2500 Mechanised IXth Legion

[Jolemai]

Potentially got my first ever game of 30k coming up at the end of the month. This is what I'm looking at without proxying my 40k stuff:

 

Crusade Force, 2500

Blood Angels, Loyalist

Rite of War: Chosen Duty

 

Legion Centurion

~ Consul: Chaplain

~ Blade of Perdition, plasma pistol, melta bombs, refractor field, (crozius arcanum?)

 

Legion Centurion

~ Consul: Delagatus

~ Cataphractii TDA, chainfist (master-crafted), combi-meltagun

~ Warlord

 

Legion TDA Command Squad (3)

~~ Grenade harness, power fist

~~ Heavy flamer, power fist

~~ Lightning claws

~~ Land Raider Phobos

~~~ Multi-melta, armoured ceramite, auxilary drive, extra armour, frag assault launchers

 

Contemptor Dreadnought Talon (1)

~ Kheres-pattern assault cannon, meltagun, havoc launcher

~ Legion Dreadnought Drop Pod

 

Legion Veteran Tactical Squad (6)

~ Artificer armour, legion vexilla

~ Plasma gun (1), combi-plasma (2)

~ Xenobane

~ Legion Rhino

 

Legion Veteran Tactical Squad (6)

~ Artificer armour, legion vexilla

~ Meltagun (1), combi-melta (2)

~ Machine Killers

~ Legion Rhino

 

Legion Veteran Tactical Squad (6)

~ Artificer armour, legion vexilla

~ Flamer (1), combi-flamer (2)

~ Marksmen

~ Legion Rhino

 

Land Speeder Squadron (2)

~ Heavy bolter, Iliastus-pattern assault cannon (2)

 

Legion Sicaran Battle Tank

~ Heavy bolter sponsons

 

Legion Whirlwind Scorpius

 

Legion Cerberus Heavy Tank Destroyer

~ Armoured ceramite

~ Heavy bolter sponsons, pintle-mounted heavy bolter

 

Options

The only things I have to swap in are:

• Another 12 Mk IV marines
• Character on a Jetbike
• Predator
• Aegis Defense Line
• One of each type of Tarantula
• Whirlwind Hyperios
• Twp Drop Pods and a bunch of Mars-pattern vehicles

After that it's all about proxying 40k stuff at which point I can add more but I'd rather not where possible (not that it matter for my group but, you know...)

 

As you can see I lack anti-air but it *shouldn't* be a problem at this stage as (as far as I'm aware) no one playing 30k in my group has any air units. Other that that, I've got a typical 40k-style mechanised force... which is probably where I've gone wrong :facepalm:

 

Thoughts?

[Charlo]

Looking good with the changes I said earlier!

 

One thing that stands out is I'd just give the Xenobane Vets Marksmen instead. Wounding on a 4+ (6s being at AP2) on those bolters will do you much better against MC than getting a re-roll against them. Plus it means you can outflank too if need be.

 

Maybe drop the speeders to boost up the sniper vet squads too, adding in apothecary if you can? Can also drop the Contemtptor down to a Cortus-pattern (WS/BS4, slightly worse shielding but can overcharge it's reactor for a few run effects) to shave a good few points off too.

 

For 2500 you've actually fit quite a lot of tasty stuff in there! The Cerberus should keep your guys relatively safe from anything too menacing either.

[Jolemai]

Switching Contemptors saves me 40 points (which would only go into more Veterans) and*suppose* he's not losing out too much - I plan on using him like a Fragioso anyway so maybe cheaper would be best.

 

I would probably have to lose the Land Speeders to make further changes. On the one hand I'm loathe to do that as I'll lose the damage output but on the other I'm acutely aware of how thin my Troops are. (Can you tell I'm used to Razorback squads?) Any other considerations I'm missing?

 

Will make the plasma change as that makes sense.

[Charlo]

In a world of power armour, I'm not sure you'll be missing the HB shots too much.

 

Put one way; every Markman Veteran with a Bolter could be seen as a mini-assault cannon, as they "rend", plus they get the bonus of wounding anything tougher than T6 easier than assault cannons (like Dave's Iron Circle Robots heh)

 

Also, other than the models - nothing stopping you putting a pintle assault cannon on those Rhinos :D!

[Jolemai]

 

Crusade Force, 2500

Blood Angels, Loyalist

Rite of War: Chosen Duty

 

Legion Centurion

~ Consul: Chaplain

~ Blade of Perdition, plasma pistol, melta bombs, refractor field, (crozius arcanum?)

 

Legion Centurion

~ Consul: Delagatus

~ Cataphractii TDA, chainfist (master-crafted), combi-meltagun

~ Warlord

 

Legion TDA Command Squad (3)

~~ Grenade harness, power fist

~~ Heavy flamer, power fist

~~ Lightning claws

~~ Land Raider Phobos

