List updating, opinions and advice requested!

[Wolf_Lord_Hardrada]

So! A new age dawns and old wolves turn their eyes to the sky-gold that is the new edition, but what to build now?

 

As stands, my Wolves can currently call on

 

20 Blood Claws

20 Grey Hunters

5 Wolf Guard terminators

5 Long Fangs (full set of mixed weapons)

Ass-Cannon Dred

Las/Missile Dred

Razorback

Rhino

Wolf Guard Battle Leader

 

In addition, I have unbuilt sprues that can make a further 25 marines mixed between Claws/Hunters/Guard depending on how far I can push the weapons options.

 

I know that I am lacking in transport options for such an inf heavy force, and my heavy weapons are severely malnourished too. I've very tempted to head in the direction of running Ragnars great company, so buying some drop pods for those pups'. I have historically always had a Vindicator in my army but it has recently found itself in a new more traitorous colour scheme, though I am willing to replace it.

 

I'm 100% NOT interested in TWC, the models look great and the rules are great but they wolf my wolfing wolf too much, if you get my meaning. I'm not sold on the Wulfen models either, I do prefer the Eye of Terror era ones personally. I do however look forwards to converting some Primaris marines, just not sure which ones to go for as I only really want a squad or two of them at most.

 

I guess what I'm getting at is that I'm at a loss of where to go next. I need more transports, I also need more shooty fire power (maybe another LF squad? Or replacing that Vindicator) and deep down I know that I need another CC focused Dreadnought.

[Gherrick]

IMO, wolf guard (PA) are our best overall "everyman" unit, and you can't go too wrong with squads with chainsword x2+storm bolter vs the softer units, and others with combi-(plasma/melta) and wolfclaw/storm shield (on bike or jump pack) for the harder targets. Longs Fangs are so good this edition, so they can focus on taking down the more durable targets.

 

I would suggest you use your BCs and GHs as proxy-WGs, and how they perform for you. Also, Lukas + BCs are absolutely brutal, if you don't want to go the WG-proxy route.

[Wolf_Lord_Hardrada]

I do hear that storm-shields are the bees knees this edition, so it might well be time for a squad of WG with some nice round shields to be converted up!

[Frater Cornelius]

I do hear that storm-shields are the bees knees this edition, so it might well be time for a squad of WG with some nice round shields to be converted up!

On TWC they are essentially mandatory. On Wolfguard it is debateable. Consider this: save modifiers are everywhere and even a 2+ isn't what it used to be. A Stormshield caps the modification at 3+. On melee focused TDA I can see them doing work. However, with the 9" deep strike limitation I prefer shooty units with solid melee as opposed to melee-only units. A Stormshield usually means no ranged weapon as far as I am aware.

 

If nothing else, it looks cool. If you are not too keen on optimal performance, go for it. Keep in mind though, that alpha strike is strong and without TWC it is one of your better defenses against aggressive melee armies. It is a trade-off between defense and offense.

[Wolf_Lord_Hardrada]

Perhaps it is worth taking a 5 man squad with shields to act as a 'CC Buffer', let them soak first assault damage and pin the attackers in place for a 2nd unit to charge in and finish them off. I guess experimenting is probably going to be a large part of this edition for a while at least.

[Gherrick]

WG can currently take a combi-* in addition to two melee weapons (or weapon/SS). Our WG Battle Leader cannot, so I suspect that this may get changed in our actual codex. It gives SW unprecedented flexibility, and makes WG a solid go-to option, IMO.

[Frater Cornelius]

In that case you want Termintors. Regular Wolf Guard are too soft.

[Wolf_Lord_Hardrada]

Well, I suppose I could always do with another 5 termies :D

[Frater Cornelius]

Well, I suppose I could always do with another 5 termies

 

Don't we all ;)

[Gherrick]

TDAWG are a bit pricey and slow to use in any large quantity, IMO, with all the AP and multi-wound options I'm seeing out there. Sure, they can take insane amounts of small arms fire, but you need a lot of hard targets to get them off the opponent's "hit with heavy weapons" priority list. I like a few PAWG with combis and jump packs, for deep strike + excellent movement after they deploy and blow the primary target(s). At 5pts per SS, throw a few in and they will fair enough. WG bikers with combi/weapon/SS are currently the perfect blend of movement, durability, and offensive punch. I prefer a 3+/3++ and T5 over a 2+/* and T4. You take a helluva lot fewer wounds overall. This is based on the few 2k games I've played, and not just theory-crafting.

