Tartaros Terminator Armour with Combi-bolter and Power Weapon, Thunderhammer] Legiones Astartes [Legion Specific Rules] May be upgraded to one of these Consul roles: [Primus Medicae] + Troops (710pts) + Legion Terminator Squad (355pts) [Anvillus Pattern Dreadclaw Drop Pod, Cataphractii Terminator Armour with Combi-bolter and Power Weapon, Chainfist, 4x Combi-Weapon, 4x Legion Terminators, 3x Power Fist] Legion Terminator Sergeant [Combi-Weapon, Power Fist] Legiones Astartes [Legion Specific Rules] Legion Terminator Squad (355pts) [Anvillus Pattern Dreadclaw Drop Pod, Cataphractii Terminator Armour with Combi-bolter and Power Weapon, Chainfist, 4x Combi-Weapon, 4x Legion Terminators, 3x Power Fist] Legion Terminator Sergeant [Combi-Weapon, Power Fist] Legiones Astartes [Legion Specific Rules] + Elites (620pts) + Contemptor-Cortus Class Dreadnought Talon (275pts) Cortus Dreadnought [Chainfist with inbuilt twin-linked Bolter, 2x Graviton Gun, Legion Dreadnought Drop Pod] Phoenix Terminator Squad (345pts) [6x Phoenix Terminators] [Phoenix Champion] Legiones Astartes [Legion Specific Rules] + Heavy Support (645pts) + Legion Kharybdis Assault Claw (235pts) Leviathan Siege Dreadnought Talon (410pts) Leviathan Siege Dreadnought [Cyclonic Melta Lance, Legion Dreadnought Drop Pod, Leviathan Siege Drill, Phosphex Discharger] + Legion + Legion Astartes [iII: Emperor's Children, Traitor] + Lord of War (380pts) + Fulgrim the Illuminator (380pts) [Primarch] Master of the Legion [Primarch's Chosen] Created with BattleScribe Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/327088-iiird-fulgrim-terminators-and-jetbikes-25k/#findComment-4541587 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slips Posted October 23, 2016 Share Posted October 23, 2016 Only issue I see is the lack of a Compusory Hq selection since the Primus is a Support Officer. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/327088-iiird-fulgrim-terminators-and-jetbikes-25k/#findComment-4541588 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rangaman Posted October 23, 2016 Author Share Posted October 23, 2016 Doesn't Fulgrim become the compulsory HQ with Primarchs Chosen? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/327088-iiird-fulgrim-terminators-and-jetbikes-25k/#findComment-4541592 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slips Posted October 23, 2016 Share Posted October 23, 2016 Derp. Forgot that. I blame the wonky formating. For Primarchs chosen, once you pick the Primarch in LoW to get the RoW, select him again in HQ and delete the LoW selection for readability purposes. You might have errors crop up but a reload should fix most issues. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/327088-iiird-fulgrim-terminators-and-jetbikes-25k/#findComment-4541602 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rangaman Posted October 23, 2016 Author Share Posted October 23, 2016 Ah yeah, just noticed that he was available in the HQ section after picking the RoW, thanks Slips! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/327088-iiird-fulgrim-terminators-and-jetbikes-25k/#findComment-4541610 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terminus Posted October 23, 2016 Share Posted October 23, 2016 I like the list. A little low on numbers with only 17 dudes, Fulgrim and 2 Dreadnoughts, but at least they are all terminators! The Cortus, Leviathan, and Kharybdis arriving first turn should make for quite a mess of things! You can position the Kharybdis in such a way that serious threats have to draw LOS through the dreadnought pods to shoot at it, so it will have a 2+ jink save. It's extremely unlikely they manage to destroy it before you deliver Fulgrim anywhere he wants to go. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/327088-iiird-fulgrim-terminators-and-jetbikes-25k/#findComment-4542066 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rangaman Posted October 24, 2016 Author Share Posted October 24, 2016 I'm pretty happy with the list too, now to start planning the build! Thanks for everyone's input, I really appreciate it. