Thoughts on Death to the False Emperor Rule

[Black13]

So with the 8th edition release, Chaos has said goodbye to our previous universal rule of the "beloved" Boons and gained access to army wide Death to the False Emperor rule.  While I was originally excited by the change (the rule sounds pretty solid at first), I couldn't help but be disappointed that it only applies to games against the hated Imperium.  

 

While this is fluffy and cool, I feel that Chaos has again been given an army rule that is situational at best (only against Imperium, only in the fight phase, only on 6's).  How does everyone else feel about this?  I personally would have loved something that applies to each game, is fluffy and more unique than extra attacks.  

 

As a disclaimer, my primary opponents are tyranids, necrons and orks.. so I'm a bit biased here.  My secondary army is DE, so that also makes me feel a bit cheated when comparing it against Power from Pain and Combat Drugs. 

 

Has anyone considered House Ruling to allow DttFE to apply to all armies?  Would that be asking too much? 

[Scammel]

I think it's fine - I've always liked flavourful twists like this in Fantasy, with 'Fear Elves' and 'Hate Dwarfs', as long as they are indeed twists that don't come with a massive points premium or make particular matchups a roflstomp. In the context of Chaos, I think the list is at about the right place in terms of CC capabilities without needing further buffs.

[Panzer]

If you think that's bad, then ask Slaanesh units how they feel about losing their FnP Icon and getting it replaced with an Icon that improves Death to the false Emperor to a 5+. :D

[Commissar K.]

I think it's a fantastic and very flavourful rule.

 

There is just one thing I'm missing in Chaos and that is a way to migate Morale checks or decrease the massive effect they have on our armies. I feel that we more or less got robbed in that department because if we are wandering in the warp, have guys who effect Morale checks because they are so scary how on earth are Chaos Space Marines and Chaos Daemons litterly the most fearful creatures out there?

Especially for Daemons (and I really feel for them) I feel that Morale check negators are just lacking, to the point of it actually making no sence at all. Fleeing Daemons... Even in AoS they come with Morale/Ld 10. That is a long shot from Ld 7/8.

So perhaps if anything I feel that Icon of Vengeance should have been an always optional Icon instead of only optional when you do not have Mark W, X, Y or Z.

Edited June 26, 2017 by Commissar K.

[razcalking]

It's probably one of the weaker army-wide rules  - it's certainly no Power From Pain.

[Commissar K.]

It's probably one of the weaker army-wide rules  - it's certainly no Power From Pain.

I guess some of you might not have found the time to play it against an Imperium player?

 

The stuff the simple Berzerker Champion has done on his own has been sufficient to confirm to you that this absolutely not one of the weaker army rules. It is meta dependant. The mayority of players in the world still play Imperium (Space Marines).

 

To me it's more a matter of knowing where it's useful for. Daemon Princes with Talons, Lords with Power Fists, Berzerkers and Warp Talons all gain drastical benifits out of this. Whiping units with quality attacks like that is rather exclusive to Chaos aswell. 

[Iron Father Ferrum]

 

There is just one thing I'm missing in Chaos and that is a way to migate Morale checks or decrease the massive effect they have on our armies.

 

While I agree with you, there is the Icon of Vengeance (+1 LD).  It's not perfect but it's a start.

[Panzer]

I honestly don't think mitigating morale is that big of a deal for anything that's not a horde unit.

In a 10 model Marine unit you would have to suffer 4-5 casualties before you start getting affected by battleshock on an average roll. 5 model Marine units are basically immune to it since the unit basically needs to get wiped out before getting affected by battleshock even if you roll a 6.

[Sception]

It's characterful, but it's seems like more garnish than main course.  Against non-imperials it does nothing, while against imperials my admittedly limited experience so far is that games are decided in the shooting phase, not the assault phase.  Additionally, if you don't play predominantly against imperials it can be difficult to remember when it does come up.

 

Otherwise, i feel that the icon of vengeance should be the boost to this rule - the undivided legions are the most dedicated to eliminating the imperium, where the cult legions only fight imperials to the extent that doing so serves the interests of their masters.  It especially shouldn't be the slaaneshi banner, considering that they are, if anything, the cult least interested in taking the war to the imperial military.  During the siege of terra, horus arguably lost because the emperor's children abandoned the seige to torture random civilians instead because seige warfare was too boring for them.