[the jeske]

1 razorback turret

1 razorback with removable turret

5 TWC or something that be count as TWC, if counts as is still a rule.

2x2 sets of rifle man arms aka 4 autocannons.

1 set of ax+shield arms.

10 more Blood claws from the power armored dudes you have.

 

plus a ton of optional stuff like more terminators, a knight, assasins. normal marines scouts, 120 IG, 2 commissars etc.

[Bloody Legionnaire]

Pick up a set of TWC and your mind will change.. That said they aren't as good this edition as they were previously. I plan on still using mine.

 

Ragnar's has been fun for me to play these last few years and even with the nerf to Drop Pods I still think you can create a viable list if that is the direction you'd like to go in. One unit that got a huge buff from 8th edition rule changes are Long Fangs. If I was you I would definitely make 2 more squads. One with x4 Multi-Meltas and one with x4 Plasma Cannon. These units provide a lot of fire power that you can jam right down your opponents throat. You can also place 2 units of Fangs in the same Pod... Drop them in with a unit of Grey Hunters and Blood Claws to add on the pressure from a charge and your opponent ends up with a lot of different threats to deal with. I don't know if you do Forge World or not but if you really wanted a strong Drop Pod list then having a Dreadnought coming down in a Lucius Drop Pod would definitely be a strong unit. 

One thing to keep in mine though if you do plan on going the Drop Pod route it It's not going to be feasible use more than 3 Drop Pods in games 2k and under... The fact that they cost 105 points coupled with needing to have at least half your units deployed on the table really puts a lot of restriction on what you can actually leave in reserves. Honestly don't let the price tag scare you though. I definitely think Drop Pods are worth their price tags. Being able to choose when and where you're Drop Pods come in with no worries about dice rolls or scatter is huge. Then there is the ability to shoot and charge after your units Drop in.. that's huge!

[Wolf Guard Dan]

That's a good core to build your Great Company from. I recommend playing a few games with what you have and seeing where the deficiencies are.

 

I am not a fan of drop pods as they stand. They're over-costed for what they do. It's cheaper just to use a unit that gets deep-strike in their unit abilities. Rhinos/Razors are better for now. But if you're going to use a drop pod put a melee unit or dreadnought in it. The dread drop pod is only available through forge world now.

 

This may be an unpopular opinion to some but I don't understand the popularity on this Forum of people putting Long Fangs in pods. Long Fangs should be in cover and if you have the points guarded by a WG pack leader in TDA and Storm shield. Long Fangs deployed in a Drop Pod will be dead the next turn. Anyway I think Long Fangs are awesome this edition. I have been really happy with how they've performed. Fire Discipline is so good. I am also a fan of predators.

 

You don't need TWC in this edition. There are other units that can fill that role now. Terminators can do that for you, Wulfen too. I agree with the aesthetic opinion you have. I prefer the EoT Wulfen too.

 

The Jeske has good advice. Especially the optional stuff if you want to play Imperial Soup. Although at that point you are not playing Space Wolves but Imperium.

 

To sum it up. More Long Fangs won't hurt. Terminators can be a good assault/counter assault unit. And I really like Wolf Priests. And consider how you will kill hordes. Hordes are going to be strong.

[hammer grimblood]

I would suggest you pick up some Thunderwolves and bikes for PA WG to start. Mobility is key in this edition from the few games I've played. After that you can't go wrong with Wulfen. They buff other units, are deadly in melee and after a couple games they act as massive fire magnets. Wolf Priests are even better than before with their healing ability and Rune Priests are always good staples. As for your CC Dread idea I love mine, multiple St 10 attacks with a 3++ is very distracting for my opponents. If you want more Dreads and transports then consider an Iron Priest on a bike. He can now repair vehicles and doesn't need to bring his servitor lackeys. What about a Stormfang?

