8th Edition Arsenal

[balordazul]

I think the hammer and fist issue will be FAQ'd and points will change.  It is not good for game balance seeing that will also impact CSM players that don't have this option.  

 

Until then there really is no choice unless you feel that GW will limit hammers again or change the pricing of something.  

 

Oh heck did anyone else notice that the eviscerator is 22 points and it is a power first but has a -4AP.  Someone needs to slap a GW intern with a math book.  

Edited June 13, 2017 by balordazul

[Acebaur]

Eviscerator still isn't worth it's points, even more so now in 8th than in 7th. At least in 7th you got an extra attack on the charge. Now you are paying 22 points for a weapon on a 1 attack 1 wound guy, more than doubling his points cost. Not worth it

[Lysere]

Eviscerator still isn't worth it's points, even more so now in 8th than in 7th. At least in 7th you got an extra attack on the charge. Now you are paying 22 points for a weapon on a 1 attack 1 wound guy, more than doubling his points cost. Not worth it

About the only use for it would be if the sergeant can still take it, even then he could just take a hammer if he has the option.

 

Again main thing with the fists is not all models get the option, and of them characters still pay more for them which is where it matters.

[balordazul]

I think you can add it to the sergeant but still I'm not sure that it is just better to give that model a Thunder hammer over an Eviscerator.  

 

So I did the math and on vs singe wound MEQ does things like Eviscerator and Chain Fist win out over the Thunder Hammer.  With that noted the difference in % chance is not much when you start get spread other toughnesses.  Yes the -4ap is better than -3ap when dealing with at least 3+ armor but the static 3 damage makes me feel that the thunder hammer still wins over the chain fist that 2 points more than the hammer. 

 

Power Fist vs Chain Fist for a 2 point difference a Chain Fist is a auto when it is a option.  

 

GW most likely needs to make a Character cost power fist and a model cost power fist like the Thunder hammer.  

[Castellan Doren]

I knew there was a reason i couldn't bring myself to put a eviscerator on a model.

[Acebaur]

Turns out you can put an eviscerator on the sgt, which would be the only place for it to go. The only time it's going to be better than a hammer is against 1 wound MEQ where it's slightly better AP gives you a small advantage, but certainly not worth more points than Hammer. If they had made it where you don't take the -1 on it then it might have been worth taking, but as it is a hammer is just a better choice. 

[Gendo]

Tell me again why aren't we taking a Stormraven Gunship over the LRC.

 

It's cheaper with more firepower and can deliver a Dreadnought, as i understand it on turn one.

[Stemplar]

Yeah ... seems like the Stormraven is suddenly awesome again. Now we can decide when to bring it in.

[Lysere]

Tell me again why aren't we taking a Stormraven Gunship over the LRC.

 

It's cheaper with more firepower and can deliver a Dreadnought, as i understand it on turn one.

Because a storm raven can't do mortal wounds on the charge, that and I don't have three storm ravens.

[Acebaur]

The Raven can't start in reserves, it must start on the table. Only certain units can start in reserve now. 

 

It can carry a Dreadnought but can't deliver it on turn one, at least not outside of your deployment. You disembark at the beginning of your movement phase now. 

 

Yes the Raven is cheaper but remember it's also less durable. T7 14W 3+ vs T8 16W 2+ It does have Hard to Hit but flying restricts it's movement. Just something to keep in mind. 

[ThatOneMarshal]

Tell me again why aren't we taking a Stormraven Gunship over the LRC.

 

It's cheaper with more firepower and can deliver a Dreadnought, as i understand it on turn one.

Careful there, your making it sound like the LRC isn't the most powerful thing to grace the battlefield aside from the emperor, which is heresy :D.

 

To be serious though the raven seems to definetly have gotten better but don't misunderestimate the power of T 8. With T 7 a whole bunch of weapons have an easier time wounding you, if they can hit you of course.

[Gendo]

http://www.3plusplus.net/2017/06/space-marine-weapon-options-8th-edition-warhammer-40k/

 

Math about all ranged weapons.

[Marshal Mattias]

I'm gonna go on record to say that it seems all special pistols are pretty awesome in this edition. Having that plasma shot in combat was a massive boon for my opponents Sister Superiors in my most recent games. Power weapons are a little bit dead, unless you can find the re-rolls to make their limited attacks count. Hand flamers are still outrageously good in multiples, and the inferno pistol is ludicrous, as its damage potential is super high even against non-vehicle targets.

 

Assault cannons are great, and devastating versus T3 enemies with the sheer volume of shots. I ran them on a razorback and had great success against infantry. Just remember that they aren't nearly as effective against light vehicles - your chances of that last holy shot that finishes of a vehicle are much lower than before.

 

I found my flamers to be greatly reduced - in situations where I would have racked up 20 hits at least last edition, I was rolling up 4 on 2D6... and they are no longer as good at deleting those lighter troops from cover. Delivery is also tougher, as the Pods are far more restricted in their landing options and much more expensive to boot.

 

My razorback felt much more robust than previously, and being able to charge the EC out from it was awesome, letting me run a decent assault-focussed list in just 500 points.

[Aqui]

As the good Marshall's opponent, I can attest to the effectiveness of the AC Razorback. It took out six Retributor Sisters in one go, leaving the last by herself :lol: However, watch out for a Canoness with an Inferno Pistol ;)

[Acebaur]

Yeah the special pistols are a deal now, able to still function in CC. 

 

For special weapons, I'm finding it hard to find a reason to take a gravgun over a plasma gun.  The grav can do extra damage against 3+ targets, but it's not guaranteed and the plasma is better in all other respects. It has better strength, range and the same AP. It can also be supercharged for extra damage if need be. 

[Marshal Arthur]

Has anyone seen the article on the new marines? The Reavers look cool (I refuse to use the other spelling), but I can't help but wonder if they'll get any special primaris chainsword units. More importantly, however, GW clearly asserted the Templar stance on witches which I was quite grateful for.

[Acebaur]

We are discussing it in the primaris thread ;)