daismith906 Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 Hi All Looking to start a small Blackshield force - options to customize and convert the minis is endless plus i can write my own fluff going to start small 1500pts and go from there using the Chymeriae option for force with all units deepstriking via pods of some sort - flying ones HQ Reaverlord - tartarus armour, haloblade,mastercrafted, combi melta, ironhalo - 217pts Elites 7 Tararus Terminators (body guard) x6 combi weapons, x1 heavy flamer, x6 powerfists, x1 chainfist - 327pts Troops 10 Mauraders, Sgt Powerfist, combi weapon, x7 shotguns, x9 chain axes, x2 meltaguns, Dreadclaw Pod - 362pts 10 Marauders, Sgt Thunderhammer, Combi Weapon, x7 Shotguns, x9 Chain axes, x2 Pariah Flamers, Dreadclaw Pod - 352pts Heavy Support Kharybdis Assault Claw - 235pts (Reaver and terminators in there) 1493pts so thoughts? cheers Dai Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dhar'Neth Posted January 7, 2017 Share Posted January 7, 2017 If you have no models on the battlefield at any point of the game you auto-lose so... I belive the list needs some changes. :( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harvest545 Posted January 10, 2017 Share Posted January 10, 2017 The reaver lord sort of needs the unique options he has (rad grenades, familiar) otherwise he doesn't really do much a consul like a forge lord could do just as well for a lot cheaper. I'm not sure which Chymeriae attribute you're taking but you're choice is going determine what equipment your marines would do best with and some options are done better by the rules legions get. The halo blade for instance isn't that awesome with the S/T 5 because initiative 3 and the fleet, fear, rage option is sort of like world eaters but you don't get ROW and lose the option of taking some units. The marauder squads are a bit expensive compared to other similar choices like tac-vets that are cheaper and do the same thing but exchange chain axes for special rules. Because of that you might want to consider running you force as an Army of Dark Compliance that way you could swap one of the marauder squads out for 20 man militia squad and a tac support squad with pariah flamers or something similar and still have the 20 man squad to sit on objectives as well as get more wounds in your army. Being as you'll only have like 28 guys and you might struggle with enemy armies that either have a lot of models in them or can output large amounts of low ap fire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foamy248 Posted January 14, 2017 Share Posted January 14, 2017 If you're going with Chymeriae, I would recommend taking Gene-bulked (+1 T, +1 S, -1 I, -1 Charge and Run distance, and may not make sweeping advances) most games, but you'd really have to tailor your list a bit more to the particular option. As Harvest said, don't bother with a halo blade as you'll be I3 anyway, so give your Praetor a Thunderhammer, power fist, or chain fist. If you keep with the Gene-bulked, don't bother with Tartar Sauce termies, as they'll lose their main benefits (run, sweeping advance etc) anyway, so I'd probably give the Reaver Lord and Terminator Squad Cataphracti TDA. In terms of the Reaver Lord's equipment, if he's in Cataphracti, give him Iron Halo, and a thunderhammer or power fist (plus digital lasers, master crafted weapon, etc) - this way he'll be S/T 5, have a 2+/3++ save and strike at S10 AP2... for 195 points. OR, if you want a Lord that WILL screw up most Praetor equivalents/named characters without Instant Death weapons, go Artificer Armour, Iron Halo, Cyber Familiar, Thunderhammer, rad grenade, plus any digital lasers/mastercrafted weapons for flavour. Like so, he is fairly similar to the Cataphracti variant I mentioned before, but he has far more options because of his Artificer Armour (for example, he has LOADS more options for melee/ranged weapons than the TDA Lord). Hope that makes sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unknown Legionnaire Posted January 14, 2017 Share Posted January 14, 2017 ... if he's in Cataphracti, give him Iron Halo, ... Doesn't make sense since both items provide a 4++. You probably meant to stack Cataphractii armour with a Cyber Familiar I assume, thus gaining the 3++. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nusquam Posted January 14, 2017 Share Posted January 14, 2017 If you have no models on the battlefield at any point of the game you auto-lose so... I belive the list needs some changes. :( Thats not true. At the end of any GAME turn you have no models you lose Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foamy248 Posted January 16, 2017 Share Posted January 16, 2017 ... if he's in Cataphracti, give him Iron Halo, ... Doesn't make sense since both items provide a 4++. You probably meant to stack Cataphractii armour with a Cyber Familiar I assume, thus gaining the 3++. ^this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vantraxx Posted January 28, 2017 Share Posted January 28, 2017 If you have no models on the battlefield at any point of the game you auto-lose so... I belive the list needs some changes. Thats not true. At the end of any GAME turn you have no models you lose Exactly. Also the drop pod assault rules will assure that half your pods arrive turn 1 so no risk of defaulting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeOfDoom Posted January 29, 2017 Share Posted January 29, 2017 If you have no models on the battlefield at any point of the game you auto-lose so... I belive the list needs some changes. Thats not true. At the end of any GAME turn you have no models you lose Exactly. Also the drop pod assault rules will assure that half your pods arrive turn 1 so no risk of defaulting. Untrue, read the part of your red books detailing fighting Age of Darkness battles. It specifies you lose if you have no models at any point, not at the end of any game turn. As its the supplement it would supersede the main rulebooks provisions on no models at the end of a game turn. Its literally in the rules that you lose if you have no models at any time. However it makes the game less fun and generally gets ignored (or never gets read). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeOfDoom Posted January 29, 2017 Share Posted January 29, 2017 Hi All Looking to start a small Blackshield force - options to customize and convert the minis is endless plus i can write my own fluff going to start small 1500pts and go from there using the Chymeriae option for force with all units deepstriking via pods of some sort - flying ones HQ Reaverlord - tartarus armour, haloblade,mastercrafted, combi melta, ironhalo - 217pts Elites 7 Tararus Terminators (body guard) x6 combi weapons, x1 heavy flamer, x6 powerfists, x1 chainfist - 327pts Troops 10 Mauraders, Sgt Powerfist, combi weapon, x7 shotguns, x9 chain axes, x2 meltaguns, Dreadclaw Pod - 362pts 10 Marauders, Sgt Thunderhammer, Combi Weapon, x7 Shotguns, x9 Chain axes, x2 Pariah Flamers, Dreadclaw Pod - 352pts Heavy Support Kharybdis Assault Claw - 235pts (Reaver and terminators in there) 1493pts so thoughts? cheers Dai Its a very, very small army. If you are using the gene-bulked, you might as well use Cataphractii armour, as the Tarty armor's benefits are wasted because of the gene-bulked restrictions. There is also he RAW issue with auto-losing any Age of Darkness battle because you are in all pods, but thats less of an issue unless someone wants to be a jerk about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nusquam Posted January 29, 2017 Share Posted January 29, 2017 If you have no models on the battlefield at any point of the game you auto-lose so... I belive the list needs some changes. Thats not true. At the end of any GAME turn you have no models you lose Exactly. Also the drop pod assault rules will assure that half your pods arrive turn 1 so no risk of defaulting. Untrue, read the part of your red books detailing fighting Age of Darkness battles. It specifies you lose if you have no models at any point, not at the end of any game turn. As its the supplement it would supersede the main rulebooks provisions on no models at the end of a game turn. Its literally in the rules that you lose if you have no models at any time. However it makes the game less fun and generally gets ignored (or never gets read). Where? I just read through the LACAL book and did a cntrl+F to see if I missed it. Theres the intro(which states it replaces all previous AoD rules), changes to the core game, fighting in the age of darkness, allies, scoring, denial, then goes into LoWs, and force orgs. None of those talk about sudden death. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
