Deathwatch Leaked Rules

[Ordo Xenos Inquisitor]

Thank the Emperor for Reddit. 

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/0B4IGo22sDo4zTi13M3djTGdoZVk

I am currently reading through the details while comparing with the codex we have now.

[Prot]

Here's some point values:(no wargear)

 

Corvus: 160

Bikers 34

Termies 32

Vanguard: 21

Vets 19

Watchmaster: 130 (allows re-rolls of To Hit for all units within 6")

 

Artemis: 130 (allows re-rolls of To Hit of 1 for all units within 6")

 

Frag Cannon: 30

Shotgun: 5

Hand flamer: 8

Inferno Pistol: 20

IHB: 25

Stalker: 4

 

Heavy Hammer: 30

Xenophase blade: 7 (finally someone figured out this wasn't the Xenos kryptonite it was priced out to be.)

 

Auspex: 5

Blackstar Cluster Lanucher (0)

Combat Shield 4

Infernum Halo Launcher (5)

Storm Shield 15

 

We cannot take Combi Grav. Dreadnoughts are confided to "Deathwatch Dreadnought Weapons" (Las/Assault/Plasma cannons)

Deathwatch Captain in Terminator armour is still heavily restricted: Only change to default equipment is the Relic blade.

Deathwatch Razorback is stuck without the use of Flamers/Las/or twin Plasma.

 

+EDIT+

 

For clarity, from what I'm seeing, the Black Shields cannot take a Heavy Hammer. It is restricted to Deathwatch Vets, and Vanguard Vets.

 

Moral is punishing this edition of the game, Terminators are still allowing auto passes. (Unflinching rule.)

 

Vanguard Strike: Allows any kill team with a Vanguard Vet to "fall back" and fire just like a unit with "Fly".

 

Black Shield has Heroic Intervention.

 

Bikers basically can fall back, and charge in the same turn.

 

Teleport Homers are really interesting. Perhaps a retreat mechanism. (Before I used to use them to get max template damage which is of course a dead tactic now. ;) )

Edited May 31, 2017 by Prot

[Ordo Xenos Inquisitor]

So far, least our worries are over when it comes to one problem with the Deathwatch: the default marines can actually have the option to have a bolt pistol and chainsword. 

 

And upon looking at the Infernus Heavy Bolter, it become less attractive to take. I can assault with the flamer bit but to use the heavy bolter bit after moving would require me to roll on 5s. But I am sure it will still have it's uses. :D

[MeltaRange]

The Deathwatch Teleport Homer looks really fun.  Can't wait.

[Lysere]

Watch masters boltgun is straight up better than everyone else's, and with how the ammo works now you can get his ap to -3. Not bad at all.

 

Also regular sternguard lost their special issue ammo so now deathwatch get to have their own cool toy rather than having to share it with most chapters.

[Scurvydog]

The teleport homer is not unique for the deathwatch.

 

As I see it, I don't find much point in this version of the deathwatch.

 

Take a look at the veteran for 19 points, compare that to a primaris for 20 points.

 

It is more or less expensive space marines with extremely limited access to many toys, in return for the ability to take more special weapons on troops, thats it.

 

Even our vanguard veterans are 5 points more expensive than regular marine vanguards, just for special issue ammo on pistols (at best). 

 

Our terminators get immune to morale for 8 points more each model.

 

I don't know, I'm not too sure GW has Deathwatch on the radar as the elite force, now primaris is here.

[Ordo Xenos Inquisitor]

If there's anything I do not like is that the Deathwatch still has no access to Apothecaries nor Techmarines. C'mon! D:

[SinnerBeta]

Damn, still no special ammo for storm bolters and no sneaky sniper specialist.

 

Also is it only me or do Vets no longer have chainswords by default ? That is very concerning to me since my models were assembled as per WYISWG, bolter and chainsword together which now seems to be illegal.

EDIT: scratch that, seems I spooked myself, although it's a bit weird. You take the boltgun you can swap for two items from the DW equipment list and take a bolter with a chainsword.

Edited May 31, 2017 by SinnerBeta

[Ordo Xenos Inquisitor]

The teleport homer is not unique for the deathwatch.

 

 

 

I am looking up the leak right now, but what other force has the same mechanic as our new Teleport Homer. I am not sure how to make use of this myself as I have no bikers at the moment. 

