Reavers vs tactical squad

[sedobren]

Hello guys, as a proud sons of horus player i've been thinking a lot about how field my army using the most out of our uniqe units!

 

The question here is simple: how do you think a unit of reavers compare to a standard tactical squad? Both are very typical of the xvi legion (horus really loves the tacticals!).

 

This is how i would equip both units, so to have something to discuss on:

 

Tactical: 20-man strong, additional weapon added, vexilla, artificer and fist on sarge its 300 pts

 

Reavers: 15-man strong, 14 chainaxes, artificer and fist on sarge, 3x plasma guns (or anyway 3x special weapons), 369 points.

 

So to my opinion the reavers remain almost exclusively cc oriented, despite the possibility to take banestrike bolters the feel way to expensove to me (i mean, that would be 75 points added to the aforementioned unit, making it 349 pts!!)

 

That's why i find really difficult to give up the standard tactical squad, but i'd really like if you have a different angle on the matter!

[Lord Asvaldir]

I'd say generally speaking, reavers are better than tacticals. You can throw in jump packs which makes them far more effective with out a transport, plus with 2a base and chainaxes they are always going to do better in cc. The only advantage of tacticals is more bodies, but that seems like a mediocre bonus to me when you consider 15 reavers with axes will beat 20 tacticals. Only reason I'd take tacticals is if you prefer them for lore reasons or if you want to save some pts for other options.

[Withershadow]

Out of those two choices, the Reavers are the better bet.  Chainaxes are sweet, they have 2 base attacks with assassin's strike, and get another swing if outnumbering.  Add an apothecary and a combat character, and you're looking at a really nice unit to charge out of a Kharybdis.

[sedobren]

In my next game i'll be trying both, in different roles.

One jump packed unit of reavers, with chainaxes and many power weapons/fists, and another on foot, with chainaxes and just one fist, but banestrike bolter. both will have plasma guns (on foot) and meltas (jump ones), both will have chaplains and medics! tacticals will remain in deployement to guard objectives.

 

one last doubt: both units are around 450-60 points, is it too much? despite many years of playing HH, i'm still wary of over expensive units!

[Withershadow]

Yes, it is too much, both of those units are weighed down by bad equipment.  Jump packs aren't bad per-se, but ridiculously expensive compared to the cost of regular jump pack dudes (who can also get an invulnerable save).  Banestrike is raw garbage, and would be a "meh" buff even if it was free.  Then running both on foot seems like a tough sell.  I just see a lot of juicy and expensive targets for Scorpius whirlwinds, deep striking Leviathans, and quad mortars.

[sedobren]

About the jump pack ones, i've found them more efficent than the regular ones (20 assault vs 15 reavers obs) because of the additional attack, widespread chainaxes and the possibility to outflank. also precision strikes allowed me to remove many times power fist guys from enemy units! 15 charging reavers with a jump pack chaplain makes around 75 attacks that wounds on 3+.

 

About the footslogging ones yes, banestrike looks like garbage to me too, i mean a volkite charger would be best, but a that point i would field a tactical support squad, which is cheaper. I still wanna try them out to see if reavers are actually viable without jump packs (i would usually play 8 veterans with weapon master and power weapons in a dreadclaw, with a medic and a chaplain, proven to do thei job).

 

Maybe a light squad armed only with chain axes?

[sedobren]

Also i will eventually buy a kharybdis and another dreadclaw i'd really like to see my army drop from the sky altogheter. But now i only have one dreadclaw!

[Withershadow]

Also i will eventually buy a kharybdis and another dreadclaw i'd really like to see my army drop from the sky altogheter. But now i only have one dreadclaw!

That doesn't work in Age of Darkness.  Null deploy == auto loss in standard missions.

[sedobren]

Aah no obviously not all of it. My goal is to have 3 pods (likely 2 dreads and 1 kharybdis) to drop one contemptor, one veterans/reavers on foot kitted for melee (probably veterans as i was saying before) and the kharybdis for terminators (or justaerins), basically all of the melee units. The rest is gunline and support: tacticals, mortis dreddy, lightning and fire raptor (i know, but i love the model!)

[panascope]

I've been trying to get Reavers to work out for me for over a year, and it just struck me that keeping them simple is almost certainly the best way to go. It's easy to overload them and end up with a troops choice that costs as much as a Knight, but I think that running them as a Despoiler squad with a Power Fist and Artificer Armor on the Chieftain is going to make it easier for them to make their points back. Chainaxes are one of the few upgrades that I think are definitely worth it, getting S5 on all your CC attacks is pretty great.

