Post-release roundtable: what worked? what didn't?

[Charlo]

 

Really eager to get a block of shooty terminators and a terminator captain with Deep strike, with the 4 shot storm bolters, more shots on assault cannons and re-rolls they should prove a really hardly block of infantry in a flank.

 

Drop Dante or a TDA captain in close to them for those sweet sweet rerolls. 10 TDA dropping 12 away with 2x asscans or CML's rerolling all misses will be fun.

 

I've got too many TDA captains so will use one of them!

 

One is Karlaen with TH SS, one is the Space Hulk captain but with a LC TH instead of the shield...

 

Then I've got that limited one from recently with the Storm Bolter, Fist & grenade launcher - may convert him to a combi plas for a fair bit of dakka...

[Xenith]

 

 

Really eager to get a block of shooty terminators and a terminator captain with Deep strike, with the 4 shot storm bolters, more shots on assault cannons and re-rolls they should prove a really hardly block of infantry in a flank.

 

Drop Dante or a TDA captain in close to them for those sweet sweet rerolls. 10 TDA dropping 12 away with 2x asscans or CML's rerolling all misses will be fun.

 

 

I've got too many TDA captains so will use one of them!

 

One is Karlaen with TH SS, one is the Space Hulk captain but with a LC TH instead of the shield...

 

Then I've got that limited one from recently with the Storm Bolter, Fist & grenade launcher - may convert him to a combi plas for a fair bit of dakka...

 

What Black Magic did you use to get that model? I'd love it!

 

Storm bolter or combi plasma on the captain is probably a good call on that unit to add to the firepower. You can also give him a fist with the grenade launcher for more shooting.

 

Actually, that's the next model I'll be making!

[BossSauce]

 

Really eager to get a block of shooty terminators and a terminator captain with Deep strike, with the 4 shot storm bolters, more shots on assault cannons and re-rolls they should prove a really hardly block of infantry in a flank.

 

 

Drop Dante or a TDA captain in close to them for those sweet sweet rerolls. 10 TDA dropping 12 away with 2x asscans or CML's rerolling all misses will be fun.

Played a 60ish or so power point game where I dropped the tactical TDA from Space Hulk and Karlean against Nids. They absolutely chewed through a 25-30 gaunt squad and put a few wounds on a monster with leftover shots, but after the drop kinda didn't do anything. He had the big bug (biovore comes to mind but I think those are the smaller ones) that shot twice doing 2D per... They dropped fast. I had two AssCan Razors with tacticals paired with them, next time I would bring more tanks or other threats to help those termies out a bit.

[Charlo]

 

 

 

Really eager to get a block of shooty terminators and a terminator captain with Deep strike, with the 4 shot storm bolters, more shots on assault cannons and re-rolls they should prove a really hardly block of infantry in a flank.

 

Drop Dante or a TDA captain in close to them for those sweet sweet rerolls. 10 TDA dropping 12 away with 2x asscans or CML's rerolling all misses will be fun.

 

 

I've got too many TDA captains so will use one of them!

 

One is Karlaen with TH SS, one is the Space Hulk captain but with a LC TH instead of the shield...

 

Then I've got that limited one from recently with the Storm Bolter, Fist & grenade launcher - may convert him to a combi plas for a fair bit of dakka...

 

What Black Magic did you use to get that model? I'd love it!

 

Storm bolter or combi plasma on the captain is probably a good call on that unit to add to the firepower. You can also give him a fist with the grenade launcher for more shooting.

 

Actually, that's the next model I'll be making!

 

A friend of mine was gracious enough to pick one up for me as his local store got refreshed so was selling them! Going to give him a helm. I've got the old metal terminator he's based on too... Aha!

 

Two Bolter shots, two (maybe overcharged) plasma shots and D3 grenades should do some work, plus he can still punch things.

[Blindhamster]

I need that shiney new birthday captain... I really want to know what full primaris rules will be like - options etc. Apparently the birthday one has its own data slate that will hopefully be decent.

 

Master crafted plasma pistol maybe??

