em_en_oh_pee Posted December 22, 2016 Share Posted December 22, 2016 HQ: Khârn Gorechild [190] Gahlan Surlak [110] Elites: Apothecarion Detachment Artificer Armor [55] Contempor-Cortus 2x Graviton Gun, Chainfist Dreadnought Drop Pod [275] Contempor-Cortus 2x Graviton Gun, Chainfist Dreadnought Drop Pod [275] (5) Red Butchers 2x Lightning Claws, Chainfist, 2x Power Axes [295] Troops: (18) Tactical Squad (Khârn, Apothecary) Chainaxes, Vexilla, Power Fist & Artificer Armor, Combi-Melta [250] (19) Tactical Squad (Surlak) Chainaxes, Vexilla, Power Fist & Artificer Armor, Combi-Melta [260] (10) Tactical Squad Chainaxes, Vexilla, Power Fist & Artificer Armor [160] Fast Attack: Anvillus Pattern Dreadclaw (Butchers) [115] Anvillus Pattern Dreadclaw (Tac Squad) [115] Heavy: Leviathan Dreadnought Armored Ceramite, Phosphex Discharger, CML, Drill Dreadnought Drop Pod [430] Kharybdis Assault Claw (Khârn's Squad) [235] Kharybdis Assault Claw (Gahlen's Squad) [235] [3000] I am desperately trying to find an alternative to the armor lists I gravitate to. The main weakness, I think, is anti-air. It is reliant on the Kharybdis tossing 10 S6 shots at the enemy flyers, but ... this requires them to survive the drop turn and beyond. Not always going to happen, I am sure. The twin Grav Cortus seem like a good catch-all unit. They can shoot up armor and troops and charge in when able, throwing a Chainfist at armor. The Leviathan does what it does, going after big armor units that have no Ceramite or other priority targets that wouldn't appreciate a trio of Melta shots to the face. Phosphex because duh and the Drill for more anti-tank punch. Butchers are meant to just jump into combat asap with enemy infantry, as are the big Tac squads. The small one can drop onto a backfield objective, if need be, or come in behind a bigger squad to hold on as they roll up the field. So, with that basic layout - pick it apart. What will undo this list! Give me any and all scenarios, so I can know what needs tweaking or what to look out for! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K3nn3rs Posted December 23, 2016 Share Posted December 23, 2016 A dreadclaw for a normal tac squad seems like a waste. Perhaps turn then into a TSS with flamers/ volkite chargers and chain chain axes - this way they can put out some decent fire power before charging. Or turn them into vets? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caillum Posted December 23, 2016 Share Posted December 23, 2016 @K3nn3rs, I initially thought the same thing, but he needs 3 Troops for "Berserker Assault". @em_en_oh_pee, I assume Gahlan's squad will be Augmented Inductii? S6 all the way! Also, you have swapped the Tactical's bolters for chainaxes (wise choice) and then swapped the Sergeants' bolter for power fists AND combi-meltas. You can't swap their bolter twice. I also recommend going for a power fist & chainfist on the Devoured. Gives him an extra attack for only 5 points. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
em_en_oh_pee Posted December 23, 2016 Author Share Posted December 23, 2016 @K3nn3rs, I initially thought the same thing, but he needs 3 Troops for "Berserker Assault". @em_en_oh_pee, I assume Gahlan's squad will be Augmented Inductii? S6 all the way! Also, you have swapped the Tactical's bolters for chainaxes (wise choice) and then swapped the Sergeants' bolter for power fists AND combi-meltas. You can't swap their bolter twice. I also recommend going for a power fist & chainfist on the Devoured. Gives him an extra attack for only 5 points. Since they get the chainaxes for free if they can take a chainsword, I have all the options and can swap accordingly. And I need to find points for that Power Fist! Excellent point I hadn't even noticed. That extra Chainfist attack can make a big difference. Probably will just drop the Combi weapons and maybe push around some other upgrades. A dreadclaw for a normal tac squad seems like a waste. Perhaps turn then into a TSS with flamers/ volkite chargers and chain chain axes - this way they can put out some decent fire power before charging. Or turn them into vets? I agree, the Dreadclaw is a waste. Wish they could take a standard Pod. I do love the idea of going for a TSS! Sadly, the +1 Comp Troops means I am kinda stuck. Can you guys see any particular issues the list will have? Obvious weaknesses to Interceptor. I will need to be really careful about Augury Scanners, for sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
