Chaos Space Marines

[ChaosReigns]

Hey guys,

 

So looking through the Chaos Index it seems as though all of the Cult Marines are pretty strong. Certainly Noise Marines, Rubric Marines and Khorne Berzerkers seem much improved from 7th edition. The humble Chaos Space Marine really hasn't changed too much, however, which leaves them in a bit of a tough spot by comparison - although of course they are significantly cheaper than their Cult counterparts. It's not that they're bad per se, after all, they're virtually identical to Tactical Marines now apart from ATSKNF. I've just found them honestly unremarkable and pretty much outclassed by Chosen and Havocs now that it's possible to field detachments where the required choices are Elites or Heavy Support rather than Troops.

 

How are you guys kitting out your squads of basic Chaos Space Marines? What do you use them for? Large squads or MSU to mitigate morale issues? Has anyone found fielding huge blobs of Chaos Marines effective when using Power Level, since the squad gets cheaper per man the larger it is? Are the Undivided Legionnaires among us simply better off filling out their Troop selections with Cultists if they wish to field a battalion and then moving on to the more interesting stuff from there? In short, what does the Chaos community as a whole think of Chaos Space Marines, and their role, if any, within the army?

Edited July 7, 2017 by ChaosReigns

[Lord Asvaldir]

I think once we have our codex and we have our own faction specific stratagems, it will be more rewarding to use the battalion detachment and get those 3CPs opposed to the elite or heavy support oriented detachment which only gives you one. In that case it will be worth taking normal marines. 

 

I haven't really played much 8th, but the few games I did I used the same old squads of chaos marines I did last edition-ten man squads with 2 plasma guns. Given how expensive rhinos are I had them footslog, which isn't great I suppose. In the future I think I'd add a power axe on the sarge considering how cheap they are now. 

[Filkarion]

I'm really found of 5 men lascannon/cheap heavy bolter squads

 

the first one is usefull now that with re-rolls you can make that important single shot count

 

the second is a cheap and useful troop slot, for not so much more than cultist you get very good long range support unit that is not made of paper and can withstand melee

[Iron Father Ferrum]

I think a mix of Cultists and Marines is the best option for Troops.  Cultists will get you numbers, sure, and those numbers in turn create area denial to block deep strike landing zones as well as provide warm bodies to hold objectives.  But the Cultists are also low on both the durability and lethality scales; they're useful, sure, but they're not going to kill a lot thanks to the middling combat skills and aren't going to stick around very long due to low Ld and poopy save.

 

That's where the humble Chaos Marine comes into play.  They're still fairly cheap with the standard 3+ save and come with your choice of either a ranged presence in the form of the bolter and special/heavy weapons, or the now-excellent chainsword.  You can effectively multi-role a squad by equipping two weapons of your choice -- say, plasma guns or missile launchers -- and giving everyone else chainswords to provide a melee threat should circumstances require it.  And yes, take a closer look at the entry: you can take two heavy weapons in a single squad at 10+ men.  We've never been able to do that before; specials, yes, but never heavies.  So while Cultists provide area denial, Chaos Marines can provide a stiffer, more lethal backbone to your Cultists for when the enemy gets close.

 

On the attack, Chaos Marines' inexpense compared to our more aggressive-minded squads allows us to provide numbers to back up smaller, more elite, forward elements.  For example, Chosen, Raptors, Terminators, Warp Talons, and Berzerkers are all squad types that typically are going to launch across the mid-field to assault enemy positions.  However, all these units types are also fairly expensive in points, so generally speaking they'll be outnumbered at the point of contact.  The humble Chaos Marine can help make up the numbers shortfall because they also can be equipped for close combat and sent forward with your CC specialists to provide extra bodies and extra attacks without biting as deeply into your points as much as additional squads of specialists would.  If you attempt to do the same with Cultists, they can provide the numbers but they can't provide the quality of attacks.  Cultists also need large squads to remain combat effective due to the fact that they die when you look at them sideways, and unless you go to Forge World the largest transport capacity we have in-faction is 10 models, so it's difficult to get a large enough squad far enough up-field to provide support to your CC specialists.  You could Warp Time them but honestly?  You should be Warp Timing the specialists.

[WarriorFish]

My small game experience has shown that a larger squad with BP/CCWs hit quite hard - add in a Lord for his re-rolls and own combat prowess and they're pretty choppy. Double special weapon (or perhaps plasma pistol?) fits for obvious reasons. I've also had a 10 Marine poor man's Havoc squad with a couple of heavies and bolters and they did ok, but at lower points it was always going to be about the big stabby squad o'doom.

 

If you're messing around with some of the Detachments (e.g. Heavy Support bonanza) then they'd be better off more focused to perhaps a small squad like Filkarion's or a larger squad for combat duties - someone's going to need to keep the heat off your Havocs so they can keep shooting so you may as well do something with it too.