8th Edition Codex

[Grim Dog Studios]

A shame about some of the restrictrive options in this codex, but oh well. Back to another week of list building now that I cant use my honour guard haha

[Captain Idaho]

I'm a little bummed by Honour Guard not being as powerful/a unit but I'm pretty stoked for the rest of it!

 

Our Strategums are just amazing. So much so I'm completely rethinking how I want to play.

[Toxichobbit]

My poor Chapter Champion. Stuck with only a power sword unless I give him the Burning Blade.

 

Still, least he made it into the Codex! And can take the Burning Blade - woo!

 

A shame about some of the restrictrive options in this codex, but oh well. Back to another week of list building now that I cant use my honour guard haha

 

Just use the Index datasheets. It's perfectly legal to do so if you need to represent options that are no longer in the Codex.

[Prot]

I can see now that Ultramarines, marines in general really, will be buffed by rules in the codex, and not by the new models really. Historically (going way back) this was the opposite. A new model or selection of models would come out and it would be crazy good. This time around I feel I will be using Primaris for fun and the real beef is in the rules.

 

I am also very curious to see what version of escalation we see in codexes (IE: codex creep). I've watched quite a few of the new batreps for the new codex and I admit I was surprised to see how the index based armies are still beating/competitive/ with "codex" space marines.  Unfortunately some of the videos featured armies, or people who are clearly uncomfortable with marines... .especially those who come from a strong xenos playstyle where it's a lot easier to wreck face.

[Ishagu]

I'll tell you what I'm happy about, personally.

 

Finally the Ultramarines are looking like the best Codex Chapter (as they should be). We've endured years of White Scars and Iron Hands being objectively superior, which was upsetting to me. Originally Ultramarines had their own Codex and it felt like it had been hijacked by the other chapters.

 

The rules, strategems and character selection now more than ever, feel very thematic.

[silencer]

 

 

 

My poor Chapter Champion. Stuck with only a power sword unless I give him the Burning Blade.

 

Still, least he made it into the Codex! And can take the Burning Blade - woo!

 

A shame about some of the restrictrive options in this codex, but oh well. Back to another week of list building now that I cant use my honour guard haha

 

Just use the Index datasheets. It's perfectly legal to do so if you need to represent options that are no longer in the Codex.

 

 

Are you sure about this? While I thought of doing the same for friendly games, I was not sure if it really is "legal".

Edited July 26, 2017 by silencer

[Ishagu]

It's legal. Legacy units can be fielded as per GW

[Extropian]

Yep, perfectly legal. There's an official GW quote floating around somewhere.

[crazyterran]

I'll tell you what I'm happy about, personally.

Finally the Ultramarines are looking like the best Codex Chapter (as they should be). We've endured years of White Scars and Iron Hands being objectively superior, which was upsetting to me. Originally Ultramarines had their own Codex and it felt like it had been hijacked by the other chapters.

The rules, strategems and character selection now more than ever, feel very thematic.

Everything ive read make it seem like Raven Guard are the pimp hand of our book this tome around, with IH and UM being up there.

[Ishagu]

Raven Guard sounds good for sure, but it only applies to infantry and Dreads - units I would typically only engage at 12 - 24" anyways.

[crazyterran]

Isnt it units that are further than 12" away that get the buff? So the ranges you would engage them at are the ranges you get -1 to hit. Since Chapter Tactics apply to the same units as any other chapter, i dont see how thats relevant?

 

Raven Guard have one of the stronger pre game Strategems too, being able to spend CP to deploy forward. If they get turn one, they can deploy pre game, move, charge, with little counter play.

[Ishagu]

They're close enough for me to circumvent, that's what I mean.

[Daigo Cannon]

Can anyone tell me the changes to honor guard? I was just about to build my Suzerain from 30k to field them as honor guard with Rob and Marneus.

Edited July 26, 2017 by Daigo Cannon

[Toxichobbit]

 

Are you sure about this? While I thought of doing the same for friendly games, I was not sure if it really is "legal".

 

 

100% sure. Here's some quotes to back it up.

 

"I just bought Indes: Imperium 1 – what should I do with it?

*snip*

You’ll also need it for using some of the more unusual models such as the 30th Anniversary Space Marine, the Legion of the Damned and the Terminus Ultra Land Raider."

 

"There are a few options that are missing in the codex that appear in the index: why is that? Does that mean I can’t use these models in my army anymore?

While the indexes are designed to cover a long history of miniatures, the codexes are designed to give you rules for the current Warhammer 40,000 range. There are a few options in the indexes for some Characters and vehicles that are no longer represented in the Citadel range – certain Dreadnought weapons that don’t come in the box, or some characters on bikes, for example. Don’t worry though, you can still use all of these in your games if you have these older models. In these instances, use the datasheet from the index, and the most recent points published for that model and its weapons (currently, also in the index). They still gain all the army wide-bonuses for things like Chapter Tactics and can use Space Marines Stratagems and the like, so such venerable heroes still fit right in with the rest of your army."

 

"Can I combine units from the index and a codex into one army?

The datasheets in the new codexes overwrite the same datasheets in the index books. You can certainly use units with updated datasheets alongside units from the index that have yet to be updated. Once a unit has been covered in the codex though, we assume you’re using the latest version."

 

"Can I choose to use the rules and/or points for units from my index instead of the new ones in the codex once released?

In your own games, if you and your opponent agree, you can, of course, play with whatever rules you like. In all future publications and official events though, it will be assumed that you’re using the most recent rules and Datasheets. It will also be assumed that you’re using the most up to date points for matched play, in this case, those included in the codex."

 

 

From this article.

 

I know that all seems a bit contradictory and there's some people elsewhere arguing that the last two quotes mean you can't use anything that has an updated profile in the Codex. However, the important bit to take note of is the example in the second quote that lists Dreadnaught weapon options that arn't in the box (we all know they're talking about twin autocannons) as something you should use the Index rules to represent. Taken as a whole, this Q&A clearly demonstrates that they intend for players to use the Index in any case where a new datasheet has not been published (Imperial Space Marine, Terminus Ultra, various characters on bikes etc) and in any case where weapon options for a datasheet that is in the Codex (Dreadnought, Honour Guard, Techmarine etc) aren't represented in the Codex.

 

It could have been written more clearly, but as long as you don't cherry pick certain parts of the Q&A to support your stance (like people elsewhere on these forums are doing) and instead consider everything that they wrote, it's clear that the only way this works without GW contradicting themselves multiple times in the same article is if they intend for you to use all the datasheets and options that are in the Codex and use the Index for any datasheets and options not in the Codex.

 

Edit to remove quote pyramid.

Edited July 26, 2017 by Toxichobbit

[Freman Bloodglaive]

Pretty much. Given that Forge World makes the tasty autocannons, and any they sell is profit for GW, it's unlikely that GW would shoot themselves in the foot by removing them from the game. Rather, as they say, they focus on what's available in the current range, and leave anything that relies on non-box support to the Indexes.