~~~ Multi-melta, armoured ceramite, auxilary drive, extra armour, frag assault launchers

 

Contemptor-cortus Class Dreadnought Talon (1)

~ Kheres-pattern assault cannon, meltagun, havoc launcher

~ Legion Dreadnought Drop Pod

 

Apothecarion Detachment (3)

 

Legion Veteran Tactical Squad (7)

~ Artificer armour, legion vexilla

~ Plasma gun (1), combi-plasma (2)

~ Marksman

~ Legion Rhino

 

Legion Veteran Tactical Squad (6)

~ Artificer armour, legion vexilla

~ Meltagun (1), combi-melta (2)

~ Machine Killers

~ Legion Rhino

 

Legion Veteran Tactical Squad (7)

~ Artificer armour, legion vexilla

~ Flamer (1), combi-flamer (2)

~ Marksmen

~ Legion Rhino

 

Legion Sicaran Battle Tank

~ Heavy bolter sponsons

 

Legion Whirlwind Scorpius

 

Legion Cerberus Heavy Tank Destroyer

~ Armoured ceramite

~ Heavy bolter sponsons, pintle-mounted heavy bolter

 

Thoughts?

 

Changes in red. Can proxy the Apothecaries for now and with the leftover points I upped the Marksmen's numbers (mainly because I don't have any assault cannons to put on my Rhinos yet). Should add that even though my game will be against an (unknown) Iron Warrior list, I'm not looking to tailor towards it.

[Charlo]

Looking good!

 

Aye, no tailoring - but in 30k MC are pretty common as are Sniper vets so it's all fair.

 

Those medics should really help push your Vets staying power.

[Jolemai]

Instead of the extra Marines I could have gone for melta bombs on the melta squad of Veterans. Worth it post-FAQ?

[Lord Asvaldir]

Not really, one melta bomb attack a turn is going to have limited use. 

 

Instead of taking apothecaries, I'd highly suggest making your veteran squads ten men strong because then you'll unlock a second special weapon for the squad. Plus while fnp is nice, the extra bodies would probably just be more useful. Also in 30k, since two 5 man vet squads costs more than a 10 man squad, it's always better to stick with fewer units with more men.  

 

Also I saw you don't have any predators, but for BA predators with assault cannon sponsons are awesome, especially if you use them in the armored breakthrough RoW where they are troops and become fast. Down the road definetly a good unit to add to an armor focused BA list.  

[Jolemai]

If I drop the Apothecaries, boost all three squads to ten men and throw in a second special weapon (so that's now two special and two combi-weapons per squad), then I need to cleave a further 24 points from somewhere.

 

As for your Armoured Breakthrough point, I'll mull that over as an option. Would need to do some converting though!

[Lord Asvaldir]

24 pts is easy enough to find, all those extra heavy bolters you have on your tanks can easily go since they don't add a whole lot.  

 

I imagine the assault cannons from the land speeder set would work for predator sponsons, you'd just need to find a bunch off ebay. 

[Jolemai]

Here's my attempt at an Armoured Breakthrough list taking into account what I have available and that I can't have more non-Dedicated Transport Vehicles than Troops thanks to my Legion rules (otherwise I'd have had a Vindicator too). Changes in red:
 

Crusade Force, 2500

Blood Angels, Loyalist

Rite of War: Armoured Breakthrough

 

Legion Centurion

~ Consul: Chaplain

~ Blade of Perdition, plasma pistol, melta bombs, refractor field, (crozius arcanum?)