em_en_oh_pee Posted January 30, 2017 Share Posted January 30, 2017 Hi All Looking to start a small Blackshield force - options to customize and convert the minis is endless plus i can write my own fluff going to start small 1500pts and go from there using the Chymeriae option for force with all units deepstriking via pods of some sort - flying ones HQ Reaverlord - tartarus armour, haloblade,mastercrafted, combi melta, ironhalo - 217pts Elites 7 Tararus Terminators (body guard) x6 combi weapons, x1 heavy flamer, x6 powerfists, x1 chainfist - 327pts Troops 10 Mauraders, Sgt Powerfist, combi weapon, x7 shotguns, x9 chain axes, x2 meltaguns, Dreadclaw Pod - 362pts 10 Marauders, Sgt Thunderhammer, Combi Weapon, x7 Shotguns, x9 Chain axes, x2 Pariah Flamers, Dreadclaw Pod - 352pts Heavy Support Kharybdis Assault Claw - 235pts (Reaver and terminators in there) 1493pts so thoughts? cheers Dai Its a very, very small army. If you are using the gene-bulked, you might as well use Cataphractii armour, as the Tarty armor's benefits are wasted because of the gene-bulked restrictions. There is also he RAW issue with auto-losing any Age of Darkness battle because you are in all pods, but thats less of an issue unless someone wants to be a jerk about it. It isn't being a jerk to follow the rules of the game. They are so absolutely clear, it isn't like it is a RAI/RAW discussion. Until FW fixes it, we can't just ignore it because we don't like it. Otherwise, I would just ignore all the 1's I roll or ignore FOCs, etc. If you have no models on the battlefield at any point of the game you auto-lose so... I belive the list needs some changes. Thats not true. At the end of any GAME turn you have no models you lose Exactly. Also the drop pod assault rules will assure that half your pods arrive turn 1 so no risk of defaulting. Untrue, read the part of your red books detailing fighting Age of Darkness battles. It specifies you lose if you have no models at any point, not at the end of any game turn. As its the supplement it would supersede the main rulebooks provisions on no models at the end of a game turn. Its literally in the rules that you lose if you have no models at any time. However it makes the game less fun and generally gets ignored (or never gets read). Where? I just read through the LACAL book and did a cntrl+F to see if I missed it. Theres the intro(which states it replaces all previous AoD rules), changes to the core game, fighting in the age of darkness, allies, scoring, denial, then goes into LoWs, and force orgs. None of those talk about sudden death. Victory Conditions p113 "If at any point, unless specified by the particular mission, a side has no models present on the table, their opponent has won." Disappointing as the rule may be, it is clear as crystal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dulahan Posted January 30, 2017 Share Posted January 30, 2017 Doesn't Iron Halo stack with Cat armor and turn it to a 3++ save? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unknown Legionnaire Posted January 30, 2017 Share Posted January 30, 2017 No. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harrowmaster Posted January 30, 2017 Share Posted January 30, 2017 Doesn't Iron Halo stack with Cat armor and turn it to a 3++ save? No, that's the cyber familiar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nusquam Posted January 30, 2017 Share Posted January 30, 2017 It wasn't a question of clarity, but of where the rule was. It's not a blanket 30k rule, just when doing those missions. But wait, how are the 30k core missions not blanket rules you ask? Because zone mortalis, eternal war, maelstrom missions and the like exist and they don't have such conditions. Same with events if they don't explicitly say it. So it's important to know what missions you're using in a reserve heavy army. Most lists I see are geared more towards a general all comers any mission theme that aren't prepares for Last Man Standing or Attrition secondary objectives in the typical 30k core mission. So with that in mind, daismith906, what missions do you plan on running with this list? Or is it just a general list? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dulahan Posted January 30, 2017 Share Posted January 30, 2017 Doesn't Iron Halo stack with Cat armor and turn it to a 3++ save? No, that's the cyber familiar Ahh, that's right. But you do get to (at least in 40k Cataphractii armor) re-roll invuln saves of 1 if you have an Iron Halo too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harrowmaster Posted January 30, 2017 Share Posted January 30, 2017 Only 40k though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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