FarFromSam Posted January 17, 2017 Share Posted January 17, 2017 Hey guys, I'm new to the 30k scene, and how lists are made. I saw, that double CAD is out the window, and the alternative forces don't offer much in the way of additional FA slots. I'm currently looking to run a ravenwing protocol list in order to run 3 units of jetbikes, and a unit of out riders as troops. I'm also going to run 9 javelins (3 units of 3). Where I'm stalling is finding slots for an anvillus (a cheap flyer) attack bikes, and legion speeders. Is there a formation I'm missing that allows me to field more than 3 FA slots while still using the DA proto ravenwing formation? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/329951-how-to-gain-access-to-more-fast-attack-slots/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronDrake28 Posted January 17, 2017 Share Posted January 17, 2017 Welp, you can't even take an allied detachment when using the Ravenwing RoW. So no, you only have 3 Fast Attack slots. :P I can't think of any RoW that adds more Fast Attack slots tbh. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/329951-how-to-gain-access-to-more-fast-attack-slots/#findComment-4626199 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balthamal Posted January 17, 2017 Share Posted January 17, 2017 You don't get additional slots in the Force Org - at best you'll take a RoW that moves some units from Elites/FA/HS to troops Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/329951-how-to-gain-access-to-more-fast-attack-slots/#findComment-4626217 Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronDrake28 Posted January 17, 2017 Share Posted January 17, 2017 I assume you know of the Sky Slayer Support Squadron? It's a Heavy Support choice. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/329951-how-to-gain-access-to-more-fast-attack-slots/#findComment-4626233 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Blackwood Posted January 17, 2017 Share Posted January 17, 2017 You don't get additional slots in the Force Org - at best you'll take a RoW that moves some units from Elites/FA/HS to troops This Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/329951-how-to-gain-access-to-more-fast-attack-slots/#findComment-4626246 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Withershadow Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 Outriders are sweet but the FA jetbikes are a bit bleh. They heavy support ones are nicer. You can take two units of outriders as your troops, then your Javelins, then your jetbikes as heavy support. I will say that I would see what kind of lists your opponents run before going full in on this idea. Spammy lists are discouraged even when "thematic" in most 30k circles I've seen. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/329951-how-to-gain-access-to-more-fast-attack-slots/#findComment-4626774 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Blackwood Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 He's running ravenwing protocol. Which means acid heavy bolters in regular jet bikes which would be in the Troop slot. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/329951-how-to-gain-access-to-more-fast-attack-slots/#findComment-4626912 Share on other sites More sharing options...
FarFromSam Posted January 18, 2017 Author Share Posted January 18, 2017 Outriders are sweet but the FA jetbikes are a bit bleh. They heavy support ones are nicer. You can take two units of outriders as your troops, then your Javelins, then your jetbikes as heavy support. I will say that I would see what kind of lists your opponents run before going full in on this idea. Spammy lists are discouraged even when "thematic" in most 30k circles I've seen. I dont see any other anti vehicle units i could take though. Thought about lightning or others, but thats where i run into FA limits Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/329951-how-to-gain-access-to-more-fast-attack-slots/#findComment-4627102 Share on other sites More sharing options...
rendingon1+ Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 Outriders are sweet but the FA jetbikes are a bit bleh. They heavy support ones are nicer. You can take two units of outriders as your troops, then your Javelins, then your jetbikes as heavy support. I will say that I would see what kind of lists your opponents run before going full in on this idea. Spammy lists are discouraged even when "thematic" in most 30k circles I've seen. What is "spammy list"? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/329951-how-to-gain-access-to-more-fast-attack-slots/#findComment-4627104 Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronDrake28 Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 Outriders are sweet but the FA jetbikes are a bit bleh. They heavy support ones are nicer. You can take two units of outriders as your troops, then your Javelins, then your jetbikes as heavy support. I will say that I would see what kind of lists your opponents run before going full in on this idea. Spammy lists are discouraged even when "thematic" in most 30k circles I've seen. What is "spammy list"? A list containing a lot of the same unit. One that comes to mind is a lot of quad mortars and medusas. I don't really think you could call a Ravenwing 'spammy' though, as it quite literally forces you to take a lot of bikes. They aren't too powerful in my experience either. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/329951-how-to-gain-access-to-more-fast-attack-slots/#findComment-4627183 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Withershadow Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 I was mainly referring to 9 Javelins. Not necessarily an issue of "power", just tedious and boring to face so many of the same thing. Even the addition of the desired dreadclaw (thus being two squadrons of speeders and a dreadclaw) already goes a long way to counteract the monotony. You can have troop bikes, FA speeders and flyers, and heavy support jetbikes, which I would think is more than adequate to represent Ravenwing. