Thinking of starting a new BA army

[Brother Talarian]

Hello Brothers,

 

I've been tempted to starting a new army to join your ranks, though I'm in the fence between BA and BT. I like the melee aspect of both armies. I'll post this somewhere in the BT forums as well to get both opinions.

 

1. Based on what you've seen of 8th (early I know I'll ask later as well) and experience in 7th. What should some standard first buys be? BA feel but functional

 

2. What might a typical army look like? 1,500 points ish. (Just so I know how much I'll need to invest, right budget ATM)

 

3. What are some of your glorious moments/why do you recommend (or not? :/) this army.

 

Thanks in advance

[NTaW]

1. No matter the army, the models you think are cool. If I was starting brand new I would probably grab the Death Company box set (if it's still available) as it offered 15 models with a Chaplain and a Dreadnought, and you could build them up whatever way makes you happy.

 

2. This one varies. I'd wager you couldn't go wrong with you HQ of choice attached to the Elites you like (Priest and Sanguinary Guard or Astorath and Death Company for example) and a couple Tactical squads to get you going. Add Dreadnoughts, tanks, or Elites to your liking after that.

 

Though 8th has a lot of easy to use Detachments...you could go full on Elites if you wanted (*looks longingly at his dust covered Deathwing army)

 

3. I once charged a stupid deathstar unit of a SM Command Squad, whole Libby Conclave, GK Libby, and Draigo with a full DC unit with Chaplain as well as Dante, a Priest, and an Assault squad. The movement gods were on my side all game and I rolled as many dice as an Ork player that fight. It was friggin' glorious.

 

As a BA devotee since 1st ed. Space Hulk I would recommend this army on character alone, though it looks like in 8th we'll stand a hell of a lot better overall than in 7th regarding rules.

[Quixus]

I would wait till BA get full support. Not only to have a better idea what you could buy, but also to show GW that you are not putting up with how they are treating that faction. Many SM units are not available to us and GW even blatantly lied in their FAQ claiming that all units from 7th edition are still playable. That is not the case.

[Silverson]

good luck in finding your next army dude which ever way you go with it. i dont know a great deal about black templars as i never play against them but her are my thoughts on blood angels.

 

1- As with all space marine armies the defacto units to get would be an hq and tactical squads, from what I have seen so far(in its very limited capacity) this is not the case in eighth and there are detachments out the for just about everyone to play what they enjoy, so get a list of units you like the look of and are decent and find the detachment that best suits them. im currently favouring the vanguard detachment because i'm a sanguinary guard/ Sanguinor guy myself. but be aware that when our codex arrives we may get benefits that could make it worth bringing in other units to make the most out of the army.

 

2- this can vary allot but i firmly believe that for blood angels this edition is going to revolve around synergistic units and buffs from characters to allow us to hit hard and have staying power in combats to outlast our enemies (shield of Sanguinius and sanguinary priests are good examples of this)

 

as for a list, last night i tried a list around two squads of sanguinary guard, the sanguinor, mephiston,corbulo  supported by two assault squads, three tactical squads with two rhinos and a storm raven at 2k points from now on will probably be dropping the tactical squads and bringing a sniper scout squad or one tac squad so i can bring more other units, maybe some heavy firepower.

 

3- in my game last night i had a glorious moment (even tho it was a poor decision tactically and i paid the price for it). it was against space wolves and turn one he put his flyer(with wolfen) and his fenrisian wolves right in front of me so i had a decent chance of killing them.

 

my turn one(on my far left i pushed up with a squad of assault marines, the sanguinor and a unit of sanguinary guard to kill the fenresion wolves with the idea of charging, killing them and consolidating so the my assault marines would bare the brunt of the counter charge from logan on storm rider. i then slightly to the right of my other units brought my storm raven into the sights of his flyer along with the second squad of sanguinary guard, assault marines, mephiston and corbulo (sat neatly in the middle to splash out buffs to all the units(but he wiffed his run move and was woefully short after he failed his charge). all went fine on the left side and the fenrisin wolves got slaughtered. but on my right(ish) side everything went pear shape and the following happened.

 

i charged all my units into the stormfang and surrounded it assuming i would consolidate after killing it to once again let my assault marines take the counter charge and encircle the wolfen that come from the wreckage so they did not have enough space to deploy. but with and insane amount of attacks thanks to the sanguinor in total buffnig around 20 models, and even worse dice rolls i ended up taking the storm fang down to 7 wounds only and leaving myself in a world of pain.

