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So what do the BA players think of the Relic Contemptor?

Ishagu

By Ishagu
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Ishagu

Ishagu

Posted
Posted

I know you guys were unhappy about not getting access to the regular SM Contemptor, but the FW book has made rules available for the Relic variant which is superior.

12 wounds, access to more weapon options, the 9" movement is not reduced as it takes damage, 5+ invul...

 

A variant with a Kheres, CC weapon and Storm Bolter is 200 points.

Fidelius Animo Novitiate

Fidelius Animo

Posted
Posted

So fun fact, unless I missed it in the Forgeworld book, there is nothing explicitly stating that Blood Angels can take any of the FW models.

 

 

 

I'm more interested, at least fluff wise in the Chaplain Dread. I mean I'm sad it can't get the Magna Grapple but it's got some nice chaplain themes buffs

Jolemai Venerable Brother

Jolemai

Posted
Posted

So fun fact, unless I missed it in the Forgeworld book, there is nothing explicitly stating that Blood Angels can take any of the FW models.

 

 

As far as I'm aware, the <CHAPTER> keyword covers that, no? Is there something which says we can't take them?

Jolemai Venerable Brother

Jolemai

Posted
Posted

I just got a Contemptor Dread so I hope we can use it!

 

To use the Contemptor Mortis as an example, it has the following keywords: IMPERIUM, ADEPTUS ASTARTES, <CHAPTER>

 

According to Index: Imperium 1 where we see <CHAPTER> we exchange it for Blood Angels. There's absolutely no way we cannot use these.

Fidelius Animo Novitiate

Fidelius Animo

Posted
Posted (edited)

 

 

So fun fact, unless I missed it in the Forgeworld book, there is nothing explicitly stating that Blood Angels can take any of the FW models.

 

As far as I'm aware, the <CHAPTER> keyword covers that, no? Is there something which says we can't take them?
Pg 89 Index Imperium Vol 1

 

BLOOD ANGELS CHAPTER

The following Space Marines datasheets can be from the Blood Angels Chapter. Those that are replace the <CHAPTER> keyword on their datasheet in all instances with BLOOD ANGELS. If a Space Marines unit does not appear on the list below, it cannot be from the Blood Angels Chapter, and so cannot have the BLOOD ANGELS Faction keyword. BLOOD ANGELS PSYKERS generate their psychic powers from the Sanguinary discipline (below) instead of the Librarius discipline

 

 

The relevant rule is highlighted. There is nothing in Imperial Armor Index: forces of the Adeptus Astartes that over rules this, the joys of RAW.

 

 

 

coincidentally, this final rule of the section also means that Successor chapters don't according to RAW get access to Sanguinary Discipline

Edited by Fidelius Animo
Arkhanist Venerable Brother

Arkhanist

Posted
Posted (edited)

All the non-codex marine armies (SW,DA,DW,BA,GK) have the restrictions that they can only take from 'x' list of detachments datasheets. You *could* argue that the new datasheets are added to both the standard list and every restriction list with the way the forgeworld book is worded. It seems very unlikely that they'd intentionally ban all forgeword units from all non-codex armies (including lucius pods!) given they all had access to almost all of them previously. The 'relic' limit is still in, presumably? (haven't got the forgeworld book yet)

 

I still know a couple of people that refuse to play against any forgeworld units anyway. I guess just treat it like that if someone really wants to complain that BA (or anyone non codex) can't take forgeworld units.

 

Personally, I want to get a look at HB tarantulas/rapiers - I'm thinking they might be quite nice for cheap denying deep strike/significant dakka against hordes respectively.

Edited by Arkhanist
The4thHorseman Venerable Brother

The4thHorseman

Posted
Posted (edited)

Relic simply means you can't have more "relic" stuff than regular stuff per battlefield role.

 

That makes litterally ALL of the RELIC LOW units useless. Because you need at least 2 NON RELIC LOW to take a RELIC LOW.

Edited by The4thHorseman
Jolemai Venerable Brother

Jolemai

Posted
Posted

How is this different from the rules for Cerastus Knights from seventh edition? Only people were running them as one Cerastus alongside on Imperial Knight.

 

I think it's the same so should only require two LoW slots in your army - so take the SHV Detachment or run multiple Detachments. It's obviously for big games only.

Brother_Angelus Veteran

Brother_Angelus

Posted
Posted (edited)

Just bought the SM fw index on iBooks and I'm not seeing anything anywhere that even mentions space marine chapters at all in the context of what we can use. Obviously this seems like an oversight but it is odd.

Every unit entry has the <CHAPTER> keyword. Index 1 says you simply put the name of your chapter in there to designate it's chapter. The issue is perceived to be that there is no list of units available to the less-than-codex-compliant chapters, like there is in the Imperial Index 1.

 

So at this stage we either get access to all of it, which would be great, or none of it, which would make no sense and lose us multiple choices which were previously available. There'll either need to be an errata providing lists of units and which chapters they can be fielded by, or a simple FAQ to say "anything with <CHAPTER> can be taken by any chapter". Hopefully soon.

 

I'm liking the chaplain dreadnought, the THawk and the contemptors. Just wondering if an 800pt flyer is sensible at 2000pts...

Edited by Brother_Angelus
Xenith Venerable Brother

Xenith

Posted
Posted

Unfortunately I'm in the camp of bad rules writing. If the FW doesn't nsay that Blood Angels can take the unit, then they can't. Permissive ruleset and all.

 

BA section of Index 1 is very clear about the list of stuff that can be <CHAPTER BLOOD ANGELS> and FW units aren't on there.

 

We can still use them, just not as BLOOD ANGELS, same as stormtalons, hawks, hunters etc.

Cleon Venerable Brother

Cleon

Posted
Posted

How is this different from the rules for Cerastus Knights from seventh edition? Only people were running them as one Cerastus alongside on Imperial Knight.

 

I think it's the same so should only require two LoW slots in your army - so take the SHV Detachment or run multiple Detachments. It's obviously for big games only.

Admittedly I've not seen every page of the FW index and thanks to a mildly inefficient webstore I don't have the full rulebook yet, so I'm having to assume there are no more detachments I've missed, but it appears the problem is as follows:

  • Relic means you must have one 'non relic' per relic in the same slot in the same Detachment to take a relic.
  • The only available LoW slots in a detachment are either a single optional slot (so can't use a relic) or a minimum of three, so you must take two non relic LoW to get a relic LoW on the table.

It feels to me FW either didn't pick up on a late change in the Detachments available, meant Relic to apply over a force instead of a detachment and used the wrong word, or just got the rules wrong.

Morticon Venerable Brother

Morticon

Posted
Posted

 

Relic simply means you can't have more "relic" stuff than regular stuff per battlefield role.

 

That makes litterally ALL of the RELIC LOW units useless. Because you need at least 2 NON RELIC LOW to take a RELIC LOW.

 

 

1. 

 

Not 2.  

 

Need one of each. 

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