Quixus Posted June 22, 2017 Share Posted June 22, 2017 Weird, paint job should not matter. If it is a unique looking space marine with a big axe a jump pack and an inferno pistol, it should be obvious that it is Dante, if Dante is marked on your army list, even though the model is not golden and/or has a winged blood drop on his left shoulder. I totally get the aversion to super friends, but this has nothing to do with combining different chapters, it is just a Blood Angels army that isn't painted as you are supposed to paint it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlo Posted June 22, 2017 Share Posted June 22, 2017 After talking it over with a few TOs, they seem to think it was to help stop super friends that would take codex space marines, and whatever they wanted. like Khan and Tiberius etc. leave it up to the Smurf players to ruin it for the rest of us... and while I agree counts as should stay, and I'm 100% behind the idea of it. there are *alot* of people against it that I would've never guessed. reading responses from other groups/forums such as Facebook. But that makes no sense. As with the FAQ the chapter tactics cancelled eachother out, as did they if you combined any codex chapter with BA/DA/SW.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeathcompanyDante Posted June 22, 2017 Share Posted June 22, 2017 This is potentially what most annoys me about the new edition most. Im still happy on the most part about 8th, its given me motivation to get back to the hobby. But the rule to stop me using character rules for my custom chapter is a joke. I know its a rule few would actually enforce but thats not the point. I get why they did it, dante is dante and his rules are designed only to reflect him, but this is 40k. Why is it so inconceivable that my chapter master could be on par with dante/ sanguinor/ seth. Why can my first captain not be tycho/ astorath worthy. For me personally, if they want to go down this road, then give us other options. Just off the top of my head but could they not have a chapter creation set of rules. Choose gene seed- choose one chapter tactic from list ( i know this is irrelevant due to lack of chapter tactics at the moment but we could see them return in the codexes) - and then have some minimum character creation, take basic captain profile, you may add 2 points to your profile stats to raise a stat by no more than one. Each costs x amount of points. You may then choose, 1-2 items from relic list for x points each. Maybe a list of potential special rules, (orbital bombardment, preferred enemy..., re roll one failed command roll per game etc) By no means a worthy games designer, but a mechanic like this would give everyone to have their own unique chapter if they chose, and if balanced, would keep major characters like dante/ abbadon, calgar etc at the top of the table. Just late night rambling from me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dont-Be-Haten Posted June 22, 2017 Share Posted June 22, 2017 After talking it over with a few TOs, they seem to think it was to help stop super friends that would take codex space marines, and whatever they wanted. like Khan and Tiberius etc. leave it up to the Smurf players to ruin it for the rest of us... and while I agree counts as should stay, and I'm 100% behind the idea of it. there are *alot* of people against it that I would've never guessed. reading responses from other groups/forums such as Facebook. But that makes no sense. As with the FAQ the chapter tactics cancelled eachother out, as did they if you combined any codex chapter with BA/DA/SW.... Preaching to the choir mate. I have no idea why people are actually gung-ho about this. Past editions were something in the context of: "If you wish to play your own chapter, you may use this models statline, simply change the name and give the model a nice back story." This was one of the coolest things Jarvis was adamant about, and I loved it since we didn't have the extra level of personalization. It is in the spirit of the game, I'm just curious how major events and TOs approach it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkhanist Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 It's certainly a dick move. There's at least 1000 chapters, potentially more now Guilliman has been spamming primaris spin-offs along his crusade route. We've been encouraged since 2nd edition to come up with our own backstories and chapter scheme, or use many of the examples. Now, if you don't play one of the half dozen with specific characters you're at a big disadvantage with no chapter master for a start. Obviously you don't want counts-as named characters ending up recreating super friends (e.g. dante and guilliman and kantor counts-as are all in my cheesy eagles chapter), but they went too far. If you're sticking to one 'counts-as' succesor chapter, there's no reason why you shouldn't get the 'counts-as' characters too. If someone insists, for now I'd just say they're in campaign camoflage, but they're really 'insert-main-chapter-here'. Personally, anyone that won't play such a fluffy single-chapter successor (but your blood angels counts-as aren't 100% red!! Not valid!! Get rid of that astorath!!!!) is probably the sort of player I wouldn't enjoy playing anyway, so it's a handy advance warning. Just hoping it'll get properly fixed in a less draconian manner with the codexes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halandaar Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 I can't check at the moment, but I'm pretty sure there is no general rule that you can put items from the SW lists on SM characters, there only specific units that can do so, like the dreadnoughts. [Edit]I just checked. The book says: "Wolf Lord - Use the Captain (pg 12) or Captain in Gravis Armour (pg 13) datasheet" and "Wolf Lord in Terminator Armour - Use the Captian in Temrinator Armour datashet (pg 12) There is no mention of additional or different wargear choices. The wargear lists on the following page are for genuine SW units (e.g. Wolf Guard) only.[/Edit] Agh, you're right but it's incredibly stupid. Blood Angels just have Inferno Pistols, Hand Flamers and Heavy Flamers added to the main Wargear list so their units that use generic datasheets can take them, but SWs have their own Wargear list than generic datasheets can't access. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benwin007 Posted September 10, 2018 Share Posted September 10, 2018 Tell you what though, I ran Seth last Saturday and he was a beast. Sure you miss out on the named characters but he is worth it in a rhino rush army. You also can take lemartes as he buffs death company without any chapter specifics from what I understand. Seth and Sang Guard Ancient gives rerolls to hits and re roll 1s for wounds in combat. As well, Seth and the Ancient are still cheaper together than Dante. I'm really liking my Flesh Tearer's right now. I know this is old but I'm wanting to play with flesh tearers and noticed you said that lemartes can join you with Seth how is this possible? I thought all other named characters can't join Seth? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlo Posted September 10, 2018 Share Posted September 10, 2018 Tell you what though, I ran Seth last Saturday and he was a beast. Sure you miss out on the named characters but he is worth it in a rhino rush army. You also can take lemartes as he buffs death company without any chapter specifics from what I understand. Seth and Sang Guard Ancient gives rerolls to hits and re roll 1s for wounds in combat. As well, Seth and the Ancient are still cheaper together than Dante. I'm really liking my Flesh Tearer's right now. I know this is old but I'm wanting to play with flesh tearers and noticed you said that lemartes can join you with Seth how is this possible? I thought all other named characters can't join Seth? Allied "BLOOD ANGELS" detachment with your FLESH TEARERS (so either -1CP to just include Lemartes or a different full detachment with an Elites slot open). Because Lemartes just buffs key word DEATH COMPANY as opposed to BLOOD ANGELS, he can be used to buff the FLESH TEARERS, Death Company units, even though he is nor part of the same army. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benwin007 Posted September 10, 2018 Share Posted September 10, 2018 Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayPhase15 Posted September 12, 2018 Share Posted September 12, 2018 Related to this, how do abilities like the Sanguinor's Aura of Fervour work? It states Blood Angels Infantry units, and he is a named character - so I'm guessing he can't affect successor chapters? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panzer Posted September 12, 2018 Share Posted September 12, 2018 Related to this, how do abilities like the Sanguinor's Aura of Fervour work? It states Blood Angels Infantry units, and he is a named character - so I'm guessing he can't affect successor chapters? That's right. He's no Blood Angels Infantry unit. He's a Flesh Tearers Infantry unit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dont-Be-Haten Posted September 12, 2018 Share Posted September 12, 2018 Related to this, how do abilities like the Sanguinor's Aura of Fervour work? It states Blood Angels Infantry units, and he is a named character - so I'm guessing he can't affect successor chapters? That's right. He's no Blood Angels Infantry unit. He's a Flesh Tearers Infantry unit. They only thing you can do if you play a successor is to say they are blood Angels, or they are from separate detachments and only the detachments that is/are BA benefit from the sanguinor. As soon as you field Seth, that detachment loses all relic options and other names characters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayPhase15 Posted September 12, 2018 Share Posted September 12, 2018 Thanks all. I picked up some Reivers for kill team, painted them as Flesh Tearers (I'm wasn't convinced they fitted my Blood Angel aesthetic) and have been looking for an hq to support them in conventional games. The Sanguinor seemed a good call, but I'll have to keep them as blood angels as per your suggestions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schlitzaf Posted September 12, 2018 Share Posted September 12, 2018 I have said this elsewhere, but if your just doing a true DIY Chapter with no real rules. Then just use keyword (chapter) for all purposes. The moment you start playing a DIY Chapter with Rules (Special Characters) then no, you cannot run count as As Dante alongside your Seth. This is espacially notable with FW character successor whom unlike most parent chapters, are not forced, to take a subpar warlord. Other great examples are Minotaurs using Templar Chapter Tactics. Whom regain access to Librarians. And all that together, if you are simply switching chapters to game the system (were a white scars players last edition) and then tell me “oh I only using these tactics because flavor”. I won’t play against you. Or if you use your tactics I will ask you use your DIY Keyword. In other words if you are blatantly simply choosing the tactic you believe to be strongest, without a real flavor backing, while claiming flavor excuse. I won’t play with you*. *i do think there needs to be a 3 generic any chapter astartes relic. Banner/Teeth or Sword/Wrath. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dont-Be-Haten Posted September 12, 2018 Share Posted September 12, 2018 If it helps I just play my <carmine blades> as BA. And the counts-as Seth as the chapter master, either in a separate detachment, or w/o the rules. Mephiston = Eskandor a rather strong Librarian who isn't as powerful as the real deal in my personal fluff, but stronger than my average librarian such as Lucien. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panzer Posted September 12, 2018 Share Posted September 12, 2018 Yeah I play my Knights of Baal as Blood Angels as well. Tho I don't use any special characters and if I'd do they'd be on the board as themselves making a cameo in my ranks. :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dont-Be-Haten Posted September 12, 2018 Share Posted September 12, 2018 Yeah I play my Knights of Baal as Blood Angels as well. Tho I don't use any special characters and if I'd do they'd be on the board as themselves making a cameo in my ranks. :P All of my characters are kitbashed minus the Sanguinor and Astorath, which both have been known to fight alongside other chapters. Hell it's in the fluff he seeks out the CBs for their death company. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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