Ishagu Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 I became a 30k convert about 2 years ago. In that time I managed to amass a sizable Horus Heresy Ultramarine army, as well as elements of SoH and Mechanicus. This is on top of my sizable 40k forces of Ultras, GK, etc... I was pulled in to the Age of Darkness by the models, the rules and specifically, being able to collect and use the rock-stars of the Warhammer world on the tabletop - the Primarchs and the other heroes and villains of legend. This also came on the back of GW being completely anonymous from the community and gaming scene, and the bad feeling caused by their regular price hikes and a terrible power creep (or power leap) of new books. Fast forward to today. Boxsets with tremendous value, amazing new models and lore on a regular basis, the use of beloved Horus Heresy models in 40k, new armies that have been requested by fans for years getting full releases, fun rules with interesting campaigns and now... the Primachs are returning. I have to be honest; it's getting hard for me to stay as excited about the future 30k releases. With the upcoming 8th edition of 40k that *could* fix the gaming issues, and the plastic releases of Heresy kits... I'm simply not visiting Forgeworld or buying from them. In the last 6 months I haven't invested in a single FW kit beyond a few utility characters. I think that after washing, cleaning and finishing the last 11 sizable HH kits I bought, I now have some serious resin fatigue! This isn't to say that I'm leaving the HH. 30k games are still the most balanced and close matches I enjoy on a regular basis. I just feel that a lot of the Thunder has been stolen back by the regular GW plastic division and their stellar releases over the last year. Am I alone in this? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/330040-feel-40k-is-pulling-you-away-from-the-horus-heresy/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guiltysparc Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 Not alone, i'm very interested in the upcoming narrative advancements and all of the new models coming out are just amazing. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/330040-feel-40k-is-pulling-you-away-from-the-horus-heresy/#findComment-4628294 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Memento Of Prospero Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 All I see is conversion potential for the heresy. Sure the models are nice, but the game is back to power creep central. You really want to play games against Tau Surgespam or Magnus? Are those games really enjoyable for anyone? Not for me anyways. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/330040-feel-40k-is-pulling-you-away-from-the-horus-heresy/#findComment-4628301 Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronDrake28 Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 I see more excuses to buy Forgeworld in conjunction with the new armies. :P I have a problem. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/330040-feel-40k-is-pulling-you-away-from-the-horus-heresy/#findComment-4628304 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Son of Carnelian Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 If the rules were to be simplified even somewhat, I would dive back into 40k. But I ironically find 30k simpler right now. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/330040-feel-40k-is-pulling-you-away-from-the-horus-heresy/#findComment-4628328 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Withershadow Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 Nope, not at all. The releases are good from a model perspective (although swiftly approaching the "too much" territory of Age of Sigmar), but the rules are still a garbage mess of cherry-picking and one-upsmanship. 40K is a horrible game, and only 8th edition has a chance to pull me back to it. As far as using "beloved modes of Horus Heresy in 40K", if you mean Custodes, we have radically different ideas about what's fun and what's heresy. The whole premise of the question is silly anyway, these two games are far from mutually exclusive. To summarize, FW still makes way better models, way better rules, and way better fluff. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/330040-feel-40k-is-pulling-you-away-from-the-horus-heresy/#findComment-4628344 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlo Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 I know the feeling... For me it's all a bit much and so up in the air. I've half started DG (a lot of washed resin....) but sort of lost interest and am now waiting for Inferno to see if the 1KSons drag me in (and if they do i'll do a dual army for 40k too). It's funny, with some diligence I could have had a full DG army now but I decided to wait - I still like the legion but I'm not ready to commit until I've seen the 1KSons rules so then we have the full gamut of legion stuff to work with. (Plus I know come book 8 or whatever I'll be doing some BA straight away...). Compound this with the 40k release schedule... Magnus and the Ad Mech are both heavily calling to me from that front and I only have so much time for hobby, plus the story is actually getting crazy and its just hype after hype after hype! 8th Edition and Inferno will very much drive what I commit to I think, for example - I don't want to make my army of Magnus, sorcerers and Tzeench Daemons if in 6 months time the psychic phase is suddenly the boring and limited spellcasting that AoS become. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/330040-feel-40k-is-pulling-you-away-from-the-horus-heresy/#findComment-4628350 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scribe Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 If they fixed the 40K game to go back to how armies were built in 5th (which HH is much closer to) yeah I can see it. Right now I'm struggling hard to keep positive with 40K. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/330040-feel-40k-is-pulling-you-away-from-the-horus-heresy/#findComment-4628357 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Rohr Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 It was designed for late fifth/early sixth and definitely benefits from that level of balance. 40ks only weakness from the lore perspective is the tedium of uniform marine armies. 30k meta drives some cookie cutter choices but that's because of power gamers. The lore is wide open for anything you wanna do, which is why the armies are so much cooler than different takes on the exact same company of Ultras over and over in 40k. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/330040-feel-40k-is-pulling-you-away-from-the-horus-heresy/#findComment-4628380 Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Pounder Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 Totally, some of the new releases lately have been amazing! That and the fact I'm going back to my Death Korps of Krieg. Though I'm sure after a year or 2 I will probably come back to the Heresy! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/330040-feel-40k-is-pulling-you-away-from-the-horus-heresy/#findComment-4628382 Share on other sites More sharing options...
m_r_parker Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 To be honest, 40k for me has ebbs and tides, some of it is good whilst others aren't so. It's complicated, but I will say that at the moment there's a draw back into 40k. Take the period 3 years ago to about 12 months ago as a prime example of this. 40k was hitting a very low point for me, to the point where I was almost entirely ignoring it. It's around this time we started to see GW shut down any rumour-mongering internally, and any hype for upcoming releases was limited to 1 week out from release - as such there wasn't a lot to 'look forward' to, as you never knew what was coming. Forces were starting to get silly, and we started ramping up into what we've been seeing for the past 24 months or so - bigger models, niche armies and codexes, and a move away from the traditional FOC to a more Detachment / Formation composition (with the lack of any negatives in going for these). Plot was stagnant, prices of models was going up as the transition into plastic-only production (especially for characters / HQ choices), and the design aesthetic wasn't doing it for me. In comparison, 30k was really getting into it's stride. A more gritty and realistic setting, army composition given a more complex structure (with Rites of War, and Legion specific rules) and a design aesthetic that sits exceedingly well with me. Price of resin never really was an issue as I had the ability to pay for it. Over the past year or so, I'd say there's more of a swing back into 40k and it's starting to split my focus. I'm still not good over the play style of the game, and the use of Formations and Detachments, but maybe that will come with time. But certainly the progress of smaller units and character releases has been impressing me, such as the new Thousand Sons which have simply been superb. Progressing the timeline forward is certainly interesting, and I like the fact that they're taking risks and impacting things that have been centrepieces of the lore for the past few decades. The one thing that is really catching my eye is we're really back in the era of discount boxes again. Just today I was in my local GW and I was looking at the new DA box with the Tactical Squad, Upgrade Sprue, and Rhino. I don't need more DA's, but most of the ones I have were well before that new upgrade sprue came out. The value on the box is fantastic when buying it from GW, so buying it online and getting it cheaper is too tempting. And all of this goes without saying that Betrayl at Calth and Burning of Prospero have been huge releases in my eyes. The ability to stradle both games with plastic models makes army building across multiple systems so much easier. Is 40k dragging me back in, Godfather style? Yes. Is 40k going to replace 30k in my eyes? Not really, but it is making an impact. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/330040-feel-40k-is-pulling-you-away-from-the-horus-heresy/#findComment-4628396 Share on other sites More sharing options...