[BaldrickRSA]

Twin Ass cannons are Heavy 12, Str 6......very nice. Three Baal Preds with HB side sponsons, a few razorbacks with Ass cannons and tac squads, and two squads DC with JPs and Astorath, and maybe a priest and librarian as well. Need to check the points. Ass cannon massive supprisive fire, move forward and fire everything, providing cover for assault units until they are able to jump and assault.....but I love those Twin ass cannons......lots of Heavy 12...........

 

And a Vindicare Assassin....dying to use my new mini....lol

 

Just a thought.........

Edited June 22, 2017 by BaldrickRSA

[BossSauce]

Tried the terminator deep striking thing again, worked very well this time against Ad Mech.

Had karlean, 2 squads of tactical termites, and a squad of inceptors all drop in into a lieutenants bubble as well (Lieutenant ran up with 2 ass can razors with tacticals and a dakka Baal pred).

Really secured me mid field so he had to play around me, was able to score objectives and prevent him from scoring his. Would definately recommend, though Seth rocking in one of the razors would have been better.

[Bartali]

Big win for me over the weekend was Rhino's. They absorb soo much fire power allowing you to set up turn two charges. Then they interupt the enemy with their own assault charges.

 

Death Company Dread with a 6 inch consolodate move was clutch after being deposited by storm raven on other side of board.

 

Seth Seth Seth! Loved him. He is now at the atrongest he has ever been. Great force multiplier.

 

On the more blah side was tac marines. Did little damage but they did tie up units for a couple of turns.

 

Baal Preds where best used assaulting other tanks rather than using their fire power. I think Razor Backs would be more efficient.

 

Company Ancient did not come into play at all. I think I would rather pay points for Sang Ancient to deep strike in turn two to help with wound rolls.

 

Spot on. Dropping jumpers turn1 hoping for a charge is suicide. 

Advance Rhinos/Twin HF Razors/Flamestorm Baals up the table turn 1 to set up for your jumpers dropping in turn 2. Fluffed charge rolls aren't so bad if your vehicles are tying up your opponents units.

 

I don't think jump BA work without vehicles

[Morticon]

One of the other nice things with JP company vets is that you can also take them in a min unit size of 2 (sgt gets combi, troops combi or special) - so you could take multiple small units with no other upgrades bar maybe storm shield (and drop them apart from each other) - make it that much harder for them all to be taken out after they drop. 

 

 

 

The problem with this is that you're upping your unit count which means you're likely to go second in an edition that is gearing towards heavy hitting alpha strikes! ><

[Drunken Angel]

Played another game tonight, my regular opponent is one of the the top rated Eldar/Aeldari/Dark elder players in NZ.  We played 2000 points against a mixed Harlequin/Eldar list.

I was seized on which dd not not help.

More things to take away

Company Veterans with combi-melta and storm shields are very very good.  Blew up two of his Ravengers on the deep strike drop and very hard to shift.   Jamming a flamer on the Sgt is good for overwatch.  

I put a thunderhammer on the Sanguinary Priest  with Jump Pack I sent with the Vets and he pounded on vehicles and anything else very nicely as a follow up to the melta strike.

Lemartes pulled off his own charge on a re-roll and a command points re-roll charge roll for the DC with hammers got me 3 out of 5 charges on the drop.

I took a Culexus Assassin.  This little SOB is a total PITA to shift and will be very nasty against marines (he ignore armour saves).  In a whole game the Harlies did not manage to wound him over three rounds combat.   Have him hang around a psyker to mess up the opponents rolls. 

Snipers scouts are still solid.

I like Razorbacks over Baals very handy to be able to jam a unit in the back for protection from dakka. 

[dread05]

Anyone tried a company ancient yet? That did you arm him with? 

[MinamotoKansuke]

Just to share my pain...

 

No matter how much "volume of dice" you think is on your side,

DO NOT

I repeat

DO NOT

charge your DC into storm shield terminators.

You will bounce right off and get smashed into the ground pronto. Even with Lemartes re-rolls and Priest strength buff :)

 

Also worth mentioning since it's available for us - mixed terminator squads are insane.

