Militarum Tempestus - how to...?

[MoGuy]

I've fulfilled my promise. You may now magnetise your Tauroxes (Tauroxi?) with a guide for the lazy conscript.

[MoGuy]

So, this weekend I got to play against my friends Orks and give the Militarum Tempestus a run.

 

We played three 1500 points games.

 

My list:

 

 

 

 

Hellrain Brigade #1

 

Commissar

 

Command Squad w/ 4x Plasma

 

5x Scions w/ 2x Melter

 

Taurox Prime w/ Gatling Gun, HSVG, Storm Bolter, Stubber, Camo Netting

 

Hellrain Brigade #2

 

Commissar

 

Command Squad w/ 4x Plasma

 

5x Scions w/ 2x Flamer

 

Taurox Prime w/ Rocket Launcher, Autocannons, Camo netting

 

CAD

 

Command Squad 4x HSVG

 

10x Scions w/ 2x Flamer

 

5x Scions w/ 2x Melter

 

Valkyrie w/ Multiple Rocketpods, Multilaser

 

Bunker w/ Escape Hatch, Voxrelais, Void Shield

 

Inquisitorial Detachment

 

Inquisitor w/ 3+ Armour, Incinerator, 3x Servo-Skulls

 

Psyker + 2x Acolytes

 

 

 

The Ork list

 

 

 

3x Wyrdboys Lvl 2

 

15x Warbiker

 

Battlewagon

 

10x Commandos w/ 2x Scortchas

 

10x Burna Boys

 

12x Ork Boys

 

2x10 Gretchen

 

5x Bubblechookas w/ re-roll Grot

 

5x Stormboys w/ Combi-Scortcha

 

1x Trukk

 

1x Killa Can

 

 

 

It was a lot of fun!

 

The HSVG Command Squad always deployed in their bunker and mowed down approaching Orks. In game 1 he ignored my bunker for the most part and in the other two games he assaulted it on Turn 2, bringing it down and thus leaving my Command Squad in the open. Still, the bunker worked nicely and the Voxrelais are great for my deepstrike heavy list.

 

Both Tauroxes were filled with a Plasma Command Squad. I loaded the Gatling Gun Taurox up with all those weapons just for the lulz and it was a true pleasure to throw all those dice. He usually gunned down quite a lot of Bikers or Commandos etc. before being charged and destroyed. Same goes for the other Taurox who took on the vehicles and in game 3 brought down the Battlewagon with a single shot into its side armour, exploding it and killing a good chunk of the Boys inside.

 

The Plasma Command Squads themselves were always a nice addition. Occasionally one of them burned to a crip but with the whole enemy army up in their face they usually were in RFR and either stripped HP off of vehicles or gunned down some bikers etc.

 

The Hellrain Brigade is a really good formation but I have to say that I would probably have been tabled in the last game if those Flamers/Melters didn't keep on coming down. So yeah, I feel you on the whole "take a Knight" argument. 

 

The ten man flamer squad rode in the Valkyrie and dropped down with the Inquisitor to roast the big blob of Ork Boys or anything else. That big squad is just brutal. Giving them the twin-linked order is awesome as it allows you to re-roll the wounds of the flamers. This is something I can see making even Space Marines pee their pants. In the third game I took away a few upgrades to give the Inquisitor 2+ armour and the Psicannon. He always died except for that last game where he tanked a ton of wounds! So yeah, the squad perfomed great but was often annihilated the turn after (a reoccurring theme for pretty much every deepstriking squad).

 

The Melter Squads were nice and together with the Servo Skulls they landed where they needed to be. I already marked one guy with a red dot on his head because he took on the Killa Can and 6 Grots in close combat for two whole turns (he shot off the claw from the Killa Can so it had no AP) before finally dying in glorious melee. A true hero of the Empire of mankind!

 

All in all it was a lot of fun to play such a straight forward army without a ton of special rules or stupidly powerful formations. The Scions really have the potential for effective beta-strikes when they all come down on Turn 2 and the orders are a huge boon. I think with enough Hell Rain Brigades and Tauroxes the Scions can even make an effective 1500 points list. They most certainly have all the tools to deal with any unit in the game and I think that they will perform even better against a non-melee army. 

[MoGuy]

Do you guys have some comments on the overall gameplay? Is there another way of playing the Scions instead of deepstrike suiciding them somewhere? I obviously will need more Tauroxes but I think maybe two 10 men squads in two Tauroxes could also work. They just scoot up the board Turn 1 and exit their transports into some cover where they can gun something down with their Hotshot Lasguns. With their 4+ armour the Scions are actually quite durable. The 10 men flamer squad I mentioned in the post above got hit by five Burna Boys, resulting in over 40 hits. Yes, the squad was wiped out (save for the Inquisitor who tanked the last 8 wounds like a champ) but the first Scion tanked 7 wounds before going down! 

