What if the WS got involved at Prospero?

[RandomMarine]

Let's not forget the it wasn't just Horus who wanted magnus dead. It was heavily suggested that valdor was in favor of the ultimate sanction in regards the ts. The scars weren't aware of edict as their delegation to nikea was stuck on chogiris*

 

I think the scars would have acted as peacekeepers and magnus would have been brought to Terra in chains and sat on the throne so big E could take the fight to Horus, big present at istavaan heresy is put down before it really starts. A significant portion of the WB return to worship of the lecto divinicus similar to narik when exposed to the big E's unleashed power

[b1soul]

The SW did not intentionally blow up the ship with the purpose of killing the DA on board

 

The DA were collateral damage

 

Lokken had to kill Jubal man on man

[Jackalwolf]

I can definitely see Jagathai managing to strike a precarious hold the fire until they get back to Terra / new orders come through directly from the Emperor. If he's shown something in the books is wisdom and the ability to do the right call despite what personal glory might he leave behind for doing so, as in Path of Heaven.

[Baluc]

 

 

Please dont tease like that.

PM me the details if you arent comfortable posting it using spoiler tags

 

Basically when the Fenrisian fleet arrives at the Dulan home world the Lion is already there.

 

The VIth proceed to "assist" the Dark Angels in the battle by engaging the enemy. Only they blow up an enemy vessel that had 10 squads of Angels on board after ignoring hails from the Dark Angel fleet (which is pretty arrogant). Dark Angels vessels start firing on the ship that killed their brothers.

 

Almost ends up in a Legion vs Legion fight until Russ orders his men to stand down, threatening to break them if they disobey.

 

Russ isn't too stubborn to pick a fight he can't win.

 

 

Sorry it's not as juicy as you're probably hoping for, I should have snipped the quote but my phone is terrible for that.

 

Um, what?

 

 

So not only does that book have the Wolves act like complete morons, it further undermines the whole 'Astartes fighting Astartes is anathema' theme of the GC era?

 

 

Why is BL apparently unable to give the Wolves a positive portrayal?

 

 

I'm sure its not malice. I think they just don't know what to do with them. They should be somewhere between Scars and SoH in terms of how they fight, familiarity with other legions and general philosophy. Russ was supposed as the older brother, who rubbed you the wrong way 9/10 but you knew would always had your back. The Wolves based on the core of their IRL inspirations, expert navigators, and hunters. Unsentimental, pragmatic and utterly without fear of taboo. They would massacre a city to get to a food distribution hub, because a hunter knows to fight on equal terms is to invite the possibility of crippling injury or random chance of failure.

 

Where the SoH go for the throat and clean up the body afterwards or the Scars pull and prod, over extend you and slice through your weakened with sheer brutality. The Wolves sniff out your weaknesses, and drop down on them in the black of night with overwhelming ferocity. Your refineries, ammo dumps, and crossroads destroyed or taken without warning or ceremony in the loudest and unsubtle manner. Until finally you are cornered with your armour torn and falling to ruin, weapons dulled from use, arms and mind tired from long nights of battle, in a fortress you've been driven to with no aid coming. And, just when you think the final blow will land, you are left alone for a day or a week, and then the screams start. The Wolves taking of a world should be nuanced and but loud, subtle but bloody in the most obvious manner possible to hide the subtleties of being handled and directed to the desired place and location of your death. 

 

Anyway I plan on starting up my plog in the next few days with some fluff to go with it, hopefully people enjoy my take on the canon wolves. 

[b1soul]

I think a WS are a nice bridge between TSons and SW

 

They have a "barbaric" warrior culture like the SW

 

They have the pretensions to refinement and sophistication of the TSons

[calgar101]

Russ attempted to speak to Magnus via Kasper so he is open to talks. With another Primarch there he would listen more I would say and having to fight an additional Legion would way him more to peace.

I can see Magnus and his Legion being taken back to Terra as prisoners with the White Scars being thier guarantors and a small token force of Wolves and possibly Custodes on Prospero to ensure everything seems good there.

Hours treachery is uncovered quicker, the heresy could be ended quicker with more traitor Primarchs and their legions becoming prisoners. Or it turns in to a much more protracted affair.

[Mazryonh]

removed

[Mazryonh]

removed

[Dantay VI]

Russ goes after Magnus.

White Scars And T-Sons fight back

Wolves face annhilation until the flesh change starts occurring in the T-Son ranks.