[Ordo Xenos Inquisitor]

Damn, still no special ammo for storm bolters and no sneaky sniper specialist.

 

Also is it only me or do Vets no longer have chainswords by default ? That is very concerning to me since my models were assembled as per WYISWG, bolter and chainsword together which now seems to be illegal.

 

From what I read, yeah you can. For free no less. :D

[CrimsonReign]

whelp, my shotgun + stormshield vets are no longer valid :/

[Lysere]

While individual units got maybe a touch worse, the mixed kill team setup got a lot better. Melee heavy squad? Grab a bike and recharge enemies during your turn. Don't like morale, take a terminator. It actually feels like a simple and effective way to make the kill team do what you want.

[leth]

Yeah, teleport homers are an exclusive thing to the deathwatch now.  With no scatter they no longer serve a purpose

 

Also you still can take storm shield and shotgun, you swap your boltgun for TWO of the following.  Stormshield is in a seperate section from the may take one of the following section. 

Edited May 31, 2017 by leth

[Scurvydog]

 

The teleport homer is not unique for the deathwatch.

 

 

 

I am looking up the leak right now, but what other force has the same mechanic as our new Teleport Homer. I am not sure how to make use of this myself as I have no bikers at the moment. 

 

 

Standard terminators and assault terminators all got teleport homers. 

 

The unique aspect we get, is that a kill team with even just 1 terminator can use it.

[Scurvydog]

Yeah, teleport homers are an exclusive thing to the deathwatch now.  With no scatter they no longer serve a purpose

 

Incorrect on both accounts. Homers are now tokens, which works sort of like servo skulls, and instead of moving you can teleport the unit within 6" of the token. The token is removed if an enemy unit comes within 9" of it. 

 

It is completely different from homers before and they are available to other space marine terminators.

[mjrwaud]

whelp, my shotgun + stormshield vets are no longer valid :/

I do believe they're still valid.

 

The way the rules seem to be is you can replace the bolter with two items from the "Deathwatch equipment" list, -but- that list itself has two sections, one with "pistols / melee" and the other with "special / combi" weapons... from the way it's written it seems you can pick either two from the "pistol/melee" section or one from the "pistol/melee" and/or one from the "special/combi" section.

[Scurvydog]

whelp, my shotgun + stormshield vets are no longer valid :/

How do you figure that? Any veteran may replace their boltgun for 2 items from the deathwatch equipment list.

 

The stormshield and shotgun can both be chosen from that list without issue.

 

It also seems to be correct that you can replace a boltgun with both a chainsword and boltgun for no cost at all, which can hardly be intended, but does help out with the point cost difference compared to the numarines.

 

Seems the corvus will be by far the best option for transport, since we can't move killteams around otherwise. The BSSF would have been nice in this addition, but nope. A killteam walking around will still be suicide and tossing way too many points away, making flyers the only option.

Edited May 31, 2017 by Scurvydog

[Ordo Xenos Inquisitor]

 

 

The teleport homer is not unique for the deathwatch.

 

 

 

I am looking up the leak right now, but what other force has the same mechanic as our new Teleport Homer. I am not sure how to make use of this myself as I have no bikers at the moment. 

 

 

Standard terminators and assault terminators all got teleport homers. 

 

The unique aspect we get, is that a kill team with even just 1 terminator can use it.

 

 

 

Ah, I see. Looking at it now and I do see what you mean. 

 

But yeah, with that aspect alone, I can still find value in it. I just need to see how to put it into practice. 

[Ordo Xenos Inquisitor]

While individual units got maybe a touch worse, the mixed kill team setup got a lot better. Melee heavy squad? Grab a bike and recharge enemies during your turn. Don't like morale, take a terminator. It actually feels like a simple and effective way to make the kill team do what you want.

 

I agree. I think we can make the most out of this! :D

[leth]

You are correct, my mistake on the teleport homers. I just breezed over the other sections.

Still, Shotguns seem legit with the options, especially with overwatch. It seems like we can use the teleport homers to get out of combat as well without counting as falling back. Hummmm so excited!!!!

Need to start pointing things out but our veterans are 19 points base since boltguns are free.

Also holy those frag cannons!!! Nicee........

Also FINE I will buy some corvus blackstars jeez. Nice that units dont auto die from fliers any more than regular transports now. Its a nice change.

Edited May 31, 2017 by leth

[Moostick]

Hmm, can't say I'm happy about this.