 

next came the counter charge i was expecting the one from logan and a squad of wolfen into my assault squads but didnt realise that the wulfen in his surrounded storm fan manged to deploy 3" away from the nose of the vehicle while it was surrounded and still be an inch away from me and then fly off.the resulting scenario meant that i was charged from my top left by logan, from the right by a squad of wolfen and now from my rear by a second squad of wolfen right into my sanguinary guard and mephiston. all the while kepping my sanguinor out of his possible 3" heroic intervention.

 

It had the visual of an old weston shootout where and convoy of horse and carts were in a circle surrounded on all side by outlaws but in this case it was logan and 2 squads of wolfen all encircling all my units and he got all the charges. 

 

this also meant that all my units were getting plus 1 attack from the sanguinor all over the place and one of my assault squads had a 4++ from mephiston. the next 3 fight phases were carnage and so full of good and bad dice rolls (including mephiston smashing down three wolfen with storm shields in one round of combat and surveing with one wound after his death frenzy attacks back, and the sanguinor charging logan and getting 2 d3 damage wounds on him rollin 1s for the damage leaving logan on 1hp to turn around and slay him in one round of combat.

 

but alas in the end getting charged by possibly the most devastating cc unit in the imperium and a chapter master proved to much and after the third combat phase i was hanging in by a thread. if only Corbulo made it into the same bubble that the sanguinor had got into giving plus 1 strength to all them attacks and bringing models back then i actually think i would of had a chance.

 

its was one of the most brutal combats i have seen in a long time and a complete slaughter fest on both sides.

[durdle-durdle]

I would wait till BA get full support. Not only to have a better idea what you could buy, but also to show GW that you are not putting up with how they are treating that faction. Many SM units are not available to us and GW even blatantly lied in their FAQ claiming that all units from 7th edition are still playable. That is not the case.

Wait, which units disappeared?

[Quixus]

Assault Squads with meltaguns

[durdle-durdle]

Assault Squads with meltaguns

Assault squads still exist, and if you want jump pack special weapons, just put a coat of gold on their head and call them company vets. You can even take an entire squad of 5 guys with jump packs and meltas if you'd like.

[Quixus]

 

Assault Squads with meltaguns

Assault squads still exist, and if you want jump pack special weapons, just put a coat of gold on their head and call them company vets. You can even take an entire squad of 5 guys with jump packs and meltas if you'd like.

 

That's not the point. I know that I could run them as Vanguard Veterans. I am disappointed in GW's practice of nerfing the BA again, a faction that didn't need nerfing for three editions.

[durdle-durdle]

 

 

 

Assault Squads with meltaguns

Assault squads still exist, and if you want jump pack special weapons, just put a coat of gold on their head and call them company vets. You can even take an entire squad of 5 guys with jump packs and meltas if you'd like.

That's not the point. I know that I could run them as Vanguard Veterans. I am disappointed in GW's practice of nerfing the BA again, a faction that didn't need nerfing for three editions.

You know who else lost assault marines with meltas? Literally every other chapter. You know who can take jump pack company vets with special weapons? Literally just us. "Blood angels" weren't nerfed. Space marines as a whole were, and so was pretty much everything in every codex. You know what it's called when everybody thinks their codes is bad, (so they're on par with each other). Balance!

[Spagunk]

 

You know who else lost assault marines with meltas? Literally every other chapter. You know who can take jump pack company vets with special weapons? Literally just us. "Blood angels" weren't nerfed. Space marines as a whole were, and so was pretty much everything in every codex. You know what it's called when everybody thinks their codes is bad, (so they're on par with each other). Balance!

 

 

I still think you are missing his point.

[Quixus]

You know who else lost assault marines with meltas? Literally every other chapter.

Please look at the SM codex again. Assault marines in 7th edition could only take flamers or plasma pistols, not meltaguns. It was one of our unique abilities.

You know who can take jump pack company vets with special weapons? Literally just us.

There shouldn't even be any company veterans in the Blood Angels, they are a (mostly) codex adherent chapter. The Veterans are supposed to be confined to the 1st Company, not spread around other companies. That is a DA thing.

