1500 Thousand Sons Guard of the Crimson King

[Chaplain Erasmus]

So, recently I've been contemplating jumping on the 30k bandwagon. I already know that I would want to play Thousand Sons, and would probably get the two boxed games to start things off. While I know that 1500 is apparently considered small by 30k standards, I'm nonetheless starting off with a list size (1) to see what I can play with just the stuff out of the box, plus or minus some minimal Forge World purchases, (2) because I have yet to discover what the local meta for 30k is, and (3) I want to start small before expanding on my force. 

With that in mind, please tell me what you think of this list: 


RITE OF WAR: Guard of the Crimson King 

Legion Praetor- mastery level 3, Cataphractii armour, combi bolter, force axe, arcane litanies, Pavoni- 225 
5 Sekhmet Terminators- Cataphractii armour, 4 force axes, 1 chainfist- 265 
5 Sekhmet Terminators- Tartaros armour, 4 force axes, 1 chainfist- 265 
10 Legion Veterans- Brotherhood of Psykers, ashpyx shells, Marksmen, Sgt w. artificer armour, Corvidae- 215 
10 Legion Veterans- Brotherhood of Psykers, ashpyx shells, Marksmen, Sgt w. artificer armour, Corvidae- 215 
Contemptor Dreadnought- Kheres assault cannon, extra armour- 195 
Whirlwind Scorpius- 115 

Total: 1495 

Thoughts: While I realize that this list is a bit top-heavy with very few models, I like the idea of all the infantry in my army being psychic and having access to asphyx shells. My general plan is the Termies take advantage of their Rite of War to deep strike in, the Vets advance or outflank as needed, the Whirlwind makes a nuisance of itself and the Contemptor acts as a big nasty threat. 

That being said, I am making the following considerations: 

1. Would it be better if I ditched the Contemptor and Scorpius for a pair of Rhinos for the Vets, and a Sicarian with lascannon sponsons? I realize that I'm somewhat lacking with anti-tank in this list. 
2. At this points level, would I be better going with Tactical Marines over Veterans so I can squeeze in more stuff? 
3. Generally, what are people's thoughts on rotor cannon-weidling Support squads, Land Speeders, and/or Achea bots? 

Constructive criticism is welcome.

[Purge the Daemon]

Tbh you probably don't need 9 psychic levels in 30k at 1500. The most another legion could bring would be 4 if they took double librarians.

 

You probably also don't need 4 scoring units especially because they are very expensive units.

 

I'd suggest maybe cut a veteran squad give it a rhino use the points turn the dread into a sicaran. Youd have another 170ish points so maybe try scrap together 10 or so and get a dual kheres contemptors which are decent at 1500.

 

Other than that I'd suggest raptora in the praetor as your troop units have to take the same as him and the bonus ++ is just so good on them.

 

 

On your last question rotor cannons even with the buffs will not fail to disappoint saddly. Archea are solid like other castellax but the plasma cannons aren't worth it they just do less damage than a bolt cannon. Land speeders are always good javellins with missile multi melta are amazing.

 

Though I think a key concern would be to get definetly some ranged anti tank and some staying power as I assume the terminators are deep striking for the bonus and the much needed maneuverability.

[Chaplain Erasmus]

Tbh you probably don't need 9 psychic levels in 30k at 1500. The most another legion could bring would be 4 if they took double librarians.

 

Really? I would have thought that utterly dominating the psychic phase, and having a plethora of psykers/power dice was one of the Thousand Sons' advantages?

 

 

I'd suggest maybe cut a veteran squad give it a rhino use the points turn the dread into a sicaran. Youd have another 170ish points so maybe try scrap together 10 or so and get a dual kheres contemptors which are decent at 1500.

 

I actually like these suggestions. I wonder, though, why is the Contemptor Mortis cheaper than the standard one? It has twice the firepower for no appreciable downside.

 

 

Other than that I'd suggest raptora in the praetor as your troop units have to take the same as him and the bonus ++ is just so good on them.

 

Thanks for pointing that out. I was under the impression that Guard of the Crimson King counteracted that rule (how else could you have Ahriman potentially as your warlord otherwise?) I will keep that in mind and make the appropriate changes, however.

 

 

 

On your last question rotor cannons even with the buffs will not fail to disappoint saddly. Archea are solid like other castellax but the plasma cannons aren't worth it they just do less damage than a bolt cannon. Land speeders are always good javellins with missile multi melta are amazing.

