Ragnar Blackmane by ADB

[Guest]

Good to be you Arkley - sometimes british are so Dickens 'cancerous' style...

@HeritoA: You're commentating in a thread specifically about Space Wolves, I didnt need to remind you of your bias here, it was already on display.

You see what you want to see. That particular book is bad cause of story and prose. It has nothing to do with the Space wolves. Whom - let me remind you just in case - I liked in Wolf King, Leman Russ, TS and Stormcaller.

Right now the only bias being made is by you - cause someone doesn't like your Legion (who mind you has their moments of glory which they totally deserve)

And Arkley is you toxic fan - you should drink beer sometimes

I wonder how many people have me on their ignore list compared to you...

You are the main reason I barely come to the BL section.

And I have a bottle of Champion and a G&T at my side... And you are still cancerous

WLK

[HeritorA]

Good to be you Arkley - sometimes british are so Dickens 'cancerous' style...

@HeritoA: You're commentating in a thread specifically about Space Wolves, I didnt need to remind you of your bias here, it was already on display.

You see what you want to see. That particular book is bad cause of story and prose. It has nothing to do with the Space wolves. Whom - let me remind you just in case - I liked in Wolf King, Leman Russ, TS and Stormcaller.

Right now the only bias being made is by you - cause someone doesn't like your Legion (who mind you has their moments of glory which they totally deserve)

And Arkley is you toxic fan - you should drink beer sometimes

I wonder how many people have me on their ignore list compared to you...

You are the main reason I barely come to the BL section.

And I have a bottle of Champion and a G&T at my side... And you are still cancerous

WLK

My bottle of Hobgoblin is much better. It would be good if we all would try to be friends ;) Healthy drink goes a long way

[Guest]

Good to be you Arkley - sometimes british are so Dickens 'cancerous' style...

@HeritoA: You're commentating in a thread specifically about Space Wolves, I didnt need to remind you of your bias here, it was already on display.

You see what you want to see. That particular book is bad cause of story and prose. It has nothing to do with the Space wolves. Whom - let me remind you just in case - I liked in Wolf King, Leman Russ, TS and Stormcaller.

Right now the only bias being made is by you - cause someone doesn't like your Legion (who mind you has their moments of glory which they totally deserve)

And Arkley is you toxic fan - you should drink beer sometimes

I wonder how many people have me on their ignore list compared to you...

You are the main reason I barely come to the BL section.

And I have a bottle of Champion and a G&T at my side... And you are still cancerous

WLK

My bottle of Hobgoblin is much better. It would be good if we all would try to be friends Healthy drink goes a long way

Hell will freeze over, You spam this forum with crap.

[Kelborn]

Guys, is that really necessary?

 

If you have the urgent need of slapping each other with white gloves, do it in a seperate thread.

 

Jeez -.-

[bluntblade]

And please don't besmirch the good name of Hobgoblin.

[b1soul]

I thought Emperor's Gift was one of ADB's less enjoyable books...I am of course speaking about my own personal enjoyment

 

1. Ending felt very rushed

 

2. I did not find Hyperion very interesting (he's mind-scribed as part of GK recruitment...so this isn't really a criticism of weak writing by ADB)

 

3. As a non-SW fan...I felt disappointed at the apparent fan-service lavished upon the SW by a story advertised as mainly a GK vehicle. I felt I wasn't getting what I desired...the mysterious, ultra-elite GK shining in the spotlight. I felt ADB actually took the GK down a peg.

 

I have almost no gripes with Ragnar. It was exactly what I expected it to be. It certainly added depth to the legend of the Young King, a character I had previously never liked. Dialogue was especially good.

[Mantras]

I loved this book, as someone who openly dislikes Space Wolves as a faction and loves the DA's, this was very enjoyable and very balanced. My favorite moment was Razortongue being spat at by the beast, I forget the line but something like "he had a split second to wonder where his helm was, still securely stored in the orbiting ship..."

 

On the other works by AD-B, every ADB book shines a light on subjects previously thought to be understood and causes you to question your assumptions, these are no different. 

 

I also wonder if Heritor has a job with the amount he posts on here, but love the discussion.

[HeritorA]

Good to be you Arkley - sometimes british are so Dickens 'cancerous' style...

@HeritoA: You're commentating in a thread specifically about Space Wolves, I didnt need to remind you of your bias here, it was already on display.

