Anti air for Armored Breakthrough Lists

[Lord Blackwood]

So I am looking at a decision as to what sort or anti aircraft tech I want to run with my armored breakthrough list.

 

I own a Deredeo

But at the same time I am strongly considering picking up a fire raptor I feel like the fire raptor works both as anti air and forces my opponents to consider anti air tech when playing against me which normally they do not have to concern themselves with.

 

What sort of experience do you have using the fire raptor? do you think given the freed up heavy support slots in the AB list it would be more survivable than the single deredeo while doing a similar job ?

 

Quite curious to hear what everyone thinks.

[LtDan]

I've only played against fireraptors but every time i do my dreadeo just shoots them out the sky.... Lucky rolling? Maybe. They are cool tho

[Slips]

If you want pure Anti-Air, then a Xiphon is a pretty good unit with a Re-roll successful jink S8 Ap2 Heavy 2 Missile Launcher and Lascannons.

 

Most other flyers have low/paper armour so these should be more than enough to push some damage through whereas your S7 Fireraptor guns, despite RoF, requires 5's to glance Av12 and can't get any bonuses to the Pen Result due to Ap (unless you use the One-Use Missiles).

[Charlo]

Yeah, for pure AA duties a Xiphon is money, if it then survives it can start to clean up Rhinos, Dreads, Preds, Artillery etc

 

Raptor is also solid, it's new(ish) missiles now being very strong. Between Autocannons and that Gattling Bolter you can really blast people of all different kinds due to the awesome independent targeting rule. Only issue is that the rules are a bit weird and it almost seems like both Autocannons are a single weapon.....

[Jolemai]

Regarding Flyer anti-air, doesn't the depend on whether or not you are using Death from the Skies, or does the FW update for this only apply to 40k and not their AoD expansion?

[Slips]

We have literally no datasheets/conversions for any of our Flyers so DFTS is not used (and I doubt anyone would want to anyways).

[Jolemai]

Cool. Just wanted to confirm that this wasn't eligible for 30k games (because if it was, it would seriously affect the answers above)

[Slips]

Cool. Just wanted to confirm that this wasn't eligible for 30k games (because if it was, it would seriously affect the answers above)

In the case of using FW flyers in 40k: You're SOL.

In 30k, since we aren't affected by anything to do with Imperial Armour, no DFTS.

Thats mainly why.

[Gorgoff]

I'd go by The Rule of Cool.

They both can shoot down fliers each whith slightly different roles on the battlefield apart from that job though.

My favorite is the Raptor for sure but the Bot is cool as well.

[shandwen]

You know, the mastadon has some aa ability. Haha haha, not that anyone would take one for aa duties.

[Reyner]

How about a couple of Whirlwinds with AA missiles?

[xera32]

My armoured breakthrough list does fine with no dedicated AA. With enough autocannons/accelerators you can just shoot them down with rate of fire. For truly annoying fliers I will just use my lightnings to shoot them down, most people that bring more than 1 flier are unlikely to have a SHV or spartan bus for them to shoot anyway.

For a while I was running a fire raptor alongside 1 or 2 of the lightnings, but I found it was redundant firepower most of the time as I already had enough S7 shots, and the maingun gets punk'd by artificer armour characters in units.

[defl0]

Yeah. I was going to say the same thing. You have so much dakka anti air shouldn't be a problem.

 

That said something like deredeo fits nicely in that build

[The Ironic Warrior]

For AA in an Armoured Breakthrough list you can use the almighty Sicarian Battle Tank, Mortis/Deredeo Dreadnoughts, or as other people have suggested - other fliers. The Sicarian is really good though; it's mobile (12" movement and it can still fire it's main gun at full BS), it's weapon is effective and it can engage a wide variety of targets.

[Withershadow]

So I am looking at a decision as to what sort or anti aircraft tech I want to run with my armored breakthrough list.

 

I own a Deredeo

But at the same time I am strongly considering picking up a fire raptor I feel like the fire raptor works both as anti air and forces my opponents to consider anti air tech when playing against me which normally they do not have to concern themselves with.

 

What sort of experience do you have using the fire raptor? do you think given the freed up heavy support slots in the AB list it would be more survivable than the single deredeo while doing a similar job ?

 

Quite curious to hear what everyone thinks.

Fire Raptors are awesome, and not only for anti-air. They can engage 4 targets per turn, shred transports and light-medium vehicles, as well as stack on wounds on marine infantry, or low through 4+Sv Mechanicum units like Thallax and Vorax automata.

 

Really the only problem with the Raptor is the confusion surrounding its weapon upgrades. The way it's written, you technically only get one autocannon in exchange for both bolters.