 

Legion Centurion

~ Consul: Delagatus

~ Cataphractii TDA, chainfist (master-crafted), combi-meltagun

~ Warlord

 

Legion TDA Command Squad (3)

~~ Grenade harness, power fist, combi-melta

~~ Heavy flamer, power fist

~~ Lightning claws

~~ Land Raider Phobos

~~~ Multi-melta, armoured ceramite, auxilary drive, extra armour, frag assault launchers

 

Contemptor-cortus Class Dreadnought Talon (1)

~ Kheres-pattern assault cannon, meltagun, havoc launcher

~ Legion Dreadnought Drop Pod

 

Apothecarion Detachment (1)

~ Artificer armour, augury scanner, power sword

 

Legion Tactical Squad (10)

~ Artificer armour, legion vexilla, combi-plasma, melta bombs

~ Legion Rhino

 

Legion Tactical Squad (10)

~ Artificer armour, legion vexilla, combi-plasma, melta bombs

~ Legion Rhino

 

Legion Predator Tank

~ Iliastus-pattern assault cannon sponsons

 

Legion Predator Tank

~ Iliastus-pattern assault cannon sponsons

 

Legion Attack Bike Squadron (1)

~ Illiastus-pattern assault cannon, melta bombs

 

Legion Attack Bike Squadron (1)

~ Illiastus-pattern assault cannon, melta bombs

 

Legion Sicaran Battle Tank

~ Heavy bolter sponsons

 

Legion Whirlwind Scorpius

 

Legion Cerberus Heavy Tank Destroyer

~ Armoured ceramite

~ Heavy bolter sponsons, pintle-mounted Iliastus-pattern assault cannon

 

Thoughts?

[Charlo]

Straight away turn those Tacticals into Vets - Heresy is not the system to load up on extra troops. The benefit of armored breakthrough is that you have no tactical tax by taking the Preds. You get 4 Elites slots so can do this straight away - also gives you the freedom to sprinkle in combi/ special/ power weapons and go for the ever so amazing Marksmen rule.

 

You can also ditch the Delegatus and take a special command tank as your warlord/ master of the legion. You upgrade the Sicaran for a few points and it gets gaining Super-heavy Command Tank rule (12" Ld buff/ re-roll bubble I think) and +1 BS as its Warlord trait and counts as having Master of the Legion for this RoW only.

 

Otherwise looks top notch 

[Jolemai]

Fair point about the Veterans but I am getting conflicting information when it comes to the actual number of Marines on this thread...

 

Also, having re-read the rules, I can't take the attack bikes without a Transport :( so I need to find a way to get more cheap infantry involved as per the IXth rules. This is why I can't really ditch the Delegates and his squad but I need to do something...

[Charlo]

It's not infantry, it's unit with the "Legiones Astartes: Blood Angels" rule, of which attack bikes are! Attack bikes =/= Infantry, they are the "bike" unit type. So they do not need a transport. They're actually a really good way to get around our personal restriction in this Rite of War :D

 

With the Apothecary... Where is he going? He's not allowed to join units in TDA - so he'll need a bike to ride with the attack ones, or you'll need to take Vets to drop a member of the squad so he can plonk on their Rhino :)

 

Even with dropping the Delegatus you have a 7:6 ratio of units with LA:BA to those that don't, so you're golden.

[Jolemai]

The Attack Bike Transport thing is the RoW limitation at work, not the IXth limitation at work.

 

Why can't the Apothecary go with the Command Squad? Is their some restriction in this expansion I don't know about?

[Charlo]

Yep, and the rite of war just says that infantry must purchase a dedicated transport. Bikes aren't infantry so they're not included.

 

 

All Infantry units that can do so must purchase a Dedicated Transport, and those without the option must be deployed mounted in another vehicle which itself has a Transport capacity. All such vehicles must have the Tank or Super-heavy Tank type.

 

Apothecary

 

 

Each Apothecary must be assigned to one of your squads during your deployment and may not voluntarily leave it during the game. Only squads entirely comprising models with the Infantry type and the Legiones Astartes special rule are eligible to be joined by a Legion Apothecary, and squads equipped with Terminator armour or with the Daemon special rule may not be joined by a Legion Apothecary.

[Jolemai]

Cheers.

Seems I'm getting confused with 40k stuff.

[Charlo]

No worries homie!

 

It's a really nice list, and the fact it makes your Preds fast will make you feel right at home ;)

[Jolemai]