 

The Valkyrie is also a valuable asset and gives nice fire support.

[WarriorFish]

We'd need a more detailed batrep in order to give any decent commentary on the battle. For the Hellrain squads deep strike suicide missions is how they're best run though, you want them to die quickly so you can recycle for free points and even better new slagging opportunities as you drop in next to another valuable unit :P

[duz_]

Unfortunately I find scions to be the perfect suicide unit... which makes the hellrain formation perfect

Fluff wise its a shame though, but hey tactical marines suffer a similar fate these days

[Shamansky]

Unfortunately I find scions to be the perfect suicide unit... which makes the hellrain formation perfect

Fluff wise its a shame though, but hey tactical marines suffer a similar fate these days

Tactical marines are used as beacons for electrodisplacement these days

[MoGuy]

We'd need a more detailed batrep in order to give any decent commentary on the battle

I told you everything you need to know. There wasn't much finesse or maneuvering on my part since I had Orks in my deployment zone from Turn 2 onwards. So my gameplay was literally:

Turn 1: Get/Deploy into cover, shoot advancing Orks.

Turn 2: Lose my bunker and other stuff. Drop in Scions and Valkyrie. Shoot/Flame the Orks that are in the open from their charges on Turn 2. Repeat till Turn 6/7.

As duz_ said, it is a shame that the Scions are such good suicide units with their Hellrain Formation. While that emphasizes their scalpel like precision as described in the fluff, it doesn't really reflect their elite "we fight till the last man" modus operandi. It doesn't feel like I am playing Stormtroopers that get into the thick of it and hold the line. It rather feels like I am dropping "expendable" bodies onto the enemy until he crumbles.

So apart from the Hellrain, what other playstiles does the Militarum Tempestus have to offer? Mech army with Tauroxes all over the place is another thing I could imagine would work alright.

Edit: Also yes, after playing Dark Eldar for some time, the Scions have the same glasscannon feel to them. And that AV11 on the front of the Taurox is really a big difference. For you guys they may still seem like cardboard boxes but for me not having to pee my pants every time a bolter is looking at that vehicle is a huge boost! And camo netting actually makes them very survivable when they are in ruins.

[Beams]

Taurox especially behind cover/aegis with camouflage netting and behind them an Inquisitor or two and some cheap inquisition psykers to cast shrouding?

That comes out to a bunker with a high save to keep your commissary in, so that you can keep suiciding your hell rain squad.

[MoGuy]

Quick question(s):

 

1. Does the Taurox also have two fire points at the front? The entry reads "Two fire points at each side of the hull". As I know GW this probably means only left and right, but I could also argue that the Taurox is a rectangle which has four sides. I obviously won't say in a game "haha, my guys inside can even fire out of the rear of the Taurox!" since there isn't actually a physical fire point on the model. But can the guys fire out of the front?

 

If not, then this brings me to question two:

 

2. Are Plasma Command squads in a Taurox even worth it? If you give them 4x Plasma then two of those guns will never get to fire, since they can't all shoot out of a fire point. The alternative would be to drop the Plasma dudes in some cover but they'll just get mulched there and that's too many points down the drain for my taste. 

[WarriorFish]

By GW's rules vehicles have a front, a back and two sides - so that's left and right only for "sides". If I remember right a fire point is for one model unless specified otherwise, but I don't have the rules to hand to double check.

[slowclinic]

The firing points are just on the side of the vehicle, and the viewing points in the front are assumed to be simply for whoever is driving the vehicle to see out of. I'd much rather they had a hatch like the Chimera for a 360º shooting arc, but then the Taurox's load out placement is at risk. I suppose pivoting to face a target opens you up to returning enemy fire on a AV10 side... 

 

Strategic placement for get within the 45º shooting arc without leaving the sides too vulnerable?

[duz_]

Yes its just the two little slits on the sides not the front.

Annoyingly the taroux as a mobile pill box isn't great.

For plasma CCS I usually castle them up in ruins or deep strike them in for that exact reason. You want to make the most of your 4/8 TL/PE shots! ;)

Lately I've been keeping them in my back line to defend my tanks. They do a fairly good job at that. Almost like a mini mobile devastator sqaud.

[MoGuy]

 

 

For plasma CCS I usually castle them up in ruins or deep strike them in for that exact reason. You want to make the most of your 4/8 TL/PE shots! 

 

Yes, but 4+ cover won't safe them... You deepstrike the Plasma Command Squad into cover on Turn 2 and gun down some  dudes with 8 Plasma shots. But on your opponent's Turn 2 he'll just shoot them dead. Getting 6 wounds through T3 models with only a 4+ cover to safe them (or their armour if they just shoot them with bolters) is pretty easy. Which means that you spend 145 points for a single round of shooting - which is way too expensive in my eyes for a suicide unit. 