5 shields to tank all the wounds and 5 claws to slice stuff back is REALLY hard to deal with.

Even though we're a close combat oriented army I came to the conclusion there is no good way to deal with them in close combat, period.

Volume of dice = multiple models with little toughness and wounds (MEQ) = claws will shred you.

High strength, high toughness, multiple damage = not enough attacks, hammers will pop you

In theory lots of power fists or glaives encarmine (thanks to D3) could do the trick, but it's way too expensive and risky.

If you see this, just stay away and shoot them off the table (assault cannons!).

[Xenith]

Just to share my pain...

 

No matter how much "volume of dice" you think is on your side,

DO NOT

I repeat

DO NOT

charge your DC into storm shield terminators.

You will bounce right off and get smashed into the ground pronto. Even with Lemartes re-rolls and Priest strength buff

 

Also worth mentioning since it's available for us - mixed terminator squads are insane.

5 shields to tank all the wounds and 5 claws to slice stuff back is REALLY hard to deal with.

Even though we're a close combat oriented army I came to the conclusion there is no good way to deal with them in close combat, period.

Volume of dice = multiple models with little toughness and wounds (MEQ) = claws will shred you.

High strength, high toughness, multiple damage = not enough attacks, hammers will pop you

In theory lots of power fists or glaives encarmine (thanks to D3) could do the trick, but it's way too expensive and risky.

If you see this, just stay away and shoot them off the table (assault cannons!).

 

I mean, this isn't just an 8th ed thing, charging anything into 10x assault terms has been a bad idea since they increased the storm shield to a 3++ save in 5th ed.

 

Don't forget that that 10 term unit was around 500pts. How many points of DC did you throw against them? 1 DC on the charge with a power axe should be getting roughly 0.4 unsaved wounds through on a 3++ model. 

Edited June 23, 2017 by Xenith

[MinamotoKansuke]

 

Just to share my pain...

 

No matter how much "volume of dice" you think is on your side,

DO NOT

I repeat

DO NOT

charge your DC into storm shield terminators.

You will bounce right off and get smashed into the ground pronto. Even with Lemartes re-rolls and Priest strength buff

 

Also worth mentioning since it's available for us - mixed terminator squads are insane.

5 shields to tank all the wounds and 5 claws to slice stuff back is REALLY hard to deal with.

Even though we're a close combat oriented army I came to the conclusion there is no good way to deal with them in close combat, period.

Volume of dice = multiple models with little toughness and wounds (MEQ) = claws will shred you.

High strength, high toughness, multiple damage = not enough attacks, hammers will pop you

In theory lots of power fists or glaives encarmine (thanks to D3) could do the trick, but it's way too expensive and risky.

If you see this, just stay away and shoot them off the table (assault cannons!).

 

I mean, this isn't just an 8th ed thing, charging anything into 10x assault terms has been a bad idea since they increased the storm shield to a 3++ save in 5th ed.

 

Don't forget that that 10 term unit was around 500pts. How many points of DC did you throw against them? 1 DC on the charge with a power axe should be getting roughly 0.4 unsaved wounds through on a 3++ model. 

 

 

Yeah, I know, just wanted to test things :) In previous edition they didn't have 2 wound each though and saves worked differently, so I figured it's worth a try.

The dead DC think otherwise :D

[Xenith]

I think the DC really benefit from the 4-5pt power weapons. I'd really consider adding 3 normal power weapons per 5 death co now to really up their damage. Swords are good to remove the 2+ save, but don't help against storm shields. Axes are the best all rounder.

[NTaW]

I think the DC really benefit from the 4-5pt power weapons. I'd really consider adding 3 normal power weapons per 5 death co now to really up their damage. Swords are good to remove the 2+ save, but don't help against storm shields. Axes are the best all rounder.

I'm glad I pulled a hard stop on painting my BA, lots of arms being snapped off and replaced for this reason. Power swords for less than 5 points is a big ol' win.

[Xenith]

Pssht. Just paint more Death Company.

[durdle-durdle]

Has anyone used inceptors yet? I'm considering buying 2 squads. They make a pretty decent mobile shoots unit to take down chaff I think.

