Techmarines and Forge Worlds Fluff Question

[jbaeza94]

Hey guys, i have a diy sm chapter and diy fw for my mechanicus army. i know techmarines wear red on their power armor to to symbolize their training on mars, but i was wondering if all techmarines studied on mars. would it be possible for them to receive training on different fw? would they keep the red or take the colors of the fw?

thanks alot guys.

 

[Tyriks]

They'll go anywhere for training. As long as the FW is willing and it's convenient for the chapter. I think it would be down to you - since many forge world's are technically subordinate to Mars, I could see them using red or using the FW colors, so I would say go with what best fits your preference/color scheme/fluff.

[Carlson793]

Per "The Machina Opus" sidebar in the current Space Marines codex (p61), they train on Mars:

 

 

In deference to their training on Mars, and the close bond that exists between Techmarines and the Adeptus Mechanicus, Techmarines incorporate red into their armour or heraldry, though they never obscure their own Chapter’s colours. Techmarines understand better than anyone the risks inherent in angering the machine spirit of battle gear and are careful to ensure that their Chapter symbol remains proudly displayed.

Techmarines also display the Machina Opus upon their armour, the mark of a Tech-Priest Adept. This honour is awarded to each Techmarine as he completes his mysterious training on Mars. The devotees of the Omnissiah accord bearers of the Machina Opus great respect, and they alone amongst the ranks of the Space Marines are allowed free passage through the Ring of Iron and into the great workshops of the Martian Hive.

[Tyriks]

Per "The Machina Opus" sidebar in the current Space Marines codex (p61), they train on Mars:

 

 

 

In deference to their training on Mars, and the close bond that exists between Techmarines and the Adeptus Mechanicus, Techmarines incorporate red into their armour or heraldry, though they never obscure their own Chapter’s colours. Techmarines understand better than anyone the risks inherent in angering the machine spirit of battle gear and are careful to ensure that their Chapter symbol remains proudly displayed.

Techmarines also display the Machina Opus upon their armour, the mark of a Tech-Priest Adept. This honour is awarded to each Techmarine as he completes his mysterious training on Mars. The devotees of the Omnissiah accord bearers of the Machina Opus great respect, and they alone amongst the ranks of the Space Marines are allowed free passage through the Ring of Iron and into the great workshops of the Martian Hive.

 

I don't think that we will see that hold up. C:SM was written before most of the Forge Worlds we have now were a thing, so I think any mention of forge worlds is Mars by default. But not every chapter will have a relationship (physically or politically) with Mars that would make that realistic. It also benefits a FW to train Techmarines since having sympathetic Astartes is always a good choice, so I think we would absolutely see them all over. When I get a chance I'll comb through the books more for something solid.

 

EDIT: Not quite the same, but similar: the Forge of Mars series had a Cadian enginseer turned rogue trader who trained somewhere away from Mars, but their unit entry also said they are trained on Mars.

[Battybattybats]

 

I don't think that we will see that hold up. C:SM was written before most of the Forge Worlds we have now were a thing, so I think any mention of forge worlds is Mars by default. But not every chapter will have a relationship (physically or politically) with Mars that would make that realistic. It also benefits a FW to train Techmarines since having sympathetic Astartes is always a good choice, so I think we would absolutely see them all over. When I get a chance I'll comb through the books more for something solid.

 

EDIT: Not quite the same, but similar: the Forge of Mars series had a Cadian enginseer turned rogue trader who trained somewhere away from Mars, but their unit entry also said they are trained on Mars.

 

But many of the Forgeworlds covered in the Skitarii and Cult Mechanicus books already existed in the fluff. Ryza, Metallica, Gryphonne IV all come from pretty old sources.

[BassWave]

Yes Bats, but with more attention brought to the mechanicus along with recent retcons, its a possibility it could change. They might make training on Mars the equivalent of going to an ivy league school compared to other forges.

[Carlson793]

Yes Bats, but with more attention brought to the mechanicus along with recent retcons, its a possibility it could change. They might make training on Mars the equivalent of going to an ivy league school compared to other forges.