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/329951-how-to-gain-access-to-more-fast-attack-slots/#findComment-4627257 Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkimaskMohawk Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 9 Javs is pretty powerful in 30k, though OP sounds like he's in pretty deep in 40k so they'd be par for the course there Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/329951-how-to-gain-access-to-more-fast-attack-slots/#findComment-4627303 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Petitioner's City Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 Outriders are sweet but the FA jetbikes are a bit bleh. They heavy support ones are nicer. You can take two units of outriders as your troops, then your Javelins, then your jetbikes as heavy support. I will say that I would see what kind of lists your opponents run before going full in on this idea. Spammy lists are discouraged even when "thematic" in most 30k circles I've seen. I dont see any other anti vehicle units i could take though. Thought about lightning or others, but thats where i run into FA limits Sub-orbital attack wing for LOW? This thread on Heresy 30K and this one both have some ideas? So does the entry for Sub-orbital Strike wing in the legion red book not include the line that says "These Flyers may not be chosen from those already available to the army list normally." like it does in the Mechanicum red book? Not on the digital red book. Though it does say "see the list on here" and links to the "Using additional Super-heavy & Orbital Strike wing flyer units." That lists the flyers as Marauder Bomber, Marauder Destroyer, Thunderbolt Heavy Fighter and Crusade Avenger Strike Fighter. They can have Space Marine crews at +15 points and Battle Servitor Control at +15 points. Frankly, if it is already in the list then that is how you get it, I feel FW would have included a unit entry of 1-3 as a Lord Of War if they wanted to allow that. I could see an argument for Space Marine Flyers (from 40k....hisss) that are not in the Legion list before the flyers that are included in a Legion list. I went back to look at the new red book on the Orbital Strike Wing and I'm 99% sure Legion flyers can't be taken for it As has already been pointed out, the intention of the rule doesn't seem to be that legion flyers (especially drop pods) would be allowed. The rule always existed to let ppl use their FW 40k planes in 30k. Its a fun and characterful rule to include essentially navy assets in ground support RAW, in the other LoW sections (e.g. War Machine Detachment, Great Beast), it gives a list of choices which includes units from the army list ("chosen from the specific army list for the Primary Detachment, the Questoris Knights army list....or the optional Super-heavy list found on page 10." or "chosen from the specific army list for the primary detachment" etc) However, the sub-orbital strike wing has only "1-3 Flyers (see the list on page 10) with up to 3 hull points each". We'll come to page 10 in a sec, but the rest of it, describing that they have to enter play from a table edge and within 6" of each other really suggests that dreadclaws, which have to enter via deep strike and not the table edge reeeeeeeeally aren't meant to be included in this as they can't meet one of the rules set out for a sub-orbital strike wing! Now, the box on page 10, which as outlined on page 9 is the only place sub-orbital flyers can be chosen from. For flyers, the box only list the 4 which have already been mentioned in the thread Sorry to rain on the fun parade a bit, but it really doesn't seem that sub-orbital wings of dreadclaws should, or even need to be a thing? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/329951-how-to-gain-access-to-more-fast-attack-slots/#findComment-4627440 Share on other sites More sharing options...
FarFromSam Posted January 19, 2017 Author Share Posted January 19, 2017 I get it's a bit spammy, but I like the idea of a skimmer/jetbike army as their aestics mix. But the list needs antivehicle, and with jet bikes chewing up points in the troop slots, javelins fill the role. The formation limits my choices a bit. In 40k I chose Dark Angels because of Sammael's bike (and his name) and I have 12 speeders there. So maybe i have a bit of a fetish going there. Thank yall for the help. So if I put in another hq, those allies won't have the benefits, and restrictions as the main force RoW? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/329951-how-to-gain-access-to-more-fast-attack-slots/#findComment-4628306 Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronDrake28 Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 If you take an Allied Detachment they do not benefit from any Rite of War the Primary Detachment may have. Also you can't ally with the same Legion. The main issue though is that using the Ravenwing Protocol RoW means you cannot take an allied detachment at all. (If that's not what you're asking then ignore me, my reading skills need a tune-up. :P) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/329951-how-to-gain-access-to-more-fast-attack-slots/#findComment-4628315 Share on other sites More sharing options...
FarFromSam Posted January 19, 2017 Author Share Posted January 19, 2017 No, that was spot on man, thank you. You covered everything. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/329951-how-to-gain-access-to-more-fast-attack-slots/#findComment-4628419 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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