1000 Sons Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 40k is definitely going through a bit of a renaissance at the moment. Some great releases, starter boxes, story lines etc. Effective formations are finally being spread to more armies. This is something that I think they saw from 30k, when every army has some formations (rite of war formations) people won't hate them so much. 30k might be going through a bit of a lull, but once the Prospero book comes out I am sure it will spike back up. The last few 30k releases have been knight heads, Deredeo lascannon arms, legion weapons, hardly anything to get excited about since Russ. February with the hh day is going to be bonkers. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/330040-feel-40k-is-pulling-you-away-from-the-horus-heresy/#findComment-4628428 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Drekkan Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 I know the feeling... For me it's all a bit much and so up in the air. I've half started DG (a lot of washed resin....) but sort of lost interest and am now waiting for Inferno to see if the 1KSons drag me in (and if they do i'll do a dual army for 40k too). It's funny, with some diligence I could have had a full DG army now but I decided to wait - I still like the legion but I'm not ready to commit until I've seen the 1KSons rules so then we have the full gamut of legion stuff to work with. (Plus I know come book 8 or whatever I'll be doing some BA straight away...). Compound this with the 40k release schedule... Magnus and the Ad Mech are both heavily calling to me from that front and I only have so much time for hobby, plus the story is actually getting crazy and its just hype after hype after hype! 8th Edition and Inferno will very much drive what I commit to I think, for example - I don't want to make my army of Magnus, sorcerers and Tzeench Daemons if in 6 months time the psychic phase is suddenly the boring and limited spellcasting that AoS become. +1. Still, I don't thing that 30k or 40k exclude each others, ie my next army will be able to be played in horus heresy and regular game as well at every point level. Long story short, MOAR plastic models please and inferno at least ! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/330040-feel-40k-is-pulling-you-away-from-the-horus-heresy/#findComment-4628438 Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeremy1391 Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 I feel that the plastic releases in conjunction with the awesome upgrades from FW save me money as opposed to buying resin infantry and upgrades. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/330040-feel-40k-is-pulling-you-away-from-the-horus-heresy/#findComment-4628447 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spaced Hulk Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 Quite the opposite for me. I'm a relatively new recruit to the Heresy (I've only been seriously collecting a 30k army for about six months now, despite reading the BL HH books for years) and I'd say I'm now totally hooked. In contrast, my interest in the 40k setting is at a twenty year low, to the point where it's almost non-existant. It's a feeling that's been growing for a while (for example, the last codex I bought was Codex: Dark Angels, whereas there was a time I would have collected every 40k book, especially for new, long awaited armies like Deathwatch, Mechanicus and Genestealer Cults). If I had to pick a reason (besides just a normal change in interest that might happen to us all) I'd say it's probably the advancing 40k story line. Somehow, despite all the new armies and the background and the potentially drastic changes to the status quo - basically everything that's making lots of people excited about the setting again - somehow despite all that the 40k universe is feeling much smaller and more restrictive to me these days. Conversely 30k, despite being a setting where we not only know the eventual outcome, but have known it for a long, long time, feels like a brand new universe of infinite possibilities for my imagination to explore. Which is exactly how I used to feel about 40k. To be honest, the only 40k related material I currently feel interested in is quite retro, basically going back to Rogue Trader and Second Edition. For example, I really enjoyed reading Index Astartes Apocrypha, and I'd love to get hold of a copy of Rogue Trader again. But the current 40k setting, for whatever reason, just isn't drawing my interest the way it used to. Obviously this is just my opinion and current feelings on the matter, and I'm certainly not criticizing anybody who feels different or trying to sway their opinion in anyway. Just trying to analyze why I've personally lost interest in 40k at the moment. ☺ Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/330040-feel-40k-is-pulling-you-away-from-the-horus-heresy/#findComment-4628453 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Blackwood Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 I have been playing both , and adapting my collection to be useful for both for some time