[Arbarbalus]

I run a black reaving force which means 3 units of these guys are required. Run two 6 man squads with sgt in art /w power weapon & melta bombs, 4 chainaxes, powerfist and a meltagun in rhino with MM. Last squad is 9 man sgt as above with 3 powerfists and chainaxes. Alternate between medics or a contemptor depending on enemy.

I do alot of outflanking! find the chainaxes and powerfists make a good combo and by not being on sgt are harder to pick out once ur in close.

[sedobren]

Any opinion on jump packs? 50 for a whole unit seems nice for me (iirc is 75 for a common despoiler squad) and it works great with outflank (since they can move into cover easier).

 

A 15 man unit with chinaxes just a couple of fists is not that expensive (still close to an imperial knight though, points-wise)

[panascope]

I think they're worth it if you've got 15, but I wouldn't combine them with other upgrades like bolters.

[Theredknight]

Reviving this here.

Looking at getting into the war masters own.

 

Generally, what are revers like on the board?

I was thinking of a reaver attack force, to start in centurion a couple of units of 15 with jump packs, sprinkling with power fists and power weapons. Also the rest can have chainaxes since they are +1 strength now.

 

The models look cool so I was thinking, how best to use them.

Maybe in conjunction with some deep striking justearin?

 

Those who play SOH advice is appreciated!

[Charlo]

You just prompted me to check and they're back in stock, yay!

 

I think the best way to use reavers is maximise thier USPs over the ever top-tier Veterans:

• Jump Packs
• Chainaxes
• Massed Volkite
• Outflank on a fast unit that wants to be in combat

While expensive; a combo of merciless fighters, chain axes, Volkite and fast movements means these guys are very nice at taking out enemy infantry and get a decent bang for buck.

 

Any other use and they're basically very expensive, worse, Veterans.

[Theredknight]

Yes I saw that they are, I was going to go for the strike force but that isn’t there and neither are the bodies..ah well.

 

Basically, they need to be jump packs in units of 15? That’s how I imagined them.

I think units need to be dedicated, so for a collide charger shooty squad, that could be drop pod based? 10 with 2 plasma guns (I think)

Plus jump packs are only 50pts, so the more men you get the better value for money.i find units of 20 a bit hard to move about.

Having deep strike is helpful.

What is really go for as a ‘strike force’ is drop a veteran squad down with nuncio first then DS the other units with them. Ouch..imagine 45+ bodies landing in your face, getting the charge on the next turn. Plus whatever dreads you drop too.

[ProsperoStands]

I have 30 jump pack reavers for my Luna Wolves and I love them. I will admit that if I run my orbital assault I swap them out for Weapon Master vets in drop pods but in any other list I love a unit of 15 with jump packs, toss in a praetor and/or a chaplain and you have a brutal unit. An apothecary is not a bad investment either.

 

The important thing to remember with Reavers is that they are best used to pile into non CQC units. Going toe to toe with dedicated CWC units is dangerous unless you have two or more units ganging up on them. I avoid two wound terminators since even with power fists and axes they will often tank the majority of the wounds you dish out and beat you horribly in CQC.

 

I personally never outflank Reavers as each time I do they suck, then die. Not being able to charge off of the outflank really leaves them in the open IMO. Also remember they can take a dreadclaw drop pod which can be a lot of fun.

[Gorgoff]

Yes I saw that they are, I was going to go for the strike force but that isn’t there and neither are the bodies..ah well.

 

Basically, they need to be jump packs in units of 15? That’s how I imagined them.

I think units need to be dedicated, so for a collide charger shooty squad, that could be drop pod based? 10 with 2 plasma guns (I think)

Plus jump packs are only 50pts, so the more men you get the better value for money.i find units of 20 a bit hard to move about.

Having deep strike is helpful.

What is really go for as a ‘strike force’ is drop a veteran squad down with nuncio first then DS the other units with them. Ouch..imagine 45+ bodies landing in your face, getting the charge on the next turn. Plus whatever dreads you drop too.

A Nuncio Vox only works if it was on the table at the beginning of the players turn.

[Arion]

I have a ten man Reaver squad with jump packs, chainaxes, two fists plus one fist on the Reaver Chieftain with artificer armour. Roughly 300 point squad. They are very scary in CQC and tend to be focused down by my opponent with gunfire. If I can get them "in", they usually wipe out whatever is against them by sheer volume of S5 attacks. I'd say keeping them dedicated to their role (CQC for example) and keeping them cheap is the way to go. I'm not even sure the three fists I have in there make any sense but I'm always paranoid I will have to use them as improvised anti-armour for x or y reason. Did anyone ever use them with banestrike shells or volkites? I never did, seemed expensive but I'm interested in feedback.