Let's see. Costs the Adeptus Astartes effectively nothing to have a Techmarine trained. Mars is acknowledged to be THE place for technological knowledge, while other forges are known to contact Mars for more esoteric information. So really it becomes a question of whether the Space Marines want their techmarines trained at MIT or ITT.

[Battybattybats]

I think the biggest issue is travel time.

Mars can handle the training load, after all with only about 1million marines so maybe a thousand techmarines in the galaxy with perhaps a lower combat loss and replacement than ordinary marines that won't be many studying on Mars at any given time. There would likely be far more Sacristans from Mars-affiliated Knight Houses on Mars than Techmarines. The biggest issue for a chapter is maybe how long they are away studying for if the losses do get bad and if it's an eastern fringe world far from Mars so the travel times might be a significant factor of additional cost to the chapters strength.

[Tyriks]

I think another factor for some chapters will be their relationship with Mars, politically. Mars isn't fond of the Blood Angels for keeping the Baal Predator variant STC to themselves, so I would bet they'd be more willing to send a marine elsewhere. Plus while Mars could handle the load of every chapter, would they want to? They don't need favors from the Astartes like a smaller world might, and you stay prestigious by being exclusive. They could probably gain a lot by being more selective (like the very apt comparison of ivy league schools).

[Battybattybats]

On the other hand there's power in a monopoly too. Requiring all techmarines to train on mars would help keep mars at the centre of mechanicus power.

 

And there's influence, if every techmarine has to train on mars then they all are exposed to direct influence and pressure so that blood angel trainee will get leant on a lot to hold to mechanicus values over chapter values, and have to endure a lot of judgement for their chapters wrongdoing, to the aim of eventually getting the chapter to relent.

 

Allowing other forgeworlds to train them might let such wayward chapters as blood angels and space wolves off the hook while passing a lot of power to other worlds. Which would have a lot of a politically destabilizing impact inside the mechanicus.

 

Which is not me saying that can't happen, just that it'd be against Mars' interests were it to happen.

[Tyriks]

If Mars wasn't Mars, I think a monopoly would be more in their interests. But it's unenforceable, when FW X is right next to Chapter World Y and they volunteer, Y would want to take that (especially when their standing with Mars is in question). What's Mars going to do to enforce it? They already have failed for thousands of years to get those Baal STCs, and have at least a partial embargo on the BAs already, which hasn't persuaded them at all.

 

I would love future books to give us more info on stuff like this. Like what FWs tend to work with what chapters, or guard regiment/assassin temple/what have you. This could be an easy marketing approach, too (oh, you play Chapter Y? Forge World X frequently accompanies them for these reasons, better buy some AdMech allies!). It seems like we have a good skeleton of fluff for AdMech but I want the meat!

[Charlo]

I think it's Mars or nothing, in most cases for sure.

 

It is THE center of the martian empire and travel time isn't really an issue in the depths of things.

[Vel'Cona]

I don't see why Techmarines couldn't be trained at other FWs other than the fact that this hasn't been specifically addressed in the background. That said, logically any FW would have the resources to train its initiates/neophytes/noobs so a Space Marine shouldn't be any different in that respect. I'd say if someone wanted to write that into the background for their chapter or Techmarine I would have no problem with that. After all, logic is the chief domain of the Omnissiah!

[Charlo]

TRADITION IS OUR BULWARK IT ENDURES FOREVER MORE!

 

I'd say while other Forged certainly have the capacity to do so, Mars would most likely make a point of them training all Techmarines... So they had utter control over what they did and did not learn etc.

 

Entirely possible other forges do train them, but Mars is arrogant and inflexible in it's approach to anything.

[jbaeza94]

So it seems Mars holds a monopoly. Not the answer I was hoping for but it makes sense. Then to Mars my tech marines go! Thank you all for your quick and insightful replies!

[Battybattybats]

Of course the history of the Imperium is fraught with schisms, and some marine chapters are quite a mystery. Do the Charcarodons techmarines train on Mars? There may be some solid exceptions, but i am sure that Mars would not be happy to discover any.

[Xisor]

If all astropaths come via Terra, all Techmarines can come via Mars.