now, I prefer to play 30k. I do love some of the new models that have come out for 40k though , stuff like Wulfen , the New Ulrik , Saint Celestine ( The waifu to end all Waifus ) , Cawl( which may very well become an arch magos in a potential 30k mechanicum army ) . The getting closer to midnight thing is a little scary seeing how the wolves were treated ( which was not all bad , though somewhat bad but thats okay ) Or the Phallanx getting boarded by demons ( WHICH MEANT THE IMPERIAL FISTS GOT TO SHOW OFF SOME OF THAT VOID WARFARE HERITAGE !!!!! ) but all in all , I am interested , I am reading , and I am still in love with the hobby. Sometimes I wanna use my exotic Tanks so I play Armored Breakthrough Sometimes I wanna play with my techmarines so I play the Anvil Strike ForceI get a ton of mileage out of my Imperial Fists here especially using the alternate scheme since I can adapt chapter tactics as I want , and It allows me to write my own stories. All in all , Ive been pretty pleased with 40k as of late , because I only play it when I want to and on my terms , and having 30k means i get to decide when that is. Stuff like Zone Mortalis being contested with armies in either system has also been a blast. I dunno , I get what your feeling Ishagu I do , I just feel the other way ,I just have so many options now that I can have fun however I want depending on who I am playing. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/330040-feel-40k-is-pulling-you-away-from-the-horus-heresy/#findComment-4628530 Share on other sites More sharing options...
foamy248 Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 ^This. I'm relatively new to 30k, so 40k has little interest for me atm. I collect filthy xenos, so maybe when they get some love in the upcoming campaign... For now, I'm loving 30k. :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/330040-feel-40k-is-pulling-you-away-from-the-horus-heresy/#findComment-4628531 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLACK BLΠFLY Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 30k all the way. I have no interest in 40k whatsoever. What really put me off of 40k is having to constantly deal with the same cheaters at local tournaments... it just was not worth it and they killed the local tournament scene. Now they can only play each other which is karmically quite funny. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/330040-feel-40k-is-pulling-you-away-from-the-horus-heresy/#findComment-4628552 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gorgoff Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 Nope, not at all. The releases are good from a model perspective (although swiftly approaching the "too much" territory of Age of Sigmar), but the rules are still a garbage mess of cherry-picking and one-upsmanship. 40K is a horrible game, and only 8th edition has a chance to pull me back to it. As far as using "beloved modes of Horus Heresy in 40K", if you mean Custodes, we have radically different ideas about what's fun and what's heresy. The whole premise of the question is silly anyway, these two games are far from mutually exclusive. To summarize, FW still makes way better models, way better rules, and way better fluff. +1And I may add: Every time I talk to a 40k player about the game it is about effective ways of minmaxing their armies. There are examples of other players, but these are rare to the point of none existance. It's never about fluff, about cool armies or just having fun. So no, I won't go back playing a 40k army. I will play against them though because after all it is the same game. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/330040-feel-40k-is-pulling-you-away-from-the-horus-heresy/#findComment-4628594 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plaguecaster Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 When you get curb stomped by Eldar and Tau armies all the time since I m stupid enough to try playing fun fluffy forces (can't stand min maxing or the other competitive bull crap) it really makes you not want to play. Heresy is really taking off around my area with more events being planned through the year and getting heaps of overtime at work so really bulking out my Black Shield army through eBay and stuff. I still collect 40k but with how it is going at the moment I'm feel like I'll just give up, I preferred it when armies were more simple both you and your have the same force organisation with only one faction with the odd army trait or two whic can modifiy your list slightly but not too crazy, nowadays some people try squeezing as much as possible on their armylist so everything benefits from some crazy shenanigans which are almost impossible to deal with and keep track of Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/330040-feel-40k-is-pulling-you-away-from-the-horus-heresy/#findComment-4628615 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Qkhitai Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 I have to be honest; it's getting hard for me to stay as excited about the future 30k releases. With the upcoming 8th edition of 40k that *could* fix