Crew of legion ships

[Supe robot gangster #1]

Hey all! A fluff question.

Is there any fluff indicating the usual legionary crew of space marine vessels?

Would most ships just have a command crew and maybe an anti-boarding force (one or two squads) plus legion serfs making up the remainder (excluding transported forces of course). If this information is available where would one find it?

Many thanks in advance!

[Marshal Rohr]

Extermination is your best bet, as it includes most naval info in the series so far.

[Supe robot gangster #1]

Cheers! I'll pull it out of storage and have a looksie!

[Galron]

Most ships as far as I know are crewed with human serfs. Marines have more important things to do. Not to say key positions aren't run by marines but your run of the mill sailor and officer are humans. How they are treated depends on the legion and captain.

[Plaguecaster]

Betrayer by ADB is a great read that deals with some of the crew of Angron's flagship "the conqueror" with the Captain Lotara Sarrin as well as Delvarus who was a Centurion of the World Eaters, commanding the 44th Company. Specifically he commanded the elite Triarii -- five full companies of the World Eaters' finest shipboard warriors that excelled in void warfare and boarding actions far beyond traditional Legion training. Five hundred of Angron's best warriors, led by the Legion's undisputed pit champion, all of whom were vowed and honour-bound to defend the flagship Conqueror. Though they usually had the bad habit of joining planetary assaults without informing the ships captain Edited July 8, 2017 by Plaguecaster

[Gorgoff]

Betrayer by ADB is a great read that deals with some of the crew of Angron's flagship "the conqueror" with the Captain Lotara Sarrin as well as Delvarus who was a Centurion of the World Eaters, commanding the 44th Company. Specifically he commanded the elite Triarii -- five full companies of the World Eaters' finest shipboard warriors that excelled in void warfare and boarding actions far beyond traditional Legion training. Five hundred of Angron's best warriors, led by the Legion's undisputed pit champion, all of whom were vowed and honour-bound to defend the flagship Conqueror. Though they usually had the bad habit of joining planetary assaults without informing the ships captain

Damn, Betrayer really was a good book.

Slow start but then... wow.

[Supe robot gangster #1]

I vaguely recall in battle for the abyss that the thousand sons character was the captain of his ship (can't recall what type of ship it was though). This got me thinking. Is there any other know instances of a marine captaining a ship? And if so would this make it feasable for marines to make up the higher eschelons of the command structure as well? Or is this whole question a case of "it's the heresy, do whatever" kinda deal?

[Demus Ragnok]

I vaguely recall in battle for the abyss that the thousand sons character was the captain of his ship (can't recall what type of ship it was though). This got me thinking. Is there any other know instances of a marine captaining a ship? And if so would this make it feasable for marines to make up the higher eschelons of the command structure as well? Or is this whole question a case of "it's the heresy, do whatever" kinda deal?

I think the TS ship was a strike cruiser. There is an Ultramarine Battleship under command of a marine in that book as well.

[Gorgoff]

I vaguely recall in battle for the abyss that the thousand sons character was the captain of his ship (can't recall what type of ship it was though). This got me thinking. Is there any other know instances of a marine captaining a ship? And if so would this make it feasable for marines to make up the higher eschelons of the command structure as well? Or is this whole question a case of "it's the heresy, do whatever" kinda deal?

Pollux was captain of his ship as well, or to be more precise: he gave the orders and the human captain made them happen.

I guess that's how it works most of the time.

[Supe robot gangster #1]

 

I vaguely recall in battle for the abyss that the thousand sons character was the captain of his ship (can't recall what type of ship it was though). This got me thinking. Is there any other know instances of a marine captaining a ship? And if so would this make it feasable for marines to make up the higher eschelons of the command structure as well? Or is this whole question a case of "it's the heresy, do whatever" kinda deal?

Pollux was captain of his ship as well, or to be more precise: he gave the orders and the human captain made them happen.

I guess that's how it works most of the time.

That's true! I guess there is nothing stopping me from modelling human crew as well using the imperialis militia to represent them!