[Blindhamster]

Concencuss seems to be they suck, but I'm doing an all primaris army now (they just look better) so will see how much mileage I can get out of them.

 

I think the primaris stuff in general should get a little better once a codex is available to run them.

[NTaW]

Pssht. Just paint more Death Company.

 

:lol: honestly meant to type DC not BA. 24 of them to be done, at least four of them are getting power swords now.

[Idomeneus]

Had my first game of 8th today, just using the Dark Imperium box, with no Inceptors, because I still don't know how to make those models work without falling off their bases, and two fewer plague marines to balance it (turns out the primaris marines get a bit of a power level advantage). Things I took away:

 

Pros:

Chaining buffs. I had a Captain and Lieutenant in close proximity for most of the game, and the re rolls were brutal (it helped that I rolled a lot of 1s to get the bonus).

 

The Gravis Captain is great, though he could do with a better armour save.

 

Cons:

Intercessors are very mediocre. They can work in close combat against depleted units, but they are uninspiring at close quarters and don't have the volume of fire to make a difference at range.

 

The Ancient is pointless. He won the game for me by leaving him on an objective, but that is about the limit of his usefulness. He has slightly worse Lieutenant stats, and without the re rolls to wound that make Lieutenants worth taking.

 

 

Overall I thought the new rules were nice and streamlined, got through the game swiftly even with multiple consultations of the rulebook. Excited to try out some more missions.

[Jolemai]

Frag grenades on overwatch <3

Need to remember you can fire pistols if in combat

[Idomeneus]

Has anyone used inceptors yet? I'm considering buying 2 squads. They make a pretty decent mobile shoots unit to take down chaff I think.

 

I gave it a go. I really liked them. Probably best used out of range of the enemy's main units, my strategy was to wait for the enemy to make it halfway up the field, then drop them behind and gun down exposed support characters. Because they are a shooty unit, they don't suffer the normal SM drop unit issue of needing to make a risky charge. They can drop at max range, fire their 18 shots and not worry about a next turn counter charge. They need to be used with caution, but I see myself getting another squad or two.

[Indefragable]

 

Has anyone used inceptors yet? I'm considering buying 2 squads. They make a pretty decent mobile shoots unit to take down chaff I think.

 

I gave it a go. I really liked them. Probably best used out of range of the enemy's main units, my strategy was to wait for the enemy to make it halfway up the field, then drop them behind and gun down exposed support characters. Because they are a shooty unit, they don't suffer the normal SM drop unit issue of needing to make a risky charge. They can drop at max range, fire their 18 shots and not worry about a next turn counter charge. They need to be used with caution, but I see myself getting another squad or two.

 

 

Would dakka Termies serve the same function?

 

The trade-off, of course, is the Inceptors' mobility vs the Terminators survivability*.

 

 

Although really, non-SS Terminators pretty much just have a 5++ save consider how much plasma and stuff is around these days.

[biglou666]

So i had a 50 power game the other day. Took seth with 5 DC (in a las plas razorback), a baal predator, 5 man tac squad, 5 sniper scouts, a lasccanon dread, and 2x MM 2x ML Dev squad.

 

Was playing agaisnt dark eldar (they seem pretty good right now!). The sniper scouts are worth their weight in gold. Heavily considering running 15-20 camo sniper scouts in my future lists as they are destructive and versatile. Whether they were shooting at characters, vehicles, or troops, they just always felt like they were relevant, each for the cost of less than a DC marine each without upgrades. Just make sure to put them on the tallest piece of terrain on your side, as they eventually got charged by a homonculus. Las plas razorback is my new favourite transport (really kept the pressure on the DE raiders and other skimmers), baal predator with assault cannon was acceptable againt DE troops. The DC were rather lacking, even with a few thunder hammers, it was only having seth with them that made them ok.

 

Still going to need to play some more games to really get a feel but i think a scout heavy army with LS storms, And vets in Las-Plas razorbacks could be the way to go for a more mobile army list.

 

As far as primaris marines are concerned, i dont have any yet and probably wont any time soon as they get average reviews at best.