 

Pros:

- I was wrong and Vets can indeed take combi weapons! But do we keep SIA?

- Corvus is fairly "cheap" considering the general increase in costs

- Veterans are 19 pts even after weapons

- HTH is still boss

 

Cons (sigh):

- NO reduction in points for giving up SIA while paying a higher flat rate for SIA

- FIVE points extra for SIA? Are you kidding me, GW?

- have doubts we are viable as a standalone army

- stalkers for 4 pts and no sniper? Not sure if worth it just for 6" range and an extra shot at range.

- shotguns for 5 pts? Garbage.

- no new heavy support. Crutch with list building

- no new HQ

- no new options period

- FC and IHB are 30 and 25 points

- Storm shields are 15 points for us, so our Vanguard suck even more.

- I'm sure there's more

 

I had some faith in GW, but we got shafted hard.

[Kargrym]

Thoughts....

 

Xenophase is now only 7 so thats nice, wish it was D3 like power weapons though, then it would be auto include.

 

only Vanguard can take Heavy Thunder Hammer, which is crap as it is only in the kill team box of vets. it also got worse in that it is str x2 instead of str 10. should also be moral wounds on a 6+ instead of 6 damage on a roll of 6.

 

I am a bit upset that all our tactics are gone for rerolling wounds and reroll hits is only with a watch master or captain. >:(

 

Xenopurge on a shotgun is nice that it does 2 dmg

 

Stalker pattern boltgun DOES NOT HAVE SNIPER!!! almost useless compared to a normal boltgun.

 

Teleport homer for free will be an auto include but all that give me is a free retreat. I don't know how that is good.

 

Black shields are useless you want "2 sergeants". USELESS!!!!

 

While its nice that the watch master is cheaper, he is boring as hell.

 

Overall, I would not exactly call this a good ruleset for us. I hope they come up with a stand alone codex soon that gives us more.

 

Its going to take a while to figure out how to make this work. I think the real power is in the section Mixed Unit that adds the respective Terminator, Bikes, Jumpack keywords. 

 

I think that means that is you have a terminator, the whole group gets Teleport Strike. Add a bike and the unit gets turbo boost of 6" on advancing. No bonus yet on jumpack I would assume because no keyword vanguard veteran.

[Ordo Xenos Inquisitor]

You are correct, my mistake on the teleport homers. I just breezed over the other sections.

Still, Shotguns seem legit with the options, especially with overwatch. It seems like we can use the teleport homers to get out of combat as well without counting as falling back. Hummmm so excited!!!!

Need to start pointing things out but our veterans are 19 points base since boltguns are free.

Also holy those frag cannons!!! Nicee........

Also FINE I will buy some corvus blackstars jeez. Nice that units dont auto die from fliers any more than regular transports now. Its a nice change.

Speaking of which, a friend bought a Corvus Blackstar on my behalf. That baby will be my crown jewel. :)

[Ordo Xenos Inquisitor]

Hmm, can't say I'm happy about this.

 

Pros:

- I was wrong and Vets can indeed take combi weapons! But do we keep SIA?

- Corvus is fairly "cheap" considering the general increase in costs

- Veterans are 19 pts even after weapons

- HTH is still boss

 

Cons (sigh):

- NO reduction in points for giving up SIA while paying a higher flat rate for SIA

- FIVE points extra for SIA? Are you kidding me, GW?

- have doubts we are viable as a standalone army

- stalkers for 4 pts and no sniper? Not sure if worth it just for 6" range and an extra shot at range.

- shotguns for 5 pts? Garbage.

- no new heavy support. Crutch with list building

- no new HQ

- no new options period

- FC and IHB are 30 and 25 points

- Storm shields are 15 points for us, so our Vanguard suck even more.

- I'm sure there's more

 

I had some faith in GW, but we got shafted hard.

 

Let's remember that in this edition, we should expect more updates to come to balance the game. Plus, if taking a leaf from AoS, we may expect Battletomes for Space Marines providing additional weaponry in the future. However, how long that would take, we will never know. That being said, I think what is offered is at least better. 

[MeltaRange]

I think one thing to keep in mind is the FACTION section on Page 240 of the rulebook.  This means we can really take ANY Imperium unit in the same detachment...so you can add Predators, Centurons, Inquisitors, whatever to your army and fill in the "gaps".