the gaming issues, and the plastic releases of Heresy kits... I'm simply not visiting Forgeworld or buying from them. In the last 6 months I haven't invested in a single FW kit beyond a few utility characters. I think that after washing, cleaning and finishing the last 11 sizable HH kits I bought, I now have some serious resin fatigue! This isn't to say that I'm leaving the HH. 30k games are still the most balanced and close matches I enjoy on a regular basis. I just feel that a lot of the Thunder has been stolen back by the regular GW plastic division and their stellar releases over the last year. FW doesn't necessarily equate to the Horus Heresy. You need the books if you want to use that system, but then it all depends on what direction you want your army to go in. The 30k army I'm putting together at the moment doesn't include any FW models, but I'll still be playing 30k with it and not 40k. More plastic 30k stuff is fantastic, since it will get more people involved at a lower cost of entry, plus more 40k models that can be used between the systems (daemon primarchs hopefully/probably eventually) only adds to the game. I'm not planning on touching 40k in the near future, but I definitely plan on taking what I can from the expanding range to supplement, customise and improve my 30k collection. I have little to no interest in FW releases and FW doesn't define 30k for me at all. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/330040-feel-40k-is-pulling-you-away-from-the-horus-heresy/#findComment-4628623 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jarl Kjaran Coldheart Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 Opposite for me as well. 40k Codexes pretty much killed any enjoyment I had in the game. 30k is far more balanced and enjoyable. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/330040-feel-40k-is-pulling-you-away-from-the-horus-heresy/#findComment-4628625 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brofist Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 Betrayal was the reason I got back into Warhammer. I know everyone has a different experience in this hobby, but I was an old Chaos player who got burned bad by GW for almost a decade straight. 30k gave me back my army and created a community of, basically, warhammer historical gamers. It's everything I've wanted in this hobby. Honestly I'm almost completely checked out of 40k. It's as alien to me as Age of Sigmar and I have no interest in it anymore. The new releases just kinda fly over my head and distance me from it even more. I'm going to ride out 30k for as long as I can. I'm still not optimistic and feel 8th will be a major test to see what happens to our game. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/330040-feel-40k-is-pulling-you-away-from-the-horus-heresy/#findComment-4628639 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Loss Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 Definitely not. Fall of Cadia is yet another example of how poorly written GW's 40k campaign books are compared to FW's black books. The art, the book design, the game design, none of it is on the same level. 40k as a game is still a mess, and it's a testament to how good 30k is that even with all of 7th's underlying problems, I think most of us would agree that the biggest concern this year is 7th screwing up what we have in 30k rather than it undermining decades of 40k. GW has done some laudable things over the last year and a half or so, but they're not on FW's level. FW have been doing the whole 'listening to the community' thing for far longer, and 30k feels like a labour of love. 40k does not. Additionally, as nice as the plastic kits are - some of them like the Lord of Change are spectacular - by and large FW still produce better models, even if they aren't in plastic, which for some of their kits would be a huge boon. In various cases, GW still has miles to go in order to rectify many years of problems. A modern and largely up to date model range with some plastic support, luxurious books done to a consistently high quality, lore that remains faithful to decades of history, arguably the best character models on the market and consistent community interaction since the creation of the setting puts 30k far above 40k in my books. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/330040-feel-40k-is-pulling-you-away-from-the-horus-heresy/#findComment-4628687 Share on other sites More sharing options...
depthcharge12 Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 I think I've been suckling at the teat of 40k recently due to the interesting lore shifts going on, but I'm still not buying anything from or for the 40k scene. Heresy games still top everything in my opinion, no desire to want to join the fustercluck that is the 40k meta. Still haven't bought too much from GW main except for BoP dudes, paint, and the occasional eBay bits. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/330040-feel-40k-is-pulling-you-away-from-the-horus-heresy/#findComment-4628697 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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