 

The Scars disengage and interpose themselves between the warring legions losing many in the process.

 

Discovering Magnus deal with Tzeentch yhe Khan brings Magnus to Terra.

 

Wolves are left licking their wounds until the Alphas arrive and we are back to the start of Wolf King.

[Biscuittzz]

Please dont tease like that.

PM me the details if you arent comfortable posting it using spoiler tags

Basically when the Fenrisian fleet arrives at the Dulan home world the Lion is already there.

The VIth proceed to "assist" the Dark Angels in the battle by engaging the enemy. Only they blow up an enemy vessel that had 10 squads of Angels on board after ignoring hails from the Dark Angel fleet (which is pretty arrogant). Dark Angels vessels start firing on the ship that killed their brothers.

Almost ends up in a Legion vs Legion fight until Russ orders his men to stand down, threatening to break them if they disobey.

Russ isn't too stubborn to pick a fight he can't win.

Sorry it's not as juicy as you're probably hoping for, I should have snipped the quote but my phone is terrible for that.

Um, what?

So not only does that book have the Wolves act like complete morons, it further undermines the whole 'Astartes fighting Astartes is anathema' theme of the GC era?

Why is BL apparently unable to give the Wolves a positive portrayal?

I'm sure its not malice. I think they just don't know what to do with them. They should be somewhere between Scars and SoH in terms of how they fight, familiarity with other legions and general philosophy. Russ was supposed as the older brother, who rubbed you the wrong way 9/10 but you knew would always had your back. The Wolves based on the core of their IRL inspirations, expert navigators, and hunters. Unsentimental, pragmatic and utterly without fear of taboo. They would massacre a city to get to a food distribution hub, because a hunter knows to fight on equal terms is to invite the possibility of crippling injury or random chance of failure.

Where the SoH go for the throat and clean up the body afterwards or the Scars pull and prod, over extend you and slice through your weakened with sheer brutality. The Wolves sniff out your weaknesses, and drop down on them in the black of night with overwhelming ferocity. Your refineries, ammo dumps, and crossroads destroyed or taken without warning or ceremony in the loudest and unsubtle manner. Until finally you are cornered with your armour torn and falling to ruin, weapons dulled from use, arms and mind tired from long nights of battle, in a fortress you've been driven to with no aid coming. And, just when you think the final blow will land, you are left alone for a day or a week, and then the screams start. The Wolves taking of a world should be nuanced and but loud, subtle but bloody in the most obvious manner possible to hide the subtleties of being handled and directed to the desired place and location of your death.

Anyway I plan on starting up my plog in the next few days with some fluff to go with it, hopefully people enjoy my take on the canon wolves.

This. Any chance we can erase the majority of wolves fluff and have you rewrite it?

[Marshal Rohr]

 

 

 

Please dont tease like that.

PM me the details if you arent comfortable posting it using spoiler tags

 

Basically when the Fenrisian fleet arrives at the Dulan home world the Lion is already there.

 

The VIth proceed to "assist" the Dark Angels in the battle by engaging the enemy. Only they blow up an enemy vessel that had 10 squads of Angels on board after ignoring hails from the Dark Angel fleet (which is pretty arrogant). Dark Angels vessels start firing on the ship that killed their brothers.

 

Almost ends up in a Legion vs Legion fight until Russ orders his men to stand down, threatening to break them if they disobey.

 

Russ isn't too stubborn to pick a fight he can't win.

 

 

Sorry it's not as juicy as you're probably hoping for, I should have snipped the quote but my phone is terrible for that.

 

Um, what?

 

 

So not only does that book have the Wolves act like complete morons, it further undermines the whole 'Astartes fighting Astartes is anathema' theme of the GC era?

 

 

Why is BL apparently unable to give the Wolves a positive portrayal?

 

 

I'm sure its not malice. I think they just don't know what to do with them. They should be somewhere between Scars and SoH in terms of how they fight, familiarity with other legions and general philosophy. Russ was supposed as the older brother, who rubbed you the wrong way 9/10 but you knew would always had your back. The Wolves based on the core of their IRL inspirations, expert navigators, and hunters. Unsentimental, pragmatic and utterly without fear of taboo. They would massacre a city to get to a food distribution hub, because a hunter knows to fight on equal terms is to invite the possibility of crippling injury or random chance of failure.