Additionally what other chapters get or don't get has little to do with what is removed from the BA.

 

"Blood angels" weren't nerfed. Space marines as a whole were, and so was pretty much everything in every codex. You know what it's called when everybody thinks their codes is bad, (so they're on par with each other). Balance!

So how are BA on par with other chapters when their only flyer is the stormraven, they do not get a transport for their scouts and cannot have centurions. I know you can field all those units in a detachment containing BA units, but contrary to other chapters doing so  prevents all abilities working off the Blood Angels keyword from having an effect. Ultramarines for example do not have that problem.

 

Think what you wish about "balance", my suggestion stands:

Wait with any purchase until a proper codex is released, do not support the treatment of our chapter

[Brother Talarian]

M-my thread... it was hijacked.

 

 

EDIT: Thank you for the initial posts gentlemen. I will likely wait it out a bit to see what 8th has to bring for SM. Perhaps it was a bad time to post. I'll resurrect the thread in a few weeks time. 

[Helias_Tancred]

 

 

 

Assault Squads with meltaguns

Assault squads still exist, and if you want jump pack special weapons, just put a coat of gold on their head and call them company vets. You can even take an entire squad of 5 guys with jump packs and meltas if you'd like.

That's not the point. I know that I could run them as Vanguard Veterans. I am disappointed in GW's practice of nerfing the BA again, a faction that didn't need nerfing for three editions.

You know who else lost assault marines with meltas? Literally every other chapter. You know who can take jump pack company vets with special weapons? Literally just us. "Blood angels" weren't nerfed. Space marines as a whole were, and so was pretty much everything in every codex. You know what it's called when everybody thinks their codes is bad, (so they're on par with each other). Balance!

 

 

You don't know Blood Angels very well do you?

[durdle-durdle]

 

You know who else lost assault marines with meltas? Literally every other chapter.

Please look at the SM codex again. Assault marines in 7th edition could only take flamers or plasma pistols, not meltaguns. It was one of our unique abilities.

You know who can take jump pack company vets with special weapons? Literally just us.

There shouldn't even be any company veterans in the Blood Angels, they are a (mostly) codex adherent chapter. The Veterans are supposed to be confined to the 1st Company, not spread around other companies. That is a DA thing.

Additionally what other chapters get or don't get has little to do with what is removed from the BA.

"Blood angels" weren't nerfed. Space marines as a whole were, and so was pretty much everything in every codex. You know what it's called when everybody thinks their codes is bad, (so they're on par with each other). Balance!

So how are BA on par with other chapters when their only flyer is the stormraven, they do not get a transport for their scouts and cannot have centurions. I know you can field all those units in a detachment containing BA units, but contrary to other chapters doing so prevents all abilities working off the Blood Angels keyword from having an effect. Ultramarines for example do not have that problem.

 

Think what you wish about "balance", my suggestion stands:

Wait with any purchase until a proper codex is released, do not support the treatment of our chapter

Fair enough, I wasn't aware that was a blood angels only thing. I've only ever played chaos marines and blood angels, and both could do that, so I assumed everyone could.

 

Do you get upset when people throw a unit of terminators in with the rest of their army? That must make games very hard for you. I have a good friend who mixes tactical marines and deathwing (the fluff murderer that he is!)

 

Blood angels also don't get thunderwolves, nephillim jet fighters, or chaos spawn. I don't care about getting things from codex marines, because I don't play them. We have different stuff to set us apart.

[Jolemai]

Play nice gentlemen.

[tychobi]

This may come as a bit of heresy but Space Marines is Space Marines.  Shooty or Dakka BA BT you are getting space marines outside of very limited snowflake units.  My 2 cents is to not pick the rules set you want to go with too early and to create a unique chapter that can use the rules that make you happy game to game.  So the important choice has been made; Space Marines.  The remaining choice is the color of their armor.  The flavor of their zealotry for the emperor can wait/change.  

 

As for specific models I would start with what you think looks cool.  8th has made a strides toward overall balance, so it would be unlikely to pick a bum unit off the shelf.  You will get no clear answers for at least a couple of months  as to what units are "OP" or "not worth".  It will be a learning curve to optimize the use of any unit on the table and synergy with your force will take time and knowledge.  

 

Sooooo. . . at least for now?  RULE OF COOL!