You see what you want to see. That particular book is bad cause of story and prose. It has nothing to do with the Space wolves. Whom - let me remind you just in case - I liked in Wolf King, Leman Russ, TS and Stormcaller.

Right now the only bias being made is by you - cause someone doesn't like your Legion (who mind you has their moments of glory which they totally deserve)

And Arkley is you toxic fan - you should drink beer sometimes

I wonder how many people have me on their ignore list compared to you...

You are the main reason I barely come to the BL section.

And I have a bottle of Champion and a G&T at my side... And you are still cancerous

WLK

My bottle of Hobgoblin is much better. It would be good if we all would try to be friends Healthy drink goes a long way

Hell will freeze over, You spam this forum with crap.

such a gentleman you are - why my thoughts are crap and yours are shining rainbows bro?

And please don't besmirch the good name of Hobgoblin.

And how do i besmirch it - tis awesome, I liked it even more than Bugman XXX

I loved this book, as someone who openly dislikes Space Wolves as a faction and loves the DA's, this was very enjoyable and very balanced. My favorite moment was Razortongue being spat at by the beast, I forget the line but something like "he had a split second to wonder where his helm was, still securely stored in the orbiting ship..."

On the other works by AD-B, every ADB book shines a light on subjects previously thought to be understood and causes you to question your assumptions, these are no different.

I also wonder if Heritor has a job with the amount he posts on here, but love the discussion.

If you have goblins to help you that could happen :)

[WarriorFish]

This exchange stops now, it is unacceptable. Respect the rules and fellow board members. I want to see this back on topic and do not expect to have to deal with this sort of behaviour again; if I do warning(s) will be issued.

[R_F_D]

How does the depiction of Ragnar here differ from the Bill King version (only one I've read and enjoyed up until he stopped)?

[Kelborn]

Good question.

 

Heard that Ragnar's developing through the story:

At first, hot blooded and at the end more wise and calm.

[Phoebus]

I thought it was at once quite a nice tribute to King's work while at the same time being its own tale.

 

Ragnar avoids the humor King injected in his own novels, which, honestly, was for the best. It feels like the author is borrowing from the formula King used on his own novels, but it is nonetheless an A D-B tale, laced with equal portions of nuance, heroism, and visions of dystopia. As Kelborn said, you do see the contrast between the young upstart and the blooded, more tempered warlord. The real success, however, isn't even the Young King Ragnar himself. William King's supporting cast - sidekicks and villains alike - didn't always do the setting justice. Razortongue and Sorael, on the other hand, are memorable, captivating characters.

 

The only shortcoming to this story, in my eyes, was its length. I appreciate that A D-B had his hands full with Master of Mankind, Black Legion drafts, and a slew of other stories he's contributed in the meantime. Added length wouldn only have made this tale feel more cohesive. It would have made an already powerful and personal-feeling project on the same level as Helsreach, I think.

[b1soul]

Aye...Razortongue was a memorable one...and I loved the twist

[HeritorA]

How does the depiction of Ragnar here differ from the Bill King version (only one I've read and enjoyed up until he stopped)?

King's Ragnars is a hot tempered pup which goes from a Blood Claw to a Grey Hunter. A D-B  was able to show his untempered rage that he always need to control and his leadership qualities as a Wolf Lord. A D-B Ragnar is more 'real' and 'human' with all the intended flaws.

[R_F_D]

Thanks all.

Maybe a topic for another thread but has there been a similar, more recent, series showing the development of a Space Marine from initiate onwards?

[HeritorA]

Thanks all.

Maybe a topic for another thread but has there been a similar, more recent, series showing the development of a Space Marine from initiate onwards?

Shrike by George Mann.

Azrael  has it's moments.

Praetorian of Dorn  - Archamus road etc.

[Roomsky]

Thanks all.

Maybe a topic for another thread but has there been a similar, more recent, series showing the development of a Space Marine from initiate onwards?

 

There's always Ian Watson's Space Marine, if you're prepared for a journey through madness.

 

Also, back to Ragnar before we get slapped again.

[R_F_D]

 

There's always Ian Watson's Space Marine, if you're prepared for a journey through madness.

 

Also, back to Ragnar before we get slapped again.

 

 

LOL I remember his Inquisition trilogy which was weird to me as a teenager but I digress.

 

Just read the prologue of Ragnar; i can put my finger on it why but it feels weird reading 40K for the first time in years after so much 30K.