 

Where the SoH go for the throat and clean up the body afterwards or the Scars pull and prod, over extend you and slice through your weakened with sheer brutality. The Wolves sniff out your weaknesses, and drop down on them in the black of night with overwhelming ferocity. Your refineries, ammo dumps, and crossroads destroyed or taken without warning or ceremony in the loudest and unsubtle manner. Until finally you are cornered with your armour torn and falling to ruin, weapons dulled from use, arms and mind tired from long nights of battle, in a fortress you've been driven to with no aid coming. And, just when you think the final blow will land, you are left alone for a day or a week, and then the screams start. The Wolves taking of a world should be nuanced and but loud, subtle but bloody in the most obvious manner possible to hide the subtleties of being handled and directed to the desired place and location of your death. 

 

Anyway I plan on starting up my plog in the next few days with some fluff to go with it, hopefully people enjoy my take on the canon wolves. 

 

 

So..... they should be Night Lords?

[Terminus]

Eh, that's closer to Alpha Legion tactics than Night Lords, who would just take out sector by sector while leaving gruesome crucified remains everywhere, and even then it's not quite like how any other Legion operates.

 

Alphas would have insurrections, mass hysteria, virus outbreaks, and technical problems all manifest at the worst possible time across your whole defense network, and as you rush to that last bastion of defense where you keep those most precious to you, your daughter or wife or whatever stabs you in the heart because their personality was overwritten by a soul assassin. The Legionnaires themselves are hardly seen at all, due to surprising disappearances of any potential witnesses.

[Marshal Rohr]

The old AT fluff (which is more than likely going to be exactly where most of the Wolf startegy/doctrine comes from) was all heavily towards all out orbital assault. Chances are, that when we get Inferno, we are going to see the Wolves be more like the Sons of Horus in their rites of war. Each loyalist and traitor legion so far kind of has an opposite version of themselves when doing Rites. Just my best guess, though. 

[Terminus]

I am curious to see their rules, probably some kind of synergistic bonus when ganging up with multiple squads on one enemy ala Ultramarines' Interlocking Tactics and Sons of Horus CQB prowess.  The current stripped down "Lemon" Russ leaves a lot to be desired in special rules and gear (the part we haven't seen yet), but the statline is second to none.

[depthcharge12]

Maybe that would be when the divide in the WS legion would have appeared...

[Baluc]

Eh, that's closer to Alpha Legion tactics than Night Lords, who would just take out sector by sector while leaving gruesome crucified remains everywhere, and even then it's not quite like how any other Legion operates.

 

Alphas would have insurrections, mass hysteria, virus outbreaks, and technical problems all manifest at the worst possible time across your whole defense network, and as you rush to that last bastion of defense where you keep those most precious to you, your daughter or wife or whatever stabs you in the heart because their personality was overwritten by a soul assassin. The Legionnaires themselves are hardly seen at all, due to surprising disappearances of any potential witnesses.

 

Well I try to view all the legions as competent military organizations... besides WE. They just have preferences as to how they choose to prosecute normal strategic objectives, and how far along the spectrum they choose to go. Fear as a weapon isn't a NL only attribute, they just go so far that creating fear and the methodology of their tactics becomes a compulsion rather than a by product of strategy. Surprise night attacks, proceeded by howling might cause fear, but its only a side effect of how the Wolves are going to attack playing to their own strengths. They aren't hiding or avoiding open conflict. They are coming, you know it, you know what happened last time and you know what is going to happen this time. The Ultramarines, will attack the same locations, and leave the hardware largely intact, the wolves may or may not leave it a smoking husk depending entirely upon how the battle goes. 

 

I think is mostly an oversight of the narrative, we don't have a novel that's just a story about the war of compliance of 13-24 or some such random act of compliance. 

[Wolf Lord Loki]

Just a thought but had anyone thought that maybe Jagahtai wouldnt have sided with magnus?

 

Something like:

 

"magnus this time you go too far. I have supported you in the formation of the librus but destroying fathers project. Your arrogance must be punished. You will come with me to face father for your crimes"

"he is going nowhere with you!" roars a voice possibly belonging to t'kar followed by a hail of bolt fire. Suddenly the air was full of spells and psychic powers ingniting

 

"is this how you lead you sons magnus? Straight into damnation?" snarled the Great Khan. "perhaps father was right to sanction you. Be this on your own head!"