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/327088-iiird-fulgrim-terminators-and-jetbikes-25k/#findComment-4542244 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terminus Posted October 24, 2016 Share Posted October 24, 2016 One thing I noticed is you don't have sonic shriekers on your Phoenix Guard. I would consider shaving points somewhere to add them. Hitting other WS5 models with your Phoenix Guard on a 3+ will help quite a bit (will also prevent Custodians from getting an extra point of initiative), and any WS4 model trying to hit Fulgrim that is also in base to base with a sonic shrieker model will require a 5+ to hit him. Not sure where you would get the 15 points, though. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/327088-iiird-fulgrim-terminators-and-jetbikes-25k/#findComment-4543336 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slips Posted October 24, 2016 Share Posted October 24, 2016 The Easiest would be to downgrade the Thunder Hammer on the Primus for 10 and forgo the Chainfist on one Terminator Squad. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/327088-iiird-fulgrim-terminators-and-jetbikes-25k/#findComment-4543343 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terminus Posted October 24, 2016 Share Posted October 24, 2016 But the hammer is pretty clutch. :( He only needs 10 points though, since the current list is at 2495 if I'm reading it right. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/327088-iiird-fulgrim-terminators-and-jetbikes-25k/#findComment-4543360 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slips Posted October 24, 2016 Share Posted October 24, 2016 Yeah, its a tough one...Either downgrading the chainfists on the termies or downgrade 1 power fist per squad to a Power Axe (or something). Are Contemptor Melta Guns 10 or 15? If so the Grav Guns could be downgraded too. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/327088-iiird-fulgrim-terminators-and-jetbikes-25k/#findComment-4543392 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rangaman Posted October 24, 2016 Author Share Posted October 24, 2016 The list was 15 over so I cut the Shriekers, maybe if I lose one Phoenix Terminator that will cover the Shriekers and a couple of Chainfists between the Cata Termi squads...melta and grav cost the same on the Cortus too. Or, would having one Sonic Shrieker on the Primus Medicae work just as well? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/327088-iiird-fulgrim-terminators-and-jetbikes-25k/#findComment-4543424 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slips Posted October 24, 2016 Share Posted October 24, 2016 Shriekers only work with models in B2B iirc. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/327088-iiird-fulgrim-terminators-and-jetbikes-25k/#findComment-4543426 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rangaman Posted October 24, 2016 Author Share Posted October 24, 2016 Don't want to risk the Primus then, so I'm 10 points over with Shriekers. If I drop a Phoenix that will leave me with 30 points to go elsewhere. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/327088-iiird-fulgrim-terminators-and-jetbikes-25k/#findComment-4543439 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terminus Posted October 25, 2016 Share Posted October 25, 2016 Only problem is that unit becomes pretty small. If you're only taking 5 dudes, you're probably better off with a command squad rather than those sweet Phoenix Guard. One other thing to consider... instead of the Primus Medicae, you can bring 3 additional Phoenix Guard (so 9 + Fulgrim for a full Kharybdis), and have enough points left over for a few more chain fists or whatnot. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/327088-iiird-fulgrim-terminators-and-jetbikes-25k/#findComment-4543555 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rangaman Posted October 25, 2016 Author Share Posted October 25, 2016 Yea that's a fair point, I will probably be better served with more attacks on the charge rather than trying to make them harder to kill by having FNP. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/327088-iiird-fulgrim-terminators-and-jetbikes-25k/#findComment-4543571 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terminus Posted October 25, 2016 Share Posted October 25, 2016 Well this way you can buy 10 Phoenix Guard, build 9, and use the last one to make a kick-ass Primus Medicae, so you can experiment with both options and in larger games go with both! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/327088-iiird-fulgrim-terminators-and-jetbikes-25k/#findComment-4543601 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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