Molech: Why ONLY Horus used the Warp Portal?

[Moonreaper666]

It seems strange to me that only Warmaster Horus entered the Portal on Molech and gained the supernatural powers that put him on the same level as the God-Emperor

 

(And no, the God-Emperor isn't going to hold back in their duel. At least not for the reason of Horus being the son he loved the most)

 

 

So WHY didn't the other Traitor Primarchs/Traitor Leaders and the Chaos Space Marines/Chaos Skitarii/Traitor Imperial Army use the portal as well?

 

 

If it's a matter of loyalty and control, then the Warmaster would just limit it to several groups/individuals:

 

-Mortarion, Alpharius and Perturabo

-Sons of Horus and Death Guard

-Leaders of the Dark Mechanicum (Psyker Chaos Magos!)

-Cultists (Even if one in a thousand only survive, that one Empowered Cultist can take on a Custodes Terminator and win)

[bluntblade]

We don't know the second point is true. There's a good case for the Emperor's words in MoM not necessarily being gospel - just ask AD-B.

[The Unseen]

Umm... Because Horus had to prove himself 'worthy' to all of the chaos gods? And according to him, it took him what felt like an eternity of tasks, warfare, and strife. The whole point was he was the only one who could have survived doing so.

[m_r_parker]

Umm... Because Horus had to prove himself 'worthy' to all of the chaos gods? And according to him, it took him what felt like an eternity of tasks, warfare, and strife. The whole point was he was the only one who could have survived doing so.

 

And in all fairness, the only account of what happened during Horus' time within the portal comes from ... Horus. You can either believe what he says at face value, that he was the only one who could face the challenges on the other side and gain the favour of the gods, or that perhaps he had other reasons for not wanting others to pass through. Even if others didn't come back with the same level of power / favour as Horus, what if other Primarchs came back with an increased level of power? What if Mortarion had entered, and came back with the favour of Nurgle (who would eventually become his patron), would Mortarion still be faithful to Horus? Or would Mortarion perhaps start to work towards Nurgle's plan instead? If enough of the Primarchs, high ranking Astartes commanders, and other commanders started to pass through the portal - they wouldn't all come back super-powered and ready to fight at the Warmaster's side. Some wouldn't come back, some would seek to splinter off and follow their own glory, and would leave Horus with a more fractured force, if with some more slightly powerful leaders.

 

Ultimately, as it is always said, power corrupts. Those with power guard it jealously, as those without it covet it. The traitors alliance is fragile at best, and could be argued that it is held together by the power within Horus, and he is not oblivious to this fact. If those who have knelt before him also gained power then would they still follow him, could they even usurp him? With power comes paranoia, so better to keep the power to yourself and demand fealty rather than to give it away and find yourself with none left. 

 

Remember, the onset of Horus' fall from grace was the stoking of many aspects of his temperament by the chaos gods. They played up his ego, and on his fears. The last thing he would want to see is another come along and replace him at the head of the alliance he had built, and take the role he had been promised, so he ensured it would never happen by keeping the power to himself. 

[Moonreaper666]

Then ANOTHER question arises from this situation

 

Why hasn't anybody else entered the portal AFTER HORUS' DEATH? (Or at least right before the Invasion of the Solar System)

 

-Keep in mind that after the Siege of Terra the Great Scouring has begun

 

-Molech isn't retaken until a few years into the GS

 

-With the exceptions of Omegon and Curze, the other Traitor Primarchs will use that Portal after Terra

 

-Plenty of Chaos (and other Rebel) Commanders would have attempted to make it to Molech for that power

 

-Countless Cults and Mutant Hordes would enter the Warp Portal en masse

 

 

 

 

 

 

Another question. Why didn't Alpharius (The twin that believes in the CABAL's prophecy) use the portal in secret? Send his Legion in disguise?

[Caboosegg]

until its reconned at the final battle, the big E holds backs vs Horus. it may poyentially be reconned to add to the whole everything in the balance feeling. but currently a crippled beat up Big E defeats horus pretty easily once he see his favourite son can no longer be saved :)

[apologist]

It's clear that symbols are important to the ways of the warp. To approach the portal of Molech with a rational mindset is to miss its underlying ritualistic nature – and so perhaps it wouldn't work?

 

The background is riddled with hints about belief being important to the success of warp rituals. Things like daemons only being visible to the human eye (i.e. not bionics), and stone atheme and fire being more effective weapons than boltguns in Know No Fear are examples.

 

This theme is taken up in some of the short stories and novels; as Malcador gathers items of human cultural significance for a 'spiritual war' – which is writ large in Master of Mankind.