[Roomsky]

 

 

There's always Ian Watson's Space Marine, if you're prepared for a journey through madness.

 

Also, back to Ragnar before we get slapped again.

 

 

LOL I remember his Inquisition trilogy which was weird to me as a teenager but I digress.

 

Just read the prologue of Ragnar; i can put my finger on it why but it feels weird reading 40K for the first time in years after so much 30K.

 

 

Don't tell anyone, but I haven't read any actual 40k (sans Ragnar) except for Lord of the Night. I plan to fix that this year, however. If I had to give another critique of Ragnar, it would be that it wasn't as different as I had expected it would be. The galaxy may be coming apart at the seams, but the Space Wolves seem t be having a relatively good time.

[Augustus]

I say it loud and I say it often, but this is one of my favorite books. Space Wolf was, outside of the codexes and rulebooks and the sermonizing of rather large men with neckbeards, my first exposure to 40k fiction. I was 13 at the time. Phoebus described it well when he said it (paraphrasing) was a nice nod to Bill King's Ragnar. Outside of nitpicking, which I am want to do with AD-B's stories, the only thing that could have made it better (possibly) was added length. That said, I felt the story was concise and "complete" but more of the same things I like would always make me even happier. The thing I like the appreciate about it the most is how he captured (my perception) the character of not 1, not 2, but 3 different chapters in a borderline Novel-Novella. I'm only giving the length to emphasize how impressive it was to do so in such a relatively short space and not to open an argument over vocabulary

[DarKnight]

Sheesh, you guys are mean! lol 

[b1soul]

It's worth noting that when Ragnar kills the DA who draws first blood against him...he's already a "battle leader", not a young Blood Claw

 

So it appears maturity came late to him

 

Also, one thing I did find odd was that most of Ragnar's men seemed to approve his act...wouldn't it go against Fenrisian warrior honour? To kill someone simply because he drew first blood in a contest to first blood. Essentially, it's the act of an angry sore loser

 

Similarly, I found it strange that in Leman Russ Great Wolf, Russ was angry when the Lion pressured him to make a public apology...after the SW blew up a bunch of DA. You'd think Russ would give one freely

[Jarl Kjaran Coldheart]

It's worth noting that when Ragnar kills the DA who draws first blood against him...he's already a "battle leader", not a young Blood Claw

 

So it appears maturity came late to him

 

Also, one thing I did find odd was that most of Ragnar's men seemed to approve his act...wouldn't it go against Fenrisian warrior honour? To kill someone simply because he drew first blood in a contest to first blood. Essentially, it's the act of an angry sore loser

 

Similarly, I found it strange that in Leman Russ Great Wolf, Russ was angry when the Lion pressured him to make a public apology...after the SW blew up a bunch of DA. You'd think Russ would give one freely

 

Ragnar's men seemed to approve at first, but from what I remember this was later used to shame him in private. Such as how Corax backed up Bran's treatment of the Imperial Fist commander in Deliverance Lost, then tore Bran a new one once the conversation was over.

 

The apology...I think its the nature of how the Lion made him apologize. It wasnt a meeting of equals or brothers, but rubbing his nose in it (so to speak). The fact a prideful being like Russ was apologizing should have been enough.

[DarKnight]

It's worth noting that when Ragnar kills the DA who draws first blood against him...he's already a "battle leader", not a young Blood Claw

 

So it appears maturity came late to him

 

Also, one thing I did find odd was that most of Ragnar's men seemed to approve his act...wouldn't it go against Fenrisian warrior honour? To kill someone simply because he drew first blood in a contest to first blood. Essentially, it's the act of an angry sore loser

 

Similarly, I found it strange that in Leman Russ Great Wolf, Russ was angry when the Lion pressured him to make a public apology...after the SW blew up a bunch of DA. You'd think Russ would give one freely

I think it would be more accurate to say opinions varied through the pack regarding the death of the Angel, but overall it wasn't too big a deal. Regret for a misdeed freely given is one thing, but you aren't going to MAKE them do anything. Add to the fact that both sides have killed one another "accidentally" in the ten-thousand years proceeding in these duels and yeah... :cuss happens.

[b1soul]

In my mind, the DA are generally more disciplined and rule-bound...and wouldn't kill out of rage like a brash SW warrior

 

That could be my bias of course. Perhaps there's been a known history of DA dirty acts