So, I played DW vs IG game 8th edition

[Irbis]

Spoiler alert:
 

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My DW was completely wiped out. Was fun game, though, as IG was down to maybe 20% models in the end, and I rolled so many 1s in the second half of the game I feel it could have went the other way easily. I also feel command points are very strong for DW, unlike for a lot of armies, as DW has a lot of rolls where changing a single dice can yield pretty benefits. Even if I kept whiffing my rerolls 80% of the time

Anyway, IG list was pretty standard. Yarrick, two commanders, 2 chimeras, ogryns, a tank, assorted veteran infantry squads with lascannons, 2 drop tempestus squads with a plasma. They even managed to steal first turn as between reserves and packing transports like clown cars they only had 4 units on the board, go figure.
 
My DW:
 
Librarian

Watch Captain - Jump Pack/Master-crafted boltgun/Xenophase

Deathwatch Kill Team

Black Shield - Boltgun, Power sword
2x Veteran - Boltgun, chainsword
Deathwatch Veteran w/ Frag Cannon
Watch Sergeant - Boltgun, Xenophase Blade

Deathwatch Kill Team

Black Shield - Boltgun, Power sword
2x Veteran - Boltgun, chainsword
Deathwatch Veteran w/ Frag Cannon
Watch Sergeant - Boltgun, Xenophase Blade

Deathwatch Kill Team

Black Shield - Chainsword, Stalker Pattern Boltgun
3x Deathwatch Veteran - Chainsword, Stalker Pattern Boltgun
Watch Sergeant - Chainsword, Stalker Pattern Boltgun

Deathwatch Vanguard Vets

Deathwatch Vanguard Sergeant - Bolt Pistol, Plasma pistol
4x Deathwatch Vanguard Veteran - Bolt Pistol, Plasma pistol

Dreadnought
Twin lascannon, Dreadnought ccw w/Storm Bolter

Razorback, Storm bolter, Twin assault cannon
 
How I feel they performed? Well, besides librarian (who failed 4/5 powers rolling 1s and 2s, his might of heroes buff worked pretty well the one time he managed to pull it off) I feel everything was pretty optimal. As in, you can't say it worked badly and needed urgent changes, didn't feel OP too. I specifically wanted to comment on the three infantry units though:

 

Line kill team:

 

Not only with this setup it has melee prowess to challenge even ogryns (well, with the might buff mentioned above) but is also pretty cheap and universal - high attacks density to deal with hordes, good shooting, good volume of power weapon attacks, and even anti-tank thanks to frag. I consider two bullet catcher mook models with no upgrades a must - you will lose models to enemy shooting very easily and having a model you can take out without reducing the squad effectiveness much is vastly more important than gear.

 

Conversely, storm shields are IMHO dead now, especially for that price. Even lascannons give you armour save and DW simply doesn't have enough models to weather lasguns or bolters on other models saving the SS holder for plasma hits. Eventually, it will be a choice between sarge/frag cannon holder and SS guy - who will die with his 3++ as easily as any other MEQ, wasting the points. Better take more models instead.

 

Sniper kill team:

 

That surprised me greatly. I took it only to check it out, as it's kind of pricey squad for basically just longer range bolters. They, however, weathered enormous amount of fire due to 2+ save (being parked on objective in cover), wiped out tempestus squad, then veterans, put a dent in chimera - indeed, were last guys I had standing. If they could target characters, that would be ace loadout, as it is, I still think they cost too much but they do keep up the good work. I don't know if I would recommend them but definitely not say anything bad about them, just keep them cheap.

 

Vanguard veterans:

 

OK, here my expectations differed from actual game play a bit. First, it's trivial for enemy to not give them any room to deploy in, even if opponent was new to 8th edition and kept his characters in the open. All IG models scattered about extended 9 inch zone outside the board, keeping all the juicy targets safe. That said, I decided to drop them on left flank IG squad holding objective - and boy, did they work wonders.

 

With captain rerolls, I hit all 12 shots (including MC bolter) killing both the squad (with a bit of help from morale) and commander (turns out even not overloaded plasma/SIA makes mockery of even 4+ save in cover) then took the objective. Then, they weathered shooting of half IG army (including panic tempestus plasma squad drop) losing only 4 models, buying rest of my army a bit of time. Then, sarge and captain shot/charged tempestus squad, wiping them out too (captain charging first to tank overwatch). Then, sadly, captain ate lascannon shot that rolled 6, rolling two 1s as saves, then rolled some more 1s as FNP (before someone asks, warlord trait) and that was it.

 

I definitely liked their performance, yes, it's only one data point but I do think vanguard is best deep strike option DW has now. This is also why I gave them zero melee weapons - they would be useless on deep strike, having small chance of connecting charge instead of dealing a lot of damage from get go, and would suffer casualties first on overwatch.

 

Instead, you have a squad that between 2+ to wound ammo and overcharged plasma can kill some really tough targets from the start and very little risk. They simply don't have the toughness to risk melee as their primary mode of attack and if you try to kit them out for melee they become so painfully expensive gunslingers will eat them alive for the same points.

 

Also, a bit on xenophase blade. In melee with both ogryns/commander, it pretty much scared the opponent into not taking hits on his ++ save (he kept these for blackshield instead) and instead let the sarge hit mooks ignoring their armour save. I did like it too, both strong and fluffy option, unless of course your meta has zero ++ saves but by now pretty much every army sports these...

[Ania Redfang]

Nice write up, thanks for this.

 

When you set up a unit in reserve it still counts as setting it up i believe for the purposes of first turn. Is this how you played it? If not would it have made a difference?

[Irbis]

I think that's how we played it, my watch captain and vanguards vs 2 tempestus squads, and on table razorback, dread and 2 infantry squads vs his 3 vehicles and infantry squad on far left that was later attacked by vanguard. As I said, the amount of models/units that fit in IG chimeras caught me off guard. If I swapped my dreadnought for second razorback I'd have it, though its lascannons and ccw were my main source of anti-tank. Hmm.

 

To add to above, I am really torn on dreadnought. It performed OK, I guess, but I'd really prefer to have SM rifleman variant if at all possible instead. Volume of fire is king in 8th edition, D6 damage from lascannons and melta is very unreliable. To the point two IG lascannons on third turn hit the dread and both rolled 1s, shaving just two wounds off it. Really, the instant kill hit on captain was really the only moment in whole game lascannons on both sides managed to do something impressive (and even then it was down to me whiffing all save and FNP rolls and re-rolls, had I succeeded at even one of these the captain would have lived).

[shandwen]

I had my first match of 8th this last weekend as well. I came to the same conclusion on stalkers (marvelous), but ran the corvus and two squads of bikers. The bikers we're a great shooting platform but needed to be guarded, and my corvus needed to stay flying...

Posts like yours help me to avoid mistakes, and I very much enjoy reading other peeps tactical advice.

[Vel'Cona]

Excellent write-up!  I'll need to pore through your findings a bit more but I'd agree off the top that SS are pretty much done with.  Do you think the Librarian is worth keeping for the potential psychic defense, or is he simply too inconsistent now to be worth his price tag?