God-Potato of Mankind Posted December 24, 2016 Share Posted December 24, 2016 A dreadclaw for World Eater tacticals is not a waste! Doubly so if Inductii! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fangbanger Posted December 25, 2016 Share Posted December 25, 2016 I'd drop the vexilla on the 10 man, if you are having to roll leadership checks the squad is pretty much done for anyway with only 10 men to start with. Are you making one of the large squads inducti as I think you defo should? I'd probably put Khârn and surlak in the same squad too, make the other inducti and chuck the Apoth in with them. If you want to find points, I tend to find 15 man tac squads are plenty. With 20' it's hard to get them all in. Plus when the special k goes boom, trying to fit 20 dudes in the footprint will be impossible. The big challenge with this is list is timing. Do you bring down the dreads to crack the armour first and leave the CC in reserve only for them not to come in until turn 4? Do you do the CC first so you can jink save with their pods? Or a bit of each and then never really excell at one area? A lot will obviously depend on opponents and dice rolls but I myself have always wanted to do an all orbit list. I prefer having a bit of both though so regularly run Spartans with a special k, anvilus and dread pod As a side note, butchers can take anvilus as dedicated Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
em_en_oh_pee Posted December 25, 2016 Author Share Posted December 25, 2016 Per the latest books, only Legion Termies can take a Dreadclaw now. Sadly. And I want this list to work, but it really winds up being too much of an investment in points for transports that don't bring enough to the table. Tanks just do more, generally. :/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slips Posted December 25, 2016 Share Posted December 25, 2016 Mind giving a page reference for the Dreadclaw because my physical copy has no such restriction nor does it invalidate the option being available to other units in the Legion Specific book. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
em_en_oh_pee Posted December 25, 2016 Author Share Posted December 25, 2016 Do you have the latest red books? Note that the Anvillus Dreadclaw has no rules for giving them to any unit in its own entry. Nor does the Terminator entry specify specialty ones, just basics. Looks like they removed the tidbit from the rules entirely, so I would love to give you a citation, but they took it out, so... yea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slips Posted December 25, 2016 Share Posted December 25, 2016 I do and whilst away from home and only have access to my Digital copy, page 30 lists Terminator Squads as having access to a Typo'd version - the deathclaw - which no one would honestly believe is different to the Dreadclaw found within the Fast Attack section. Too, the units page never lists which units can take it as a dedicated transport, that bit is found on the unit that can actually take it as one's page. Otherwise, following that logic, no units would be able to take a rhino as a transport since its entry on page 45 also doesnt tell you what units can take one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
em_en_oh_pee Posted December 27, 2016 Author Share Posted December 27, 2016 Red Butchers don't have Anvillus Dreadclaws listed as an option in the latest red book. So, there you go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fangbanger Posted December 27, 2016 Share Posted December 27, 2016 They are Legion Terminators, it's fine But it doesn't affect your list anyway so mute point Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
em_en_oh_pee Posted December 27, 2016 Author Share Posted December 27, 2016 They aren't Legion Terminators, they are Red Butchers. Dreadclaws are not an option for them and while it doesn't impact my list, it is good to know the rules as they stand right now. Since the Red Books, the option was removed from Legion-specific Termintors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fangbanger Posted December 27, 2016 Share Posted December 27, 2016 Pretty sure it's just an oversite by FW as it's not exactly OP and normal termies can take them. I'll be playing that they can and I'm sure no one will really care Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
em_en_oh_pee Posted December 27, 2016 Author Share Posted December 27, 2016 I don't play the game based on assumptions about the rules. FW may have done it intentionally. Maybe it was too good or imbalanced. That it isn't there can't be assumed to be an oversight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fangbanger Posted December 27, 2016 Share Posted December 27, 2016 Well our group is pretty chilled so each to their own Good luck with the list Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
em_en_oh_pee Posted December 27, 2016 Author Share Posted December 27, 2016 Well our group is pretty chilled so each to their own Good luck with the list Not sure what "chilled" has to do with not following the rules. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fangbanger Posted December 27, 2016 Share Posted December 27, 2016 As in we don't take it so seriously that something as insignificant as that would matter As I said, good luck with the list Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maarten Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 I'd try to put the contemptors inside dreadclaws. They're only 15 points more and since they're gonna spend their first turn inside the pod anyway you might as well use the pod as ablative armor. The heatblast special rule is fun too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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