Edited July 24, 2017 by Apologist

[Sandlemad]

Then ANOTHER question arises from this situation

 

Why hasn't anybody else entered the portal AFTER HORUS' DEATH? (Or at least right before the Invasion of the Solar System)

 

-Keep in mind that after the Siege of Terra the Great Scouring has begun

 

-Molech isn't retaken until a few years into the GS

 

-With the exceptions of Omegon and Curze, the other Traitor Primarchs will use that Portal after Terra

 

-Plenty of Chaos (and other Rebel) Commanders would have attempted to make it to Molech for that power

 

-Countless Cults and Mutant Hordes would enter the Warp Portal en masse

 

 

Another question. Why didn't Alpharius (The twin that believes in the CABAL's prophecy) use the portal in secret? Send his Legion in disguise?

 

It's not like it's a portal that gives you Dragonball Z style power level boost, it's a gateway directly into the realm of chaos. Not the eye of terror, not a daemon world or region of crossover, the warp itself. The 'place' with infinite armies of daemons and impossible landscapes and the very real presence of the gods of chaos. The Emperor entered and (presumably) negotiated or cheated powers from the gods. Horus entered and proved himself to all the gods by directly taking part in the Great Game and leading daemonic legions for decades.

 

You don't just walk in and get new powers, you walk in and get a direct line to your patrons. For your average mortal cult member or even a more aware traitor marine, you are going to get devoured immediately, like someone standing on a ship's hull when its gellar field fails. To anyone watching from outside the portal, you probably just disappear. Maybe some horrible inside-out thing crawls out and gets a bolt to the head, if it's lucky.

 

Horus was already the chosen of chaos, or at least on the track. He entered not just because of his own desires and goals but because it's what all four gods were steering him towards, as their grandest pawn, as a vessel bloated with the power of the warp, one fit to throw the galaxy into war. What he experienced on the other side of the portal was a test but it was also something he had essentially been invited to, a logical step in the path the gods had been leading him down.

There are mortals who could do the same, eventually, but only a few - Abaddon* and the handful of his early competitors - and I would suggest none in the early days after the heresy. The usual run of mortals or traitor marines are absolutely not going to cut it and anyone already devoted to one god isn't going to work.

 

Primarchs though. Half the traitor primarchs are already daemons by the time of the scouring, and Fulgrim and Magnus certainly seem to have no trouble stepping between the warp and realspace. They have, in a sense, already bought into a bargain with their respective gods so there's no personal benefit and their patrons are never going to agree on them. Lorgar too seems to have had his own path to walk; as John the Baptist, not the messiah, maybe? Omegon and Kurze are right out, as you spotted, for lack of interest and/or insanity. That just leaves Perturabo, who to my mind is too spiteful to have Horus' grand ambition and too bitter/cynical to be lured in the same way as Horus.

 

Regardless, the portal on Molech wasn't something there for the taking (unless you're the Emperor), it was used as part of the gods' plan. I don't think there's anyone you wouldn't very quickly suffer an unrecorded destruction attempting to take in the decades between Terra and its likely exterminatus during the Scouring. But who knows, we haven't seen the end yet.

 

* Obviously Abaddon not interested in this path to power. 'Horus was a fool', etc.

[Calas Typhon]

At the time during Molech, Perturabo was MIA, it was more than likely he was dealing with the Chaos Gods already at that point in pursuit of Fulgrim. So by the time he hears of Molech, he has more than likely already communicated with the gods. That is if his appearance coming out of the warp and reasons for abusing Tallarn are anything to go by.

 

Mortarion was already claimed by Nurgle, more than likely Molech would not work for him and would just speed up his Daemonhood if he would enter at all. He was in his flirting phase of trying out warp mischief and standing alone and "pure"

 

Fulgrim already has his power

 

Magnus was being Magnus 

 

Lorgar already knows whats up

 

Angron I doubt would care too much and the same for Alpharius.

 

Kurze was miles away, he and the bulk of his legion were misothiests, not a chance they would take it willingly. 

[Memento Of Prospero]

It's just that; a portal. Using it accomplishes nothing in particular.

 

Ascension to the warp is done in many different ways, using the portal is not a relevent component of the process.

 

The portal itself has a symbolic value. It makes Horus beleive that he is following in his father's foot steps to greatness above and beyond. In reality, he is duped every step of the way.

Edited July 24, 2017 by Athramar

[bluntblade]

I still prefer to think of it as a big charade by the Chaos Gods that the Emperor used it to get all His power. Especially as it raises the question of how he got to it in time to thump the Void Dragon.

[panascope]

In Vengeful Spirit I believe Mortarion says explicitly that only Horus was the equal of the Emperor.