 

So if anything, the undivided icon should be the boost to DttFE, and the slaaneshi icon should be the leadership boost, given their combat drug & psycho-surgery addled systems that are more likely to revel in the pain and terror of the battlefield than run from it.

 

 

otherwise, again, it's a garnish, nothing more.  I'd rather we had something else, but I'm still relatively confident that we'll see a return of legion rules once our codex eventually shows up - though the wait may be a year or two - so I'm not too bent out of shape about it.

[Sersi]

If you think that's bad, then ask Slaanesh units how they feel about losing their FnP Icon and getting it replaced with an Icon that improves Death to the false Emperor to a 5+.

 

True, almost anything would have be better, a movement bonus, rending, re-rolling to wound rolls or 1. Well points saved just like on the FNP version that we took on like 1-2 units because it cost 30 pts!    

[Berzerker88]

They could have kept the 'Champions of Chaos' as the name, and have the same ability as DttFE but that applies to all factions.

[Plaguecaster]

Well our characters can no longer turn into spawn which is all I care about basicallyso don't really care besides it makes sense fluffwise that we get a rule which specifically targets ALL Imperium units since we hate them with a passion it could be only marine armies like the last edition, besides we haven't got any new codex books for the different legions ect which will have better army rules for each one

[Commissar K.]

 

 

There is just one thing I'm missing in Chaos and that is a way to migate Morale checks or decrease the massive effect they have on our armies.

 

While I agree with you, there is the Icon of Vengeance (+1 LD).  It's not perfect but it's a start.

 

Yeah it's such a pitty that the Icon is exclusive to no-marked units. It's a bit strange even, as if all the marked units couldn't feel vengeful.

In any case that might even be a last minute change also. As in that the banner was available to everybody at first but GW realized this meant there was no reason to not go marked then. Even the little tid bit on having the option to choose no mark feels tacked on. As the <Mark of Chaos>  first says you must swap it to Khorne, Tzeentch, Nurgle or Slaanesh and then later states you don't have to do it.

 

I also think this too might get rectified in the future as it allows for technical oddities.

[Panzer]

Well our characters can no longer turn into spawn which is all I care about basicallyso don't really care besides it makes sense fluffwise that we get a rule which specifically targets ALL Imperium units since we hate them with a passion it could be only marine armies like the last edition, besides we haven't got any new codex books for the different legions ect which will have better army rules for each one

I seriously hope that the boon table comes back one way or the other once we get the Codex. I mean it needed a serious rework but not having at all is even worse for me. :D

[Brother Aiwass]

 

Well our characters can no longer turn into spawn which is all I care about basicallyso don't really care besides it makes sense fluffwise that we get a rule which specifically targets ALL Imperium units since we hate them with a passion it could be only marine armies like the last edition, besides we haven't got any new codex books for the different legions ect which will have better army rules for each one

I seriously hope that the boon table comes back one way or the other once we get the Codex. I mean it needed a serious rework but not having at all is even worse for me.

 

I really hope not. The Kelly legacy should be expunged from 40k like the missing legiones.

[Commissar K.]

The only thing I do hope to see, expect and think would make sence from a narrative perspective is a terun of Daemonic Weapons that upon failing to kill a model will turn you into a Spawn. To me designs like that are always the better route to go because it makes it optional and if you are equiped with such a weapon you can make very potent design choices while there is a trick to it if you happen to roll poorly.

In AoS the whole 'turn into a Spawn' design is removed apart from Tzeentch having a weapon who can turn killed characters into one and Khorne having a weapon why doubles your attacks but also turns you into a Spawn if you didn't kill anyone that turn.

But really I like Death to the False Emperor a lot as a simple but effective CSM army-wide rule. I still do wish there where more ways to crank up Ld or even negate it but it's likely GW wanted to keep that as a designed weakness despite it feeling quite odd as we are the technically scariest army out there for mortal beings? I personally still can't get over the fact that Daemons flee so easily for example.

Edited June 28, 2017 by Commissar K.