 

Ah, well, that's disappointing on the rotor cannons (I always liked the look of them, so many wonderful Fallout vibes). I will definitely keep that in mind about the Archea and the Speeders, though.

 

With all of the above in mind, here is the amended list:

 

Legion Praetor- mastery level 3, Cataphractii Terminator armour, combi-bolter, force axe, arcane litanies, Raptora- 225

5 Sekhmet Terminators- Cataphractii armour, 4 force axes, 1 chainfist, Raptora- 265

5 Sekhmet Terminators- Tartaros armour, 4 force axes, 1 chainfist, Raptora- 265

9 Veterans- Marksmen, Brotherhood of Psykers, asphyx shells, Veteran w. artificer armour, Corvidae- 203

-Rhino- extra armour- 40

Contemptor Mortis- dual Kheres assault cannons- 180

Sicarian- sponson lascannons- 205

Whirlwind Scorpius- 115

 

Total: 1498

 

I actually like how much more firepower there is in this list now, especially firepower that can deal with both vehicles and infantry alike. A question on Sekhmet loadouts, though, which are better, axes, swords, or a mixture of both? I see axes as very nice for dealing with tough nasties like Gal Vorbak, Deathshroud or Custodians, and I figure the Sekhmets are tough enough to tank wounds that would normally swing at them on initiative. Other than that, is there any reason to go for force swords?

 

Also, a question on the legality of this list: the wording, IIRC, on Guard of the Crimson King is that I may not have MORE vehicles than units with the Legiones Astartes rule (which I guess to mean infantry units), and not that I must have more LA units than vehicles. Is that right? If so, then I'm covered by the former, with an even 4-4 split.

[sturguard]

Purge, why would you say rotor cannons will disappoint? I am building a Crimson King army and actually used a unit of 10 in a game this past weekend. 200 pts for 10, and they put out a ton of shots and essentially every shot you would with is a rending shot. With the shred rule is just ugly.

 

I mean lets look at it

40 shots, 27 hits. You should roll roughly 4-5 5's and 4-5 6's. With the reroll, you should get another 3 sixes and 3 5's for a total of 7-8 5's and 7-8 6's. So you are capable of wiping out a full unit of marines. Low armor vehicles are toast too- up to armor 12 and the range of 30 inches isnt bad either.

 

Also depending on the other units in your army, often the rotor cannons will be ignored over vets and terminators (which I use both of as well).

[Spiritual Liege]

How does one even damage a vehicle with a rotor cannon? Its NOT rending and its s3 so you can't even glance a rhino. And with your calculations against marines you seem to have forgot their armour save. Lets say you get that 15 wounds against a marine squad and they will save 10 of them, which results in 5 marines dead. Sure, you may wipe a recon squad, but that's about it. I'm not saying you shouldn't use them, they are cool and can be good, especially against normal 'umies, but against marines they are not very effective. Still probably building a squad

[sturguard]

Yep, I messed up, I got too far ahead of myself.

 

So you are correct, they don't rend. However, I like to use Ahriman who is level 4 Divination. I am constantly aiming to get the misfortune spell (where all hits against a particular unit rend). Rotor cannons are one of those units that really benefit from this warp charge 1 spell particularly with the shred rule from the Asphyx Shells.

 

So 40 shots, 27 hits, 9 wounds, reroll, 6 more wounds. Not too shabby at 30 inches. Now if you can cast prescience on this unit all the better. I'll be clear, rotor cannons on their own aren't very good and you don't see them in many lists, however, they are a unit that with the special ammo and some cheap spells (which lets face it takes advantage of what 1K Sons do) get pretty terrifying quickly.  Even without spells, you are still talking about 15 wounds which is 5 dead marines.

[Spiritual Liege]

Ahriman is indeed pretty good with them. If you can get that misfortune and prescience, they turn from a sub-par unit to actually proper marine killers.

[Unknown Legionnaire]

Actually, I quite like the second list, though I'd probably try to squeeze in a second chain fist on each of the Sekhmet units.

 

Rotor cannon Tac Support is neat, but one should always bring max-sized units IMHO.

[Gorgoff]

Ahriman is indeed pretty good with them. If you can get that misfortune and prescience, they turn from a sub-par unit to actually proper marine killers.

YEAH, and all that for 425 points. Cheap as fu... ehrm... whait a second! ;)