Plan on leaving the Attack Bikes seperate to get around the Legion restriction so yeah, the Apothecary would need to ride with one of the Veterans. However, dropping the Delegates means I also lose the TDA Command Squad.

 

I could squeeze in a TDA squad in the Apothecary's slot but I then wouldn't have anywhere to put the Chaplain so I might as well drop him...

 

Two squads of Veterans and two Attack Bikes Vs six Vehicles is where I stand without him.

[Jolemai]

Will write up a full list when I get a sec but the current solution is another squad of Veterans (so three total), a five-man Heavy Weapon Squad and a Consul to babysit them.

 

Do I go for a Forge Lord to keep my Sicaran Warlord alive?

Do I go for a Librarian for Divination?

Do I go for a Master of the Signal for BS 5 and an Orbital Bombardment?

Do I go for a Siegebreaker to give them Tank Hunters?

[Jolemai]

Latest version, changes in red:

 

Crusade Force, 2500

Blood Angels, Loyalist

Rite of War: Armoured Breakthrough

 

Legion Centurion

~ Consul: TBC

~ Librarian ML1

~ Divination

 

Or

 

Forge Lord

~ ten points left over

 

Or

 

Master of the Signal

 

Or

 

Siege Breaker

 

Master of Armour

~ Legion Sicaran Battle Tank

~ Lascannon sponsons, pintle-mounted illiastus-pattern assault cannon

~ Auxilliary drive, armoured ceramite, extra armour

~ Warlord

 

Contemptor-cortus Class Dreadnought Talon (1)

~ Kheres-pattern assault cannon, meltagun, havoc launcher

~ Legion Dreadnought Drop Pod

 

Legion Veteran Tactical Squad (10)

~ Artificer armour, legion vexilla, Volkite Serpenta

~ Meltagun (2), combi-melta (2)

~ Machine Killers

~ Legion Rhino

 

Legion Veteran Tactical Squad (10)

~ Artificer armour, legion vexilla,

~ Plasma gun (2), combi-plasma (2)

~ Marksmen

~ Legion Rhino

 

Legion Veteran Tactical Squad (10)

~ Artificer armour, legion vexilla, Volkite Serpenta

~ Heavy flamer, heavy bolter and suspensor web, combi-flamer (2)

~ Marksmen

~ Legion Rhino

 

 

Legion Predator Tank

~ Iliastus-pattern assault cannon sponsons

 

Legion Predator Tank

~ Iliastus-pattern assault cannon sponsons

 

Legion Attack Bike Squadron (1)

~ Illiastus-pattern assault cannon, melta bombs

 

Legion Attack Bike Squadron (1)

~ Illiastus-pattern assault cannon, melta bombs

 

Legion Whirlwind Scorpius

 

Legion Heavy Support Squad (5)

~ Missile Launchers (5)

~ Artificer Armour

~ Rhino

 

Legion Cerberus Heavy Tank Destroyer

~ Armoured ceramite

~ Heavy bolter sponsons, pintle-mounted Iliastus-pattern assault cannon

 

Thoughts:

• Looking fairy straightforward but I lack any form of counter assault
• The missile lauchers are there simply because I have them (Mk VII but w/e) perhaps I could ask to treat them as autocannons for this game?
• The Serpentas are there just because. Can put the points elsewhere
• The Consul sits in the HS squad so I'm looking for something to buff them (or failing that, a fluffy choice such as the Forge lord)
• This sits me at 7:6 in favour of the IXth restrictions and beats the RoW's restrictions.

[Jolemai]

Dropped the serpents for artificer armour across the board (which I missed earlier) but other than that, I guess it's as refined as it can be?

 

My only other concern now is that I have two somewhat fragile scoring units and not enough power to win any other way :/

[Charlo]

Five scoring units: 3 Vet Squads and each Pred scores in Heresy (usually I think).

 

I think you've got a deceptive amount of power, especially if you factor in shutting down your opponents big guns. Lots of Assault Cannon shots (rending!) on very mobile bodies (fast tanks, bikes) mean you can dictate where the battle happens.

 

Again, my only concern is the Heavy weapons team being stuck inside a Rhino for a turn as they need to deploy inside. If you go second then it could mean they are wiped out before they even fire. Missile Launchers are also kinda weak sauce, though not too bad with a Master of Signal - you'll pop Dreads and such.

 

I'd also lose the HB on the vets if you can, you basically pay a lot of points for 1-2 extra shots compared to a bolter/ pistol. As you are mainly fishing for 6s to wound anyway, it makes little difference - give em an extra flamer or something.

[Jolemai]

In this RoW the Veterans are Elites and unless I've missed something, they have no way to score? Will be sticking the Predators in Reserve at this rate...

 

As for the heavy bolter, it's there because I don't have a second heavy flamer made up.

[Angmarred]

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