[bluntblade]

White Scars often captain their own vessels. Likewise the Emperor's Children

[Calas Typhon]

'Fear to Tread' states that Blood Angels would not take command of their ships as Sanguinius disliked reducing the influence of the mortal captains. (This might actually be him directly rather than legionwide) 

 

Iron Warriors were in direct control of their vessels most of the time, 'Hammer of Olympia' has a Shipmaster essentially built into the deck of the ship. Its likely that Iron Warrior ships would have a detachment of Legionaries on board in case of boarding or in reserve when above a planet under siege, I think 'The Iron Within' brings this up.

[Supe robot gangster #1]

Interesting about the blood Angels! If it helps my legion is the thousand sons (hence the reference to the captain in battle for the abyss). Do we think it might even be dependant on the size of the legion? So the larger ones having more recourses in manpower to be able to have captain and command crew as astartes whereas the smaller legions needing regular human crew and simply having an astartes in an advisory role on the bridge?

[Calas Typhon]

Interesting about the blood Angels! If it helps my legion is the thousand sons (hence the reference to the captain in battle for the abyss). Do we think it might even be dependant on the size of the legion? So the larger ones having more recourses in manpower to be able to have captain and command crew as astartes whereas the smaller legions needing regular human crew and simply having an astartes in an advisory role on the bridge?

 

I think it is more about the character of the Legions rather than size mostly. Legions like the Death Guard, Iron Hands and Iron Warriors who were more than distrustful of Mortals would more than likely 9/10 times have their ships led by an Astartes over humanity due to the physical and mental superiority they have over any human. After all, any legionary with the right training could manage a ship.

 

Legions like the Blood Angels, Emperors Children/World Eaters (for entirely different reasons perhaps), Ultramarines and Salamanders might very well allow their ships to be commanded by humans out of either some sort of inclusion of humanity to join in the crusade, or to simply ferry the Legions from battlefield to battlefield. 

 

Legion sizes would definitely account for numbers on a ship too though. The majority of shattered Legions, Thousand Sons included would need every legionary under their power if it came down to a scrap planetside or in space especially when facing Legion strength or a large amount of foes. 

Edited July 10, 2017 by Warsmith Kroeger

[bluntblade]

The Emperor's Children tended to command their own ships as mortals in charge would lead to imperfect actions. Fulgrim has a shipmaster, but the guy has almost never actually led an action.

 

The World Eaters' attention spans are generally shot to pieces, while the Scars just seem to enjoy void combat. Shiban and Jubal both command ships directly at times.

[Supe robot gangster #1]

So I'm thinking. For the astartes command ship of a small crusade fleet (say about 500 marines, plus imperial army regiment(s?) and a small mechanicum detachment) for the 1k sons being say, commanding officer, 4-5 support officers and a small compliment of anti-boarding marines (I'm thinking around 50 marines). Does this seem too much? (The ship is, I'm thinking, a marine strike cruiser). Also. Would it be unfeaseable to have dreadnoughts posted to defend a ship against boarders? Or do we think they'd only be used planetside?

[Calas Typhon]

So I'm thinking. For the astartes command ship of a small crusade fleet (say about 500 marines, plus imperial army regiment(s?) and a small mechanicum detachment) for the 1k sons being say, commanding officer, 4-5 support officers and a small compliment of anti-boarding marines (I'm thinking around 50 marines). Does this seem too much? (The ship is, I'm thinking, a marine strike cruiser). Also. Would it be unfeaseable to have dreadnoughts posted to defend a ship against boarders? Or do we think they'd only be used planetside?

Yeah seems decent enough. 1/10th is a decent enough number to keep a ship alive depending on the class/size. 

 

Dreads can be used anywhere and you could get away with using them in most battlegrounds including zone mortalis. People would reference Betrayer, but the dreads were only activated because there was no other option. 

Edited July 10, 2017 by Warsmith Kroeger

[Supe robot gangster #1]

So this leads into my next question. How many marines (if any) would be appropriate for a squadron of, say, cobra class destroyers? Commanding officer and 1-2 support officers on the command ship with 5-10 marines for anti-boarding per ship in the squadron? Is this too many?

[Calas Typhon]

You could easily have room for anywhere around 5-50 marines in that particular field if you have 500 marines in all honesty. 10-15 marines on that scale a ship could hold a mean defence with shields, especially if you have mortals to soak up damage or slow down assaults.