 

So, what to do? How do you keep your Plasma Command Squad alive long enough for them to make their points back? Letting them sit in our backline is an option of course. 

[duz_]

Yes, but 4+ cover won't safe them... You deepstrike the Plasma Command Squad into cover on Turn 2 and gun down some dudes with 8 Plasma shots. But on your opponent's Turn 2 he'll just shoot them dead. Getting 6 wounds through T3 models with only a 4+ cover to safe them (or their armour if they just shoot them with bolters) is pretty easy. Which means that you spend 145 points for a single round of shooting - which is way too expensive in my eyes for a suicide unit.

 

So, what to do? How do you keep your Plasma Command Squad alive long enough for them to make their points back? Letting them sit in our backline is an option of course.

Well if you look at it that way then there's really no way to play them as a full 4 man plasma squad and gain the most out of them.

 

To get the PE/TL order means you have to play them as MTs which means no chimeras for 360 fire points. Youre just as likely to be shot out of a taroux as you are cover.

 

I think you under estimate 4+ armour and cover. Or youre in a really tough meta.

 

The way I interpret what your saying is for the points you'd rather just run them in a Bunker, but then you can't issue orders.

 

145 isn't too bad to pay for 4 PE/TL plasma guns with BS4, 4+, DS & MTC

[MoGuy]

 

 

Youre just as likely to be shot out of a taroux as you are cover. 

 

Since the Taurox can get Camo Netting it is harder to take him down than it is to kill those Plasma guys. 

 

 

 

I think you under estimate 4+ armour and cover. Or youre in a really tough meta.

 

Since my main army is Adeptus Mechanicus which has T3 4+ armour 6+ FNP guys all around I can testify that it is pretty easy to gun them down. Math dictates that it'll just take 12 wounds to kill the Command Squad. But maybe I'll just have to try it. Here's to hoping that the Scions will get some love in the Imperial Agents supplement. Maybe they'll get their Infiltrate back or give us the option to make the Taurox a command vehicle. 

[Shamansky]

I find cover saves unreliable nowadays. Cover can be nullified by too many means. So i still prefer Chimera to Taurox. 2 fire points on Chimera are located much more comfortable. 12 front armour is better. In my opinion tracked 'hamvee' is ugly. And you can get 'good' version of Taurox only by taking 'samovar look-alike' scions (i have old good metal kasrkin models but those i aquired got only flamers and no new guns). Why not use air transports?

[Otto von Bludd]

One way to help keep your command squad alive is to add a TDA Inquisitor to them.  He can deepstrike with them, add some nice st7 rending shooting with his psycannon, tank small arms for them, unlock servo skulls, potentially cast prescience on the command squad so they can issue their order to another squad and helps in melee (your Tempestor Prime is I4, so a power sword isn't a total waste on him since he can at least chop down marines at the same time as they get him).  This can combo nicely with empyrean brain mines, psyk out grenades and the daemon hammer from the inquisitor.  They won't beat a dedicated melee unit but they will at least be able to hold their own.  Add a medic to this squad to give your inquisitor a nice FNP for added resilience. 

[ashc]

Apologies if anyone feels like i'm committing heresy resurrecting this thread but I received a start collecting Tempestus box for Christmas and have been pondering what to do with it. I'm wanting to field lots of stuff from Imperial Agents with the leaning towards the Inquisition and I was wondering whether fielding Tempestus CAD was worth it or if the best way to field them as inquisitorial stormtroopers is as the Hellrain formation and I should look for CAD Ob-sec elsewhere?

 

thank you!

[WarriorFish]

If you want Imperial Stormtroopers then the Scions are the only way. Acolytes can make a poor man's Stormie for a reasonable price so it may depend on how you want to run them - is BS4 and their extra rules worth it for you?

[ashc]

If you want Imperial Stormtroopers then the Scions are the only way. Acolytes can make a poor man's Stormie for a reasonable price so it may depend on how you want to run them - is BS4 and their extra rules worth it for you?

 

Definitely worth it compared to the poor-man's stormtrooper option.

[WarriorFish]

Then C:MT is it ;) I'd start out with the Hellrain, maybe a second and go from there? You might like them enough to stick with them, or move on to a CAD when you've fleshed your collection out :)

[duz_]

^ WHS ;)

[robofish7591]

I would just build a hellrain and then get a second box of stormies or another start collecting.  Everything in the hellrain (well, except the commissar... hopefully the commissariat didn't hear that!) is stuff you would want to take in a normal Scion CAD anyway.  Command squads are going to be your HQ choice, since commissars can't issue orders and the command squad only gets one, Scion squads will be your troops, and tauroxes are your only vehicles and they are pretty fun ones at that, they are fragile though so don't treat them like actual tanks.

[ashc]

Thanks all, I think I am going to look at using the Castellans of the Imperium list to bring my ideas of inquisitorial stormtroopers to life :)