[Gherrick]

The TDAWG option for long fangs no longer has the option for a SS, but gained the option of a CML.

[the jeske]

The CML is kind of a bad in 8th, super high cost with meh stats.

[Wolf Guard Dan]

The TDAWG option for long fangs no longer has the option for a SS, but gained the option of a CML.

 

Thanks for pointing that out. I hope we get the option back with our dex but I won't be holding my breath.

[Wolf_Lord_Hardrada]

I'm probably going to be grabbing some Drop Pods, even better if I can get an ebay bargain whilst people rage-sell as they always do when a unit is altered! I think for the game sizes I'll be playing (<2000pts) two will do, stuff them with Blood Claws and let them tear into the soft underbelly of my foes. I'd love a FW drop pod but I also like having spare cash at the end of a month, so Dred-Pod might have to wait a while.

 

I could easily pick up some bikers too, so they might do for fast hitting CC monsters.

 

Would it be viable for horde control to give 5 LF heavy bolters and a TDAWG with assault cannon? Or might that be pricing myself out of better suited units? I'm not opposed to playing with magnets either, if tricky they do make it cheaper to swap a units load out. I think I'll put together a 'if I had' list for 1500pts and post it up, see what you fine folk think?

[Bloody Legionnaire]

I'm probably going to be grabbing some Drop Pods, even better if I can get an ebay bargain whilst people rage-sell as they always do when a unit is altered! I think for the game sizes I'll be playing (<2000pts) two will do, stuff them with Blood Claws and let them tear into the soft underbelly of my foes. I'd love a FW drop pod but I also like having spare cash at the end of a month, so Dred-Pod might have to wait a while.

 

I could easily pick up some bikers too, so they might do for fast hitting CC monsters.

 

Would it be viable for horde control to give 5 LF heavy bolters and a TDAWG with assault cannon? Or might that be pricing myself out of better suited units? I'm not opposed to playing with magnets either, if tricky they do make it cheaper to swap a units load out. I think I'll put together a 'if I had' list for 1500pts and post it up, see what you fine folk think?

I honestly think GHs would do you better coming out of Drop Pods than BCs would. 

 

Heavy Bolter are outclassed by Plasma Cannons in just about every way for Long Fangs

[Wolf_Lord_Hardrada]

Plasma it is then, which is nice as I've recently learned to enjoy painting them. Why would you say GHs from the pods, over BCs though? My GHs tend to stay in the gun line until mid-late game whilst the BCs do the dirty work.

[Brother Hellion]

GHs have the advantage over BCs due to the fire power they normally posses and that when they emerge can mow down a surprising lot especially if you equip a WG packleader with either combi-plasma or stormbolter to a ten man pack with double plasma.

[Gherrick]

GHs have the advantage over BCs due to the fire power they normally posses and that when they emerge can mow down a surprising lot especially if you equip a WG packleader with either combi-plasma or stormbolter to a ten man pack with double plasma.

And PAWG can sport chainswords x2 + storm bolter for 4pts more per model than GH (effectively doubling the number of shots and attacks for the unit), and even have the option of grabbing SS (instead of a second CS) if you want added survivability vs high AP attacks.

[Wolf_Lord_Hardrada]

So, with that in mind, what role should BC fill? If GH are coming down behind/along the lines for CC carnage, should BCs be a 'first wave' force, this seems the most effective idea to me, in this case at least. I do like giving out WGPLs, might have to make use of more stormbolters too since weight of fire seems more effective than strength of fire.

[Bloody Legionnaire]

So, with that in mind, what role should BC fill? If GH are coming down behind/along the lines for CC carnage, should BCs be a 'first wave' force, this seems the most effective idea to me, in this case at least. I do like giving out WGPLs, might have to make use of more stormbolters too since weight of fire seems more effective than strength of fire.

BCs, are of course, a dedicated assault unit. I really think they should be maximized to the full number they can take in their squad which is why other than fluff reasons I would not put them in a Pod. 

[Gherrick]

And with Lukas nearby, BCs become very scary. Throwing 15+Lukas in LR is probably the best overall use of them.