[Daemon2027]

Khan brings them all sides to the diplomacy table. They hash it out, realise there been played, Russ gets angry and takes his legion after Horus, Khan brings Magnus back to Terra where the Emperor does whatever it is he wants to do with him. Horisnis defeated, the Thousand Sons are quietly got rid of due to their instability. Khan fed up with the Imperium takes his legion off to explore the 'great planes of nothingness' between galaxies.

[The_son_of_Dorn]

Never understood why the Emperor didn't just become soulbound to magnus and other librarians of all the legions. Would of made their lives a lot easier.

[foamy248]

Khan brings them all sides to the diplomacy table. They hash it out, realise there been played, Russ gets angry and takes his legion after Horus, Khan brings Magnus back to Terra where the Emperor does whatever it is he wants to do with him. Horisnis defeated, the Thousand Sons are quietly got rid of due to their instability. Khan fed up with the Imperium takes his legion off to explore the 'great planes of nothingness' between galaxies.

So Russ and his legion single-handedlypawedlby defeat the Traitors? Or do you mean that because the Emperor finds out sooner that Horus has gone traitor, he has more time to react. This would mean that the Siege of Terra wouldn't happen, I guess. Does make sense though. 

[Daemon2027]

 

 

Khan brings them all sides to the diplomacy table. They hash it out, realise there been played, Russ gets angry and takes his legion after Horus, Khan brings Magnus back to Terra where the Emperor does whatever it is he wants to do with him. Horisnis defeated, the Thousand Sons are quietly got rid of due to their instability. Khan fed up with the Imperium takes his legion off to explore the 'great planes of nothingness' between galaxies.

So Russ and his legion single-handedlypawedlby defeat the Traitors? Or do you mean that because the Emperor finds out sooner that Horus has gone traitor, he has more time to react. This would mean that the Siege of Terra wouldn't happen, I guess. Does make sense though.

I'd imagine the SW will slow down Horus at the least, Magnus would be sat on the Golden Throne freeing the Emperor from the webway war to direct the war against Horous, bringing the Ultramarines, Blood Angles, and Dark Angels, plus the remaining Iron Hands and Sallies to the Sol system, probably sending the White Scars and Raven Guard to help the Wolves. Once Mars is brought back into compliance I the Emperor would then lead the redt of the Legions against Hours.

[The_son_of_Dorn]

If Ferrus was still alive I'd of liked to assume that he would of taken his legion to reclaim mars becoming the new "king" of the red planet. With this corner of the solar system re-secured a blockade could of been put in placet to provide more of an effective defensive line against the traitors. Maybe if this had been the Case the Emperor could of had more of a crucial role in the coming battle.  

 

Who knows. 

[lokkorex]

A loyalist secured and controlled mars would spell all kinds of dodo for traitors, i have no doubts about that.

 

I'm trying to figure out what the khagan would have done if he arrived during the battle for prospero, with both the thousand sons and the rout deployed and engaged in combat.

 

Would he jump right into it to aid the sons or would he still try to call a ceasefire, assuming he still got a lot of contradicting messages from both dorn and horus, not knowing what to believe?

[b1soul]

A loyalist secured and controlled mars would spell all kinds of dodo for traitors, i have no doubts about that.

I'm trying to figure out what the khagan would have done if he arrived during the battle for prospero, with both the thousand sons and the rout deployed and engaged in combat.

Would he jump right into it to aid the sons or would he still try to call a ceasefire, assuming he still got a lot of contradicting messages from both dorn and horus, not knowing what to believe?

I suspect the Khan would throw in his lot with Magnus...given how much distaste he has for the SW

 

 

Imagine a tulwar exploding from Russ' chest as he hefts up Magnus

 

[Runefyre]

 

A loyalist secured and controlled mars would spell all kinds of dodo for traitors, i have no doubts about that.

I'm trying to figure out what the khagan would have done if he arrived during the battle for prospero, with both the thousand sons and the rout deployed and engaged in combat.

Would he jump right into it to aid the sons or would he still try to call a ceasefire, assuming he still got a lot of contradicting messages from both dorn and horus, not knowing what to believe?

I suspect the Khan would throw in his lot with Magnus...given how much distaste he has for the SW

 

 

Imagine a tulwar exploding from Russ' chest as he hefts up Magnus

 

I hate that so much. It pisses me off to no end that they completely murdered Russ and Khan's relationship. I used to